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Thread: Drill Press: How much run-out is too much? Diagnosis? Treatment?

  1. #1
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    Drill Press: How much run-out is too much? Diagnosis? Treatment?

    My Delta drill press has never gotten rough handling, but run-out seems to be a problem. Most noticeable when I need a Forstner hole in a particular place, the wobble transmits to the project. Sometimes the hole edges look sloppy.

    In the attached photo, the quill is extended after I removed, cleaned and re-seated the Morse taper. The painted steel rod in the chuck came from the manufacturer to set-up and check run-out. I measured run out at four places:

    A - Receiver for the Morse taper (part of the quill, I guess): 1/1000
    B - Top ring of the Jacobs chuck: 10/1000
    C - Bottom cylinder of the Jacobs chuck: 3/1000
    D - End of the test rod: 9/1000

    I know woodwork isn't as precise as metalwork, and I don't know whether my expectations are fair, but 9/1000 seems a lot when it's rattling the project piece around. I also don't know how to understand the small run-out at C, with large run-out at B and D.
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  2. #2
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    If you have minimal runout at the quill, it is likely that your chuck could be the issue. All your other readings could be a result of a “less precise” Jacobs chuck. One othe place to take a reading is, with the chuck removed, the taper inside your quill. If that is good, and you still have high numbers after reseating your chuck, a new chuck can be your solution.

    I had significant runout on my Nova Voyager drill press prior to replacing the supplied chuck with an Albrecht keyless chuck. With the new chuck installed, my measured runout, on a bit installed in the chuck, was essentially unmeasurable with my test equipment which reads in .001 increments. (My dial indicator needle didn’t move when rotating the chuck with a bit installed)

    You may not need to invest in something as pricey as the Albrecht as there appear to be other chucks for less money that can also be highly precise. You just need to check out whatever you get, however, to ensure it has minimal runout. A search here will provide some of those other names.

    Good luck.

    Clint
    Last edited by Clint Baxter; 09-17-2020 at 8:46 AM.

  3. #3
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    There can be runout in your test rod as well. The drill blank I got from Grainger (I think) was speced to be +/- 0.002 inches. The best result I got with my new Voyager after reseating arbor and chuck several times is 0.007. So, with the drill rod, 0.005 - 0.009. Not as good as I expected when I bought the Voyager and about the same as I got from my old benchtop DP. Haven't decided if it's worth upgrading the chuck, but I would like a keyless.
    Brian

    "Any intelligent fool can make things bigger or more complicated...it takes a touch of genius and a lot of courage to move in the opposite direction." - E.F. Schumacher

  4. #4
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    I’ve bought used Albrecht chucks and rebuilt them. Albrecht and Rohm are good.

    Both replace frustration and concern with pride and confidence.
    Bumbling forward into the unknown.

  5. #5
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    Nov 2016
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    I have a 17" Jet drill press. I took it apart, replaced most of the bearings, and replaced the chuck with a Grizzly chuck. I replaced the belts with link belts. Vibration is almost zero at the drill point, and run out is minimal. There are some YouTube videos about drilling and tapping the head, then adding a brass screw (with a rounded end or with a ball bearing end). You can then tweak any slop in the quill which would reduce run out. I bought the screws to do that, but didn't because the other things I did seemed sufficient. Good luck!

  6. #6
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    Thanks for the replies...I’ve looked online at Albrecht and Rohm. Prices were $420 to $580 for (what seemed to be) the same chuck.

    McMaster-Carr has Albrecht’s CP 130-3MT for $420. Its max bit is 1/2”, but I’ve never needed 5/8”. Am I missing a feature or a price I should have noticed?

  7. #7
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    A is good, B and C are meaningless, D is way to big. Are you tightening with all three holes?
    I would remove the chuck and arbor and reseat 4 times it into the quill about 90 degrees apart and measure each time for runout. Then rotate a little between the best two spots and narrow it down to the best spot.
    If that fails I would do the same at both ends of the arbor.
    Bil lD

  8. #8
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    If it helps, on Lowes/Porter Cable DP that I have:

    Top ring of the Jacobs chuck: 7/1000

  9. #9
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    I typically see 0.003" to 0.006" TIR with my drill presses. This is measured at a precision pin installed into the chuck jaws. This is mostly from the chuck, not the quill taper. I do have one drill press (Grizzly) that has no measurable run out (ie. under 0.0005"), but this is with a high quality chuck mounted on an R8 arbor (think Bridgeport R8 collets).
    David

  10. #10
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    Bill D: yep, I tightened all 3 holes. A lot of us made that mistake early on.

    Several replies convince me that run out is commonly worse than what Delta said was ‘expected’ (4/1000). Mine is worse than that, and a better chuck makes sense.

    I’m a serious home hobby guy; fussy but not high volume. Spending a lot of money is not a goal, but spending anything and resenting what I got is worse. Would appreciate opinions on chucks, especially model numbers (Albrecht’s choices are huge).

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by David Kenagy View Post
    Bill D: yep, I tightened all 3 holes. A lot of us made that mistake early on.

    Several replies convince me that run out is commonly worse than what Delta said was ‘expected’ (4/1000). Mine is worse than that, and a better chuck makes sense.

    I’m a serious home hobby guy; fussy but not high volume. Spending a lot of money is not a goal, but spending anything and resenting what I got is worse. Would appreciate opinions on chucks, especially model numbers (Albrecht’s choices are huge).

    Mine is a Supreme. I'll get a photo next time I'm out in the shop and post. By the way, I pretty much use the Albrecht chucks exclusively on me cnc machines and Bridgeport mill.
    David

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Bill Dufour View Post
    A is good, B and C are meaningless, D is way to big. Are you tightening with all three holes?
    I would remove the chuck and arbor and reseat 4 times it into the quill about 90 degrees apart and measure each time for runout. Then rotate a little between the best two spots and narrow it down to the best spot.
    If that fails I would do the same at both ends of the arbor.
    Bil lD
    I would do what Bill says. You need a way to check your drill rod or, buy another one that is know.

  13. #13
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    I have a Nova Voyager DVR and replaced the chuck with a $50 keyless chuck. I measured run out at 0.002'".

  14. #14
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    I have a Delta 17-950. My run out was ~.007-.008 and very noticeable with large forstner bit. I think it occurred after I had been running a 3" holesaw on the press to cut "rosewood". That wood was resistant and one of the press's pulleys loosened causing me no end of trouble before I could tighten it adequately. I thought maybe I had bent something or damaged the chuck. The source of the wobble was the fit of the morse taper in the socket of the quill. I removed it with the drift key that comes it with the press and repeatedly drove it into place with upward taps of a rubber mallet until I got a .003 run out, satisfactory for my work. The process was imprecise and I had to do it about a dozen times until I was satisfied. Be sure the chuck jaws are retracted to avoid damage.

  15. #15
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    D should be measured as close to C as possible, avoiding any burrs raised by the jaws. Measuring D as you are you are is also measuring any bend in the test rod which I assume is not a ground certified test rod.
    Bill D

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