sneaking up on final size of mitered drawers

[John Strong]

Hi Guys,

I'm currently making a dresser inspired by the one I attached a photo of. The hardwood drawer slides are not going to come all the way to the front, but instead stop half and inch from the face. The drawers are going to be mitered boxes, with no false fronts.

Screen Shot 2020-12-10 at 11.45.27 AM.jpgScreen Shot 2020-12-10 at 11.45.11 AM.jpg

What are peoples thought on spacing between the drawers and the case.. 1/16th? Also looking for advice on the best approach to sneaking up on that size. I'm currently thinking of sneaking up on the front panels for each or the cubbies and then once I hit the right spacing rip the other three sides with the same fence set up. I'm a little afraid that after the glue up, things will shift a bit and need to be sanded down, loosing my target spacing. But on the other hand if I over size the boxes and everything glues up as planned, I can't think of a super easy way to sneak back up on my goal spacing. Simple sanding? hand planning the top 4 edges?

Let me know what you all think, or if you have any tips or tricks for something like this.

Thanks,
John

[Roger Feeley]

John,
That all looks pretty tricky to me. If I had to do it, I think I would build a test cabinet from just plywood and then build some plywood drawers so I can make all my mistakes for cheap. I might even screw (not glue) an extra layer of plywood on the inside at the right and left so I could practice making one drawer and multiple drawers.

[Paul F Franklin]

I'd think about making the drawers first and then make the case to fit.....
1/16 to the sides is probably ok given the long grain, if the piece will always be in conditioned space. I wouldn't go any less. If it will see wide humidity swings that probably isn't enough. I think you'll need more gap above and below the drawers, especially the really tall ones. You could use one of the wood movement calculators to see what movement to expect. If the fronts are flat sawn they will move quite a bit across the grain; 1/4 or rift grain somewhat less.

[John Strong]

I'd think about making the drawers first and then make the case to fit.....

Hi Paul,

I like its a little too late to make the drawers first.. but I'll keep that in mind for next time.

Screen Shot 2020-12-10 at 1.15.32 PM.jpg

Case is rift, and drawers are flat grain. You can see the wood I'm going to rip into 3 pieces for the top drawers.
Screen Shot 2020-12-10 at 1.17.40 PM.jpg

[Warren Lake]

first thing that catches my eye is the notches in the drawer fronts I guess for the drawer runners if I am seeing that correctly. Id pass on that and stop the dadoes and not have that show. It ads zero to the design, its like Madonna wearing her bra over her shirt. I also would have flipped one board in the clamps the other way around you have one cathedral up and one cathedral down, even not strongly pronounced it still shows. Not helping you with your question but those things stand out to me.

[johnny means]

Certain features aren't used in furniture on a regular basis because there is no easy way to do them. This would be one. I call these jobs theoretical jobs, because they need top be built to what they were in theory. I start these jobs with a 1:1 drawing with all the relevant details, then build every piece to lay into my drawing. It helps of you simplify your measurements so that parts all break on easily achieved sizes. I'd use squaring jigs so that every drawer was exactly the same. Batch cut everything, so you never trying to match a previous measurement. Find a way to preserve setups that you may need to come back to.

[John Strong]

Id pass on that and stop the dadoes and not have that show.

Thats the plan.

I also would have flipped one board in the clamps the other way around you have one cathedral up and one cathedral down, even not strongly pronounced it still shows. Not helping you with your question but those things stand out to me.

The bottom board is somewhat between two cathedrals, and the grain pattern was selected in its orientation intentionally.

Thanks for the comments!

[John Strong]

Certain features aren't used in furniture on a regular basis because there is no easy way to do them. This would be one.

Whoops.. But I do have have eveything mocked up In CAD so I'll give the 1:1 drawings a try. Thanks!

John

[Ben Helmich]

Lol!!!!!!!!!!

first thing that catches my eye is the notches in the drawer fronts i guess for the drawer runners if i am seeing that correctly. Id pass on that and stop the dadoes and not have that show. It ads zero to the design, its like madonna wearing her bra over her shirt. I also would have flipped one board in the clamps the other way around you have one cathedral up and one cathedral down, even not strongly pronounced it still shows. Not helping you with your question but those things stand out to me.

[Bruce King]

I think this one does need the case built first as you did. Then plan the drawers to have 3/64 gaps between drawers and sand to fit. The sides of the drawers are easier to plan for 1/16 and obtain it. The pictures you posted look like gaps vary from 1/64 to 3/16.

[Jim Matthews]

I'm not paid to make things for clients as are many of the previous respondents, so take my suggestions "salted".

I use a 1/8" gap between drawers with hardwood.

I measure the constituent pieces inside the cabinet to allow for alignment problems and surface deviations.

If you plan to put a groove in the bottom of each face to house the bottom, measurements can be taken directly.

As suggested earlier - a piece of plywood can become a template for each size. (I no longer trust transferred measurements. )

**
A mitered box might be strong enough, but it needs to be smooth fitting. If the owner must pry the front or jerk it open, the miters will eventually fail.

***
An applied face on the front of the drawers would simplify your design, assembly and fitting.

As it stands, you have precious little clearance in something that needs to move freely.
****
The runners should have some sort of centering action, where gravity is enough to keep things on track.

I like hardwood sliding dovetails with Slippit wax.

John Heisz of "I build it" on YouTube recommends T tracks in drawer slides. His design takes up more lateral space than your layout allows.
*****
If you're intent on using fixed runners inlet into the sides of each drawer, the runners must define a plane across the cabinet interior. Any twist or vertical deviation will cause binding.

A jig to ensure the slots cut into the drawer sides and a companion jig for the runners will be essential.


******
My nightstand project used hardwood drawer runners.
Each runner was matched to a given side, and the orientation observed (they fit best, one way).

I left loads of room to plane the drawer tops and bottoms for clearance.

The runners were installed after leveling the assembled carcasse, fixed at the front and slotted at the rear.

The runners were checked with the same level before installation.

It was a colossal PITA and it's only the two drawers.

One of the drawers glides like a curling stone, the other is "pinched" somewhere along its travel.

Your project has loads more places for things to bind, so rigorous verification of square alignment to a reference surface will be necessary.

https://i.imgur.com/O4sLuqQ.jpg

[Tom Bender]

1. The back portion of the runners serve no purpose and can cause binding. They should only go 2/3 of the way to the back. That allows for some misalignment and movement. Since you have already installed runners all the way to the back and if you have binding you can trim accordingly.

2. If you have to sand or otherwise narrow the drawer front your mitre will expose a bit of the side to the front. If you make the fronts a little thicker than the sides and match the inside corners you will have to trim a bit off the front, protecting the sides.

3. If you make the backs 1/4" lower than the fronts and taper the sides it will give you some room for imperfection and still open smoothly.

4. If you glue plywood bottoms into the drawers they will be more rigid and will stay square, vs old style slip in bottoms.

[John Strong]

1.

3. If you make the backs 1/4" lower than the fronts and taper the sides it will give you some room for imperfection and still open smoothly.

Can you elaborate on this a little bit? Back of the drawers? back of the runners?

[Tom Bender]

Taper the height of the drawer box. Commonly the drawer box is shorter than the front (look at any manufactured kitchen drawer) but if you are making the boxes and fronts the same height there is likelihood for binding.