Question about VS lathes

[Brian Tymchak]

Was over at Woodwerks this morning and the Vortex was standing near a Laguna 18/36. Started looking that machine over a little more closely. Surprised at how rock steady it is. Opened the belt cover to see how substantial the belt is (quite, actually!) and saw that you needed to manually shift the belt to move above 1300 rpm (or 1350, can't rember now). That surprised me as I figured a VS machine didn't need that. I checked a Jet VS lathe next to it and it was the same way. And now that I wonder why I didn't check the Powermatics, I just realized Woodwerks got rid of their PMs that were there for years. Hmm.

So, 2 questions are in my mind.

1. Is this typical for all VS lathes? My little midi is not VS.
2. If this is typical, how often do you more experienced turners actually shift that belt over on the pulley? Or do you do all of your work under 1300 rpm? Seems like 1300 is likely high enough to most all work.

Thanks!

[Sam Force]

My PM3520 is that way, it's easy and quick to change the belt. Normally I keep mine on the higher speed. But will change to low speed if putting on a finish. Depending on what you turn how fast you run the lathe.

[tom lucas]

I think most have two or three ranges set by belt. The belt ranges give you variable torque while still allowing for a broad range of speeds. I think the DC motor units may not need belts as they produce a flatter torque vs speed curve.

[John K Jordan]

Brian,

I have several variable speed lathes. They are as you describe with two ranges. The reason for these two ranges are some types of turning benefit from high speed and the torque is not important. Some types can use more torque and a high speed is not needed (or wanted). Having two ranges offers everything.

For the things I turn leave the lathe at the higher speed range and seldom if ever shift belt to the lower range - when turning thin spindles and small things I often run the speed to maximum, around 3200 rpm. When teaching woodturning to a beginner I often switch to the low speed range because that will give a slower lowest speed. (In fact I usually start with the skew chisel and turning the lathe by hand.) I gradually turn the speed up as they get the idea of things. It is extremely quick to change ranges.

When I sand I turn the speed way down, but even in the high range the lathes will get down to around 100 RPM, plenty slow.

BTW, I would hate to be limited to 1300 RPM for spindle work. Clean finishes off the tool that sometimes require little or no sanding are easier at higher speeds. I even turn small bowls and platters at higher speeds than 1300.

For example, I usually turn these at around 1800-2000 RPM. I get a much better surface off the tool than with a lower speed, especially when cutting "air" on the corners. (At a higher speed the tool and wood has less time to bounce, taking advantage of the inertia of the mass!)

penta_maple_ellis_c_IMG_5435.jpg

Things like this always get full speed in high range: (The finial from holly needed no sanding, thanks in part to the high speed)

collet_finials_larger.jpg cedar_and_ebony2_IMG_7528.jpg

JKJ

Was over at Woodwerks this morning and the Vortex was standing near a Laguna 18/36. Started looking that machine over a little more closely. Surprised at how rock steady it is. Opened the belt cover to see how substantial the belt is (quite, actually!) and saw that you needed to manually shift the belt to move above 1300 rpm (or 1350, can't rember now). That surprised me as I figured a VS machine didn't need that. I checked a Jet VS lathe next to it and it was the same way. And now that I wonder why I didn't check the Powermatics, I just realized Woodwerks got rid of their PMs that were there for years. Hmm.

So, 2 questions are in my mind.

1. Is this typical for all VS lathes? My little midi is not VS.
2. If this is typical, how often do you more experienced turners actually shift that belt over on the pulley? Or do you do all of your work under 1300 rpm? Seems like 1300 is likely high enough to most all work.

Thanks!

[Prashun Patel]

I have the 18-36. My previous vs had multiple positions too. In general I use the slow one for bowls and the high one for spindles.

The revo makes it easy to change the belt. Takes only a few seconds.

[Barry McFadden]

I have had the 18/36 for about 3 years now and turn mostly bowls and vases... I have never changed the belt to the high speed yet.

[Ken Fitzgerald]

My PM is variable speed and I can't remember the last time I moved the belt to change the range.

[Brian Tymchak]

Thanks to all for responding. As you can tell, I'm on the turning learning curve. I really appreciate the advice on turning speeds. And I think I may look at that lathe a little more closely and maybe jump on it when it goes on sale. I have some 14" platter blanks just waiting on a machine with a large enough swing.

John, that square platter is amazing. Where did you find that large blank with such uniform and dense figure?

[roger wiegand]

My lathe has the usual two speeds with a VFD for variation. I seldom want to go faster than 3000, but would actually appreciate a "lower gear" that would provide more torque for heavy roughing and coring. I'm not sure the belt would succeed in transferring the power though. For small spindle work I'm often running at top speed.

[Pat Scott]

When turning bowls I use the low speed range, when turning spindles I use the high speed range.

[John K Jordan]

John, that square platter is amazing. Where did you find that large blank with such uniform and dense figure?

Thanks.

That particular piece of wood came from a good friend Ellis who runs another woodturning forum. It is incredible and I've been looking for another with such figure since. I've also made them from a variety of other woods, mahogany, olive, ambrosia maple, walnut, sugar maple, goncolo alves, and more. I recently got a large board of 8/4 bubinga so I'll make one from that. I may do one from cocobolo too, maybe black limba, white oak, and some other woods I have on hand.

I don't often make multiples of something, but after the first one got so much attention I started making more for gifts then was asked to do demonstrations in a number of turning clubs. In fact, one friend asked me if I minded him doing demos on these in his part of the country so I have ho idea in how many clubs this has been presented! As he gave them my name and contact info out in the meetings I've gotten feed back and photos from a number of people showing what they made!

They are actually not very large - about 7 to 10" across. Once I was satisfied with the design I drew out templates with long a compass to make radii on the sides then cut out the templates from plexiglass to easily position to make it fit on the board, fit the figure and defects, then trace the outline. Cut the outline on the bandsaw, run the blanks through the drum sander to flatten if needed, then use a disk sander to smooth the rounded edges. As for size, I find people like things this size better than larger platters and bowls since they don't take up so much space in their house, fit nicely on a table, etc. In fact, I had some on display at a woodturning symposium and I heard one woman telling another "I wish my husband would make something like that, something I can use. All he ever makes is big bowls, bowls, bowls.." Ha!

Some have told me they use them for cookies and candy, some for wallets and keys and such.

I can provide more detail if you want to try one - send me an email. I start with 8/4 boards, sometimes 6/4 and once 10/4.

Making these can take a bit of care if not used to turning "air" but they are not all that difficult. In fact, one student picked this project as her first real project after a few lessons. Of course I was right there to provide advice on every step I didn't touch it and she aced it! It was a present for her sister.

Kristina_platter_working_comp.jpg Kristina_platter_finished_comp3.jpg

Some other examples:

Olive
penta_olive_comp_IMG_7459.jpg

Jatoba
penta_jatoba_IMG_7636 - Copy.jpg

English walnut burl
penta_plate_walnut_IMG_46.jpg

Variations in sugar maple
penta_platter_variationIMG_7451.jpg penta_platter_bowl_IMG_7440.jpg

Eastern Red Cedar
penta_platter_cedar_IMG_7434.jpg

I have many others I haven't taken pictures of and most are given away (wedding presents, housewarming gifts, etc.) but you get the idea!

JKJ

[Reed Gray]

My Jet mini lathe has 6 speed ranges. My big lathes have 2 or 3 ranges. As others have said, it depends on what you are turning. For me, mostly I turn bowls. I can turn bowls on the high speed range, but it does not have the torque that the low ranges have. I need that torque for roughing and coring bowls. If I try to do that in high speed range, the lathe bogs down far more easily, so I turn bowls in the low ranges. That being said, I prefer the 3 speed set up. The low range on most 2 speed lathes is too slow for smaller bowls, at least for me, and not enough torque in the high range. Mid range is just right. I think the Oneway lathes are 3 speed, my Vicmark is 3 speed, and I have one of the very early American Beauties that has 3 speeds. They have gone to 2 speed now.

robo hippy

[Thomas Canfield]

I have a 3520B and normally will turn in low speed going to high speed for buffing or spindle work and also a Rikon 70-220VS and normally turn in the mid range for bowls and go to high range for spindle or under 6" work where torque is not as important, and use the low range only for starting larger unbalanced pieces. Torque is the major reason to change from higher to lower range for same speed or run motor at lower speed using the high range.

[Timothy Thorpe Allen]

I guess I'm the odd man out as my lathe only has one pulley, so all speed control is through the VFD, with a range of ~60 to ~2900 -- no belt changing.

[John K Jordan]

I guess I'm the odd man out as my lathe only has one pulley, so all speed control is through the VFD, with a range of ~60 to ~2900 -- no belt changing.

Which lathe?