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Israel developed a solar hot water heater that apparently has worked very well in their country. I remember visiting Israel some years ago and wondered what those things were on the roof of every house. They were solar water heaters.
Israel solar water heaters.jpg Solarboiler.jpg
What also surprised me was that there were not more solar electric installations on homes.
Mike
Last edited by Mike Henderson; 11-08-2020 at 12:16 PM.
Go into the world and do well. But more importantly, go into the world and do good.
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Not sure what the issue would be for the tank, surely it's no worse than for a typical gas-fired residential unit. Admittedly, most of the passive systems I've seen around here are for pool heating. Also note that, with the slab foundations used here, the piping is mostly up in the attic anyway. (Can't get that LA County link to come up...so it goes.)Originally Posted by Jim Matthews
You're probably right about the economics of it though. A friend of mine bought a house with a passive system: when it needed repairs, the numbers worked out much better for an electric array even before the various incentives were included.
Yoga class makes me feel like a total stud, mostly because I'm about as flexible as a 2x4.
"Design"? Possibly. "Intelligent"? Sure doesn't look like it from this angle.
We used to be hunter gatherers. Now we're shopper borrowers.
The three most important words in the English language: "Front Towards Enemy".
The world makes a lot more sense when you remember that Butthead was the smart one.
You can never be too rich, too thin, or have too much ammo.
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Are most hot water tanks designated as basement only, strapped to a load bearing wall, preferably the foundation?
Uppa Heyah in the North East, even multiunit apartments are migrating to on demand hot water, to reduce the amount of potential damage when a traditional tank fails on upper floors.
Ground doesn't move much, round here.
https://earthquake.usgs.gov/earthqua...cc4d/executive
The business end of a passive collector holds either a loop of water or transfers heat with antifreeze and stores the heated batch at a high point for gravity feed to the showerhead and laundry.
That puts an additional load on the roof and if the couplings fail, the contents will drain into the structure. A standard Stacy of pipe routings follows a chase, also likely subject to building code.
http://waterheatertimer.org/0-solar-...er-heater.html
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Not sure I've ever seen a hot water tank/heater in a house on anything except the ground floor here, usually in the garage. As far as "basement only" is concerned, I can count on my thumbs the number of basements I've seen since I moved here 45 years ago...come to think of it, both those houses had their water heaters in the garage too.
[EDIT]GF just reminded me of one second-floor apartment she had that had its own water heater. It was a truly pathetic 20-gallon electric unit, located in a lower kitchen cabinet.
Yoga class makes me feel like a total stud, mostly because I'm about as flexible as a 2x4.
"Design"? Possibly. "Intelligent"? Sure doesn't look like it from this angle.
We used to be hunter gatherers. Now we're shopper borrowers.
The three most important words in the English language: "Front Towards Enemy".
The world makes a lot more sense when you remember that Butthead was the smart one.
You can never be too rich, too thin, or have too much ammo.
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It did today. Shouldn't tempt fate:
https://boston.cbslocal.com/2020/11/...ke-november-8/
- After I ask a stranger if I can pet their dog and they say yes, I like to respond, "I'll keep that in mind" and walk off
- It's above my pay grade. Mongo only pawn in game of life.
[OP]
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Even in California we only have big quakes every few decades so Massachusetts certainly is in a seismic area. Only southern most Florida and Texas are not. But hurricane damage can be prevented by the same methods of tieing down everything.
Bil lD
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1755_Cape_Ann_earthquake
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How long does a flashlight last when powered by a solar cell (ie., no storage mechanism)? Light bulb connected to a solar cell. It doesn't run for ever. There is a difference between a solar charged flashlight and a solar power flashlight.
I have seen the equipment and power requirements first hand and in-person required to produce a solar cell and solar panels. There are megawatt vacuum furnaces involved in the production line. 6 months energy ROI. I do not think so. It takes years of production to make enough solar panels to recoup what it takes to make them.
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Sorry, you would be incorrect. I did look at them.
Mileage per charge is not necessarily meaningless. But more correct is misleading as they often compare per change and per tank which result in substanitally different mileage per "fill up" capacities thus bias the GHG calculations. Absolutely, GHG will be less to charge a car that only goes 100 miles on a charge versus a gasoline power car that goes 500 miles on a tank.
GHG per mile driven is an equal basis as the normalizing to equal mileage (1 tank of gas, 2 1/2 Tesla charges, or 5 charges of second place-don't recall brand just noted it was 1/2 of Tesla)
I stopped looking into this as it doesn't fit my work style. Job sites don't have a place to charge thus I would be stranded 1/2 way (or more) from home on the ride home. No, I can't move closer as the job sites change. At $150+ per hour to fix my car, I could not afford to pay some to fix an EV when I can fix my gas powered car for $0.
I will see if I have the links, and they are probably older than 2018. I wonder how many watts it takes to fully charge a Tesla. You could easily calculate the GHG from the required reported numbers from your local electric supplier.
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Ok I'll play your game. How far does an ICE car without a gas tank go? That's just as reasonable a question as how long does a solar flashlight last without a battery. I guess you could make a solar flashlight rather than a solar charged flashlight with a battery but why would you? Seems like you are playing word games.
You may have seen a solar panel manufacturing plant firsthand that doesn't make you an expert on the subject, what are your qualifications to claim the ROI or the time it takes to save the CO2 produced in manufacture of a solar panels is years? I've seen coal fired power plants and worked in the power generation for over 40 years, I can assure you a coal fired power plant never reaches a balance where it saves more CO2 than it took to build the plant. So can we agree the time for solar panels is finite while for coal fired power plants it is infinite?
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If by mileage per charge you mean range then yes range is meaningful but there is no correlation between range and GHG emissions per mile driven. I've never heard anyone compare per charge to per tank when talking about GHG emissions. Range of EV is an issue which means currently an EV is not practical for every case (like yours) but range is primarily affected by battery technology and battery technology is constantly improving as is the availability of charging stations. On the other hand, in an ICE vehicle's GHG emissions is primarily dependent on gas mileage, and realistically current ICE technology is pretty mature and it is unlikely future ICE vehicles will have much better numbers than today.
Maintenance is a separate issue from GHG emissions. Actually, many studies have shown over 5 or 10 years an EV while more expensive to purchase, is less expensive to purchase, maintain and operate than ICE vehicles. I'm curious, what repair can you make on your gas car for $0? Last time I checked, spark plugs, oil, filters, transmission fluid, brake pads etc. still cost money to buy.
Like to see your links, bear in mind the older they are the less relevant they are as technology is constantly improving especially newer technologies like EVs.
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Not sure what correlation you are speaking. Perhaps normalization is a better word. When reviewing the data, I found out it is all they were talking or comparing was GHG emissions per "fill up". Since the range per fillup is grossly different between ICE and EV, the resultant GHG numbers have a substantial slant to them. As I was told in college, "statistics can prove anything, you just have to find out what is be proved". In this case, the GHG emissions reported for the EV was only for 40% of the mileage for the ICE vehicle. It was reported for the charge but the charge was only 40% of the ICE range, so all of the EV GHG emissions numbers needed to be multiplied by at least 2.5.
All of those listed and then some. I just did a timing system rebuild a few weeks back and paid $0 for labor.
We can skip the links, which are likely older than 2018 if we can determine the watt (or kilowatts) required to charge a Tesla from 0 to 100%. From there the GHG can be derived directly from the federally required reported emissions statistics on (my) suppliers website.
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Where are you seeing data that compares GHG per fill up? Please provide a link. By your logic, an ICE car with a small gas tank would have different GHG emissions than one with a large gas tank, even if both cars got the same mpg. Which one would it be bigger or smaller? Where does your 40% number come from? Here's a quote from my earlier link, I can't explain it any better "To compare the climate-changing emissions from electric vehicles to gasoline-powered cars, we analyzed all the emissions from fueling and driving both types of vehicles. For a gasoline car, that means looking at emissions from extracting crude oil from the ground, moving the oil to a refinery, making gasoline and transporting gasoline to filling stations, in addition to combustion emissions from the tailpipe.For electric vehicles, the calculation includes both power plant emissions and emissions from the production of coal, natural gas and other fuels power plants use. Our analysis relies on emissions estimates for gasoline and fuels production from Argonne National Laboratory (using the GREET2019 model) and power plant emissions data released by the US EPA. The data, released in January 2020, tallied the emissions from US power plants during 2018.
When looking at all these factors, driving the average EV is responsible for fewer global warming emissions than the average new gasoline car everywhere in the US. In some parts of the country, driving the average new gasoline car will produce 4 to 7 times the emissions of the average EV. For example, the average EV driven in upstate New York has emissions equal to a (hypothetical) 231 mpg gasoline car. And in California, a gasoline car would need to get 122 mpg to have emissions as low as the average EV."
OK, do your analysis and link your suppliers website, here's the Tesla data you asked for. "In general, battery size varies between approximately 50 KW (standard range Model 3) to 100KW (Model S). No Tesla battery is charged to its full capacity (for technical reasons) but as an estimate, you'll need to use about 50 kW of power to charge a standard range Model 3 battery fully." https://evannex.com/pages/tesla-char...ttery%20fully.
Looking forward to seeing what you come up with.
Contributor
Oh, free labor is not the same as free repairs, most of us also pay for labor these days. Been a long time since I put a wrench on a car, modern cars are way too complicated. As I said earlier, studies show fuel and repair costs for EVs are less than ICE vehicles. When you say timing system, do you mean timing chains, sprockets, gaskets etc. ? Or was it an electronic ignition system? I assume they weren't free.
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Which I quoted, above.
3.6 isn't enough to rattle the good China.
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Have you noticed a trend in FUD like this?
There are appeals to authority, without verification.
There are claims to special knowledge, without citation.
There are anecdotes presented as evidence, without attribution.
How long before the handwriting, "Google is your friend" privatization starts?
Hitchens' razor applies
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