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Thread: Tell me about Natural Gas and new furnace

  1. #61
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    No power and my water doesn't flow anyway...but folks with municipal water/sewer could certainly take advantage of hot water already in a tank type setup until it cools.
    --

    The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Selzer View Post
    Had a replacement hot water tank that needed electricity to run. Supposed to save energy, after replacing the power vent damper twice, each time 4-6 days cold showers. Then it leaked on the floor, I searched hard and found one that doesn't need electric, also went to a 50 gallon tank. Third shower in the morning was cold half way thru with the other tank.
    Minnesota has required the powered vent water heaters on new construction since 2000. I had one in my previous house and in the current house. 12 years in the previous house and six years in this house without any water heater issues. I'm not sure what the point of the blower is. The electric ignition is nice as no gas wasted by pilot light and never a need to relight the pilot light. If power goes out I have no water anyhow due to well.

    My current house had a massive remodel done when I bought it and converted water heater from electric to gas. I ended up with a powered blower water heater so it could vent through the wall through PVC. There was no place to put a metal vent to the roof for a conventional water heater. I prefer the powered blower type anyhow.

    I turned my water heater off for safety reasons while using contact cement and forgot to turn the water heater back on. I still had a normal hot shower the next morning at the normal temperature setting even though the water heater had been off all night. I only remembered it was off when I didn't hear it running after my shower.
    Last edited by Brian Elfert; 10-10-2020 at 7:06 PM.

  3. #63
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    Apr 2017
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    Replaced my water heater last year. No problem finding a piloted 40 gallon unit on the shelf. No electricity needed, but an electronic pilot could be supported with a small UPS. A fan would need a slightly larger one.

  4. #64
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    Nov 2007
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    We have no city water or sewer and power outages were really troubling. I had a Generac whole house natural gas generator installed two years ago and it works great. I was surprised that the installed cost was not too bad.

  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by Larry Frank View Post
    We have no city water or sewer and power outages were really troubling. I had a Generac whole house natural gas generator installed two years ago and it works great. I was surprised that the installed cost was not too bad.
    Same here, Larry. For the same reasons. As far as I'm concerned, it's already paid for itself over the five years it's been in place.
    --

    The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...

  6. #66
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    Derailing the thread a bit, but I also have a whole house generator because I have a well and a septic pump. My generator doesn't work right now because I have a bad gas shutoff valve and the guy who hooked up the gas made it hard to fix.

    I have had my generator four or five years and not a single power outage other than a few momentary blips in power. A friend who is an electrician recommended I just get rid of it since my power is so stable. It seems silly to remove a generator that just needs a minor repair. I also had a whole house generator at my previous house and I had a three day outage once so having power was nice, especially for the A/C.

  7. #67
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    The minute you remove it, the power will drop, Brian. I agree with YOUR point of view...silly to eliminate something like that merely because of a poor plumbing component. You never know when the weather can do something nasty and not having water/septic is a bummer. That was the primary reason we bought ours as I mentioned previously.
    --

    The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...

  8. #68
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    NW Indiana
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    I was very happy with the installation of my generator. It is a very clean looking professional job.

  9. #69
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    Dec 2010
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    South Coastal Massachusetts
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    Late to the party, again.

    After 5 years of faultless operation, we were forced to scrap our generator.

    A new subdivision dropped my Natural gas line pressure below starting requirements for my GE 12kw unit. A larger gas line was suggested (cost to me, $7k).

    Since we already had a transfer switch, we removed the generator and installed a decommissioned EV battery as our backup (7kWh).

    With our furnace, we'll pump and refrigerator running we get about 10 hours of backup power.

    $10,500 total outlay, no moving parts. Silent operation.

    Three outages in 4 years - it just works.

    Mine looks a lot like this one.

    http://www.mtvsolar.com/wp-content/u...7/LGBackup.jpg

  10. #70
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    Feb 2003
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    Quote Originally Posted by Malcolm McLeod View Post
    I think Tom is emphasizing benefits of a traditional 'storage tank' water heater (vs tankless/continuous). Regardless of the heating source, with a storage tank you have 40, 50, 80(?) gallons of hot water. The 'hot' might not last more than 8-10hrs, but February showers are a bit more comfortable while it does.

    Also, some older homes may still have water heaters with a standing pilot, so as long as you have water pressure, you can have hot water. Same with the old in-floor gas heaters, they work off natural convection, so you can stay toasty.
    We replaced the original water heater with a new one about 10 years ago. It has a pilot light and I see that as an advantage in the event of an extended power outage during cold weather.

  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Matthews View Post
    Late to the party, again.

    After 5 years of faultless operation, we were forced to scrap our generator.

    A new subdivision dropped my Natural gas line pressure below starting requirements for my GE 12kw unit. A larger gas line was suggested (cost to me, $7k).
    Seems to me that this should be the gas supplier's problem if their service suddenly degraded. You didn't add anything new here that increased your demand...

    While it's great you were able to move to the battery system, that $10K you put out for that was more than I paid for my 22K generator including installation, etc. And it will run for days if necessary. (and it's necessary here because no power means no water and no septic, not to mention all the other things that use electricity)
    --

    The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...

  12. #72
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    Dec 2010
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Becker View Post
    Seems to me that this should be the gas supplier's problem if their service suddenly degraded. You didn't add anything new here that increased your demand...
    That was my first, unenforceable choice.

    They suggested escalating my complaint to Beacon Hill. Since my family wuzznt here to waive goodbye to the Mayflower...

  13. #73
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    Mar 2014
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    Iowa USA
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    Standby generators can be switched over to propane or gasoline.

    Not a lot is saved by removing the pilot light on a water heater, as the heat from the pilot flame goes to heat the water

    Replace a 40 year old oil with gas is a no brainer. It will pay for itself in just a couple years.

    Heat pumps have changed. Here in Iowa when I worked on them back in the 70s and 80s they were terrible. I replaced the old gas furnace on my 4 seasons back porch with a ultra high efficiency mini split heat pump. Wow dropped our gas and electric bill to unbelievable levels and its comfortable unlike the old ones!!

    Oh I worked in the commercial and industrial HVAC/R field for over 30 years...
    Last edited by Bill George; 10-22-2020 at 3:38 PM.
    Retired Guy- Central Iowa.HVAC/R , Cloudray Galvo Fiber , -Windows 10

  14. #74
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    Oct 2006
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Becker View Post
    The minute you remove it, the power will drop, Brian. I agree with YOUR point of view...silly to eliminate something like that merely because of a poor plumbing component. You never know when the weather can do something nasty and not having water/septic is a bummer. That was the primary reason we bought ours as I mentioned previously.
    My electrician friend claims my generator install is against code and I should remove it due to that and the fact I haven't had a power outage since I installed it four or five years. He says it is too close to the house for code even though I checked code on required clearances before install and it passed inspection. His reasoning has nothing to do with the bad gas valve. I have the valve, but I need to take the plumbing all apart to install the valve.

  15. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian Elfert View Post
    My electrician friend claims my generator install is against code and I should remove it due to that and the fact I haven't had a power outage since I installed it four or five years. He says it is too close to the house for code even though I checked code on required clearances before install and it passed inspection. His reasoning has nothing to do with the bad gas valve. I have the valve, but I need to take the plumbing all apart to install the valve.
    Mine is close to the house...it's about a foot and a half from the wall on the 250 year old stone portion of our home. It was installed after a permit was pulled and the location approved by the township. The required electrical inspection was also completed to close out the permit with the township. It sounds like you also had a permit, so I would say that your friend is, um...mistaken.
    --

    The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...

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