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Thread: Found new norton washita stones

  1. #1
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    Found new norton washita stones

    They have a limited supply of new norton washita stones so I ordered one. Skinny, 8 x 3 x 1/2, probably meant for one of their sharpening systems, but I wanted to give one a try.

    https://www.sharpeningsupplies.com/N...one-P1880.aspx

    Will let you know if I like it after it arrives but I expect these to just sell out quickly so I figured I would start a post before it arrives. Won't be able to test it until next month.

    Kind of excited. :-)

    Should I expect this to act there same way the older washita stones work? I don't have a lot of experience so I don't really know the difference with the older lilly white, #1, #2, the newer WB6 stones.

    If anyone had experience, would to know how I might expect these to differ.

    I seem to think that lily white is somehow the best followed by #1 then #2, but could not begin to say why I think that or what the difference would be. And clearly this labeling was dropped with the newer stones labeled WB6.

    Enlighten me please.

  2. #2
    Quote Originally Posted by Andrew Pitonyak View Post
    They have a limited supply of new norton washita stones so I ordered one. Skinny, 8 x 3 x 1/2, probably meant for one of their sharpening systems, but I wanted to give one a try.

    https://www.sharpeningsupplies.com/N...one-P1880.aspx

    Will let you know if I like it after it arrives but I expect these to just sell out quickly so I figured I would start a post before it arrives. Won't be able to test it until next month.

    Kind of excited. :-)

    Should I expect this to act there same way the older washita stones work? I don't have a lot of experience so I don't really know the difference with the older lilly white, #1, #2, the newer WB6 stones.

    If anyone had experience, would to know how I might expect these to differ.

    I seem to think that lily white is somehow the best followed by #1 then #2, but could not begin to say why I think that or what the difference would be. And clearly this labeling was dropped with the newer stones labeled WB6.

    Enlighten me please.
    Andrew,

    Thanks for the link. I ordered one and will see how close it is to my Pike Lilly White once in hand.

    ken

  3. #3
    They old ones were sold with grit labels. I think ; fine,medium ,coarse I've never seen a Washita with a pattern like the
    one they show. Let us know how well it works.

  4. #4
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    Andrew, thanks for the information. Got my wallet out and jumped in. There are a few stones sold on ebay claiming to be Washita stones but they seem to be "Made in China."

    jtk
    "A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty."
    - Sir Winston Churchill (1874-1965)

  5. #5
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    Thanks Andrew, I ordered one too. We'll just have to see how well they graded it. Joel from TFWW sold new Lilly Whites for a little while, until Norton stopped production.

    https://toolsforworkingwood.com/store/blog/59

  6. #6
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    Interesting, I’m tempted to try one, but I have 3 nice washitas now, including an 8x3x1 lily white that Joel sold for a while. The linked stone is a very different appearance than any I have. Mine are not as coarse as how that one is described. Will wait for reports from you all!

    Thanks.
    Kevin

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by ken hatch View Post
    Andrew,

    Thanks for the link. I ordered one and will see how close it is to my Pike Lilly White once in hand.

    ken
    I really will appreciate an update and your opinion on it.

  8. #8
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    Washita pictures 1

    I do not know much about the “Washita” stone, so I did some research. I grabbed the book “Oilstones How To Select And Use Them” by Pike. If you want a copy, let me know, it is very old, but converted to a PDF. So, the booklet states the following:


    A carefully-selected Washita stone, sach as the Lily White brand, or a medium grade India are the best general purpose oilstones for all around use.
    Pike lists the most widely used oilstones as Arkansas, Washita, India, and Hindostan. Notice that Arkansas and Washita are listed as separate types. I usually see them listed as an Arkansas stone.


    The Washita and Arkansas stones are quarried in the state of Arkansas, U. S. A., near the celebrated Hot Springs. They are quite similar in general appearance, both being white or nearly so, but the Arkansas is very much harder, more compact, and finer grained than the Washita. There are various qualities of Arkansas and Washita rock, from a perfect, fast-cutting grit to the vitreous, flinty rock that is practically worthless.
    There is an entire section about the Washita. Not sure how much I should include here.

    In the next section, Pike lists "Extra", but then never mention it again, so perhaps they mean that the number one and the number two are considered "extras" because the Lily White is the best. Not really sure.


    There is no oilstone which requires so much experience to select intelligently as the Washita, For it is found in several degrees of hardness and fineness. For ordinary carpenters’ tools, such' as -p1anes, bits, chisels, gouges, etc., a medium-soft, even-grained, fast-cutting Washita should be chosen.

    The Washita stone is supplied in several qualities. The best is the Lily White brand, next in order are
    the Extra, Number One, and Number Two qualities. Each of these qualities is made in all shapes and sizes required for different kinds of tools.
    The Lily White Brand, or quality, is selected from the very best rock, each stone is tested at the factory, and labeled, telling whether it is a Soft, Coarse or a Hard, Fine grit. Every Lily White stone, Whether of coarse or fine grade, is of UNIFORM GRIT THROUGHOUT, free from hard or soft spots, or streaks, and fast cutting. Each stone is perfectly white, carefully finished and bears a guarantee label. The manufacturer warrants each stone to be just as labeled and to give absolute satisfaction; hence neither the dealer nor the mechanic take any risk on this stone, as it will be replaced free of charge if not satisfactory.


    THE. NUMBER ONE QUALITY WASHITA is a well-finished stone, free from cracks, quartz, or notice able imperfections. It is the most largely used brand on account of its lower price, but as there are both hard and soft stones in this grade, and they are not warranted, the stone should be selected by an experienced judge. It is usually better economy to buy the labeled and guaranteed Lily White Brand.


    THE NUMBER Two QUALITY WASHITA is, as its name would imply, a second-quality stone. It usually contains some quartz streaks, “sand holes,” or other imperfections, but always has one or more. serviceable faces, and many very excellent cutting stones can be found in this grade.


    In addition to the above-named grades of Washita stone, there is also the Rosy Red, which is very similar in cutting qualities to the Lily White, except that it is generally a little softer and coarser. This stone is streaked with orange or dull red color, which indicates a soft, porous grit. It is a guaranteed
    brand, and is well adapted for grinding down dull tools or wherever rapid work is required.


    The difference between a hard and soft Washita stone can be told in several ways: first, by the sight, as in a soft stone the minute pores are usually apparent to the eye, and the surface of the stone will have an open, granulated appearance; second, by scratching with a knife blade, as a soft stone can be quite readily scratched on the edges, whereas a hard stone will show very little impression; third, by the sound, holding the stone loosely by one end between the thumb and forefinger and tapping it with a knife, light hammer, or any metal substance; the soft stone will sound dead like wood whereas a hard stone gives for a metallic ring.
    There is much more, but that is enough for now I think. So now I need to try and guess what I am looking at when I find or see a stone. I suppose you can also make guesses based on how the stone looks, so I grabbed a few pictures of some Washita stones.

    It is interesting to me how the different “Washita” stones look so different. This is what the stone looks like in the add for the sharpening supplies Washita. The grain pattern looks like it is quartersawn kind of.


    01_sharpening_supplies_new_washita_WS688-z.jpg


    These are the Lily White Washita stones advertised at Tools For Woodworking, very white, no grain.


    02_tools_for_wood_working_lily_1_1200.jpg


    Next is a No 1 Washita listed on ebay right now. Not Lily white, but closer than the Washita shown at Sharpening Supplies.


    03_no1_washita_ebay.jpg


    Now look at a WB-5 on ebay right now, it looks like the No. 1 above.


    04_wb5_ebay_washita.jpg


    Here is a photo of three random No 1 Washitas from different times (one Pike and two Norton stones). The top stone that is the bottom because it showed the stone coloring better. The top is colored from use.


    05_No1_Washita_photo_1.jpg


    Here is another Norton WB Washita, a WB-6. It looks like the WB-5, no surprise.


    06_wb6_photo.jpg

    So how would I classify the WB washita stones?

    Continued in my next post because I have too many photos.

  9. #9
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    Washita pictures 2

    Continued from the previous post.

    I have no idea what to make of this particular stone labeled as a “Washita”. This has even more coloring than the Sharpening supplies stone shown in my previous post. So are we getting into those "colored" washitas mentioned in the previous post?


    07_Hiram_Smith_Whetstone.jpg


    Here is one from Case.


    08_Case_Washita.jpg


    The “134” from Buck is listed as a Washita I believe. Oddly, it is listed as a “Medium” stone, which surprised me.


    09_buck_washita.jpg


    Finally I get to a few pictures of a Lily White Washita.


    10_lily_white_photo.jpg


    This one is glued into a wooden box.Probably because they only flattened one side. Also, i took a picture from the side because it is "dirty" on the top.


    11_lily_white_photo.jpg


    I guess that Pike even marked Lily White under their name. This one is glued into the box and the label is on the top. There is not a lot of stone sticking up above the wooden box side. This stone is from a museum and it claims to be from the 1800’s. There is a strop glued to the top of the box. Since the stone is glued into the box, how do they expect you to use this with the label on top of the stone? This is just strange!


    12_pike_lily_white_museum.jpg

    And no, I have no idea how any of these stones behave.

  10. #10
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    Welp, this appears to be a rabbit hole I'm better off avoiding altogether.

  11. #11
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    The stone I bought from Smith's, in 1974 or5, as a Washita had those variegated streaks through it. It's not white, but more different shades of Purple. It's a fabulous stone, but worn to almost nothing in the middle now. I ordered one of those too, hoping it is similar to my old one. My stone is not as fine as the Lily whites, but is more of a coarse stone that cuts Really fast.

    Left in photo. Broken ones were broken by a tornado.
    Attached Images Attached Images

  12. #12
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  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tom M King View Post
    The stone I bought from Smith's, in 1974 or5, as a Washita had those variegated streaks through it. It's not white, but more different shades of Purple. It's a fabulous stone, but worn to almost nothing in the middle now. I ordered one of those too, hoping it is similar to my old one. My stone is not as fine as the Lily whites, but is more of a coarse stone that cuts Really fast.

    Left in photo. Broken ones were broken by a tornado.
    Wow, that is VERY dark. That gives me some perspective on color.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rafael Herrera View Post
    This is a great resource, thanks for the link!

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Andrew Pitonyak View Post
    I really will appreciate an update and your opinion on it.
    Andrew,

    Will do once the stone is in hand.

    ken

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