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Thread: The chicken and the egg - I need a Saw table to make a torsion box saw table!

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jun 2020
    Location
    Central Wisconsin
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    158

    The chicken and the egg - I need a Saw table to make a torsion box saw table!

    I've been pondering this since joining SMC, and lots of your input has helped me, thanks!

    I’ve always thought it inefficient that people use a track saw to rough cut up sheet goods then cut them on a table saw. I get why they do it, so that the pieces are manageable, but there should be a way to do this on a table and not need the table saw.

    I started this project with some goals.

    1. Create a Torsion box table without using a table saw, miter saw, jointer, planer, or router, just using my tracksaw, drill, parf mark 2, and kreg pocket hole machine.
    2. Make a 50.5”x98.5” top that can make repeatable cuts on 4x8 sheetgoods.
    3. leave about half of the table without dog holes to use as an assembly table.
    4. be able to make 30,60,90,45 cuts accurately and quickly without some kind of miter gauge or expensive 18" triangle thing (like TSO).

    I first used shims, sawhorses and hot glue to perfectly level the saw horses. Then I put down the straightest 2x4s I could find. Laid a 49x97 sheet of mdf ontop. Screwed 2-2x4x10' boards to the edges, then flushcut them to the mdf with a cheap Amazon japanese pull saw. MAN THAT THING WORKS WELL! Finished off the short ends with 2x4x10' cut in half, screwed to the mdf as well.
    I then used a parf mark 2 to drill the first row of dog holes and all the perimeter holes.
    No photos of all this….

    Put the first sheet of Baltic Birch on the table and after cutting the width and length to make perpendicular sides I cut the lateral skeleton pieces.
    1 full sheet dogs.jpg

    Cut the length boards
    2 start of long boards.jpg
    All boards cut
    4, all boards done.jpg

    I then had to figure out the length and width pattern so the boards would miss the 20mm dog holes.
    5 lining up long boards.jpg

    Random photo of me trying to think through how to tackle this.
    6 random dog avoidance.jpg

    I then leveled 2 new sawhorses and cut the straightest 2x6x8' parallel at about 5”, and layed a new sheet of mdf on this.

    After screwing edge boards to the new piece of MDF with pocket holes
    8 kreg.jpg

    I was able to cut the length of the boards the exact length I needed by cutting them slightly long and then using pieces of paper to dial in the right length. I did this with the long and short boards.
    7 shimming the long boards.jpg
    Last edited by Jon Steffen; 08-31-2020 at 12:57 AM.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jun 2020
    Location
    Central Wisconsin
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    158
    I then ganged (I think that’s the right term) all the skeleton width boards together and cut dados into them.
    9 ganging the boards.jpg
    10 dado with tracksaw.jpg

    HOLY COW THIS SUCKED... I need to learn how to do this with a router. SO MUCH SAWDUST and time!!!!
    11 sawdust.jpg

    Need to secure the grid to the bottom skin.
    12 grid done.jpg
    The first sheet of MDF with dog holes is actually just my temporary saw table.

    I'm putting a fancy laminate sheet of mdf as the final top of the torsion box, then building a 1.5" boarder probably with hardwood. Then re-drilling all the 3mm holes and actually drilling all the 20mm dogs that I want. I only did the first row on the temp top.

    So far so good. I'll make a list of things I learned in post 3 of this thread, for now it'll just be temp blank space. I also have a Noden Adjust-A-Bench base I have to build, then install the top onto after the top is built.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jun 2020
    Location
    Central Wisconsin
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    158
    post 3 for Noden bench stuff

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jun 2020
    Location
    Central Wisconsin
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    Observations of Whole Project
    - Mark the cut edges of the plywood
    - make sure you use the cut edges of the plywood as the straight edge reference when you cut parts, DUH....lol
    - don't draw vertical lines across your ganged boards, instead use diagonal lines. Much easier to line up the boards again if you need to.
    - don't worry about making the dados depth perfect, in fact you don't want the two pieces to touch at the dado joint anyways, because if its not perfect, you'll have lumpy points on the torsion skeleton. I wasted a bunch of time making the dado depth very close, then turns out I had to redo all the joints because some were touching too much. just take board width, divide by 2 and add a little bit. That little bit *2 (one for length boards, one for width boards, will create a void at each intersection, but allow all boards to touch mdf perfectly.
    - Its more important to make the dado width accurate. I don't think it needs to be perfect, but i'm not an engineer, and i'm a newb at wood working. I used a mallet and block of wood to gently tap the ganged boards over to slice another hair off the boards, then test fit a small piece of ply into the dado.

    -that's all for now, will add more as I scew up more. HEY, i made a joke. =)
    Last edited by Jon Steffen; 08-31-2020 at 12:52 PM.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jun 2020
    Location
    Central Wisconsin
    Posts
    158
    I bought a Noden Craftsman Package Adjust A Bench, BUT I got the "Low Boy" version (same bench but 4.5" shorter). told by Mr. Noden this is the 2nd one he's sold as its not even on their site yet. YAY! i'm only 5'7" so it will hopefully be useful to have it go even lower when i'm working on something 3' tall.

    These photos aren't all in order.

    I decided to use a propane torch to burn the baltic birch plywood a bit to give it some character.
    20200907_092521.jpg20200906_155122.jpg20200906_155518.jpg

    Instead of making wooden rails with 3/8" threaded rod through it, I decided to use black iron pipe at the 4 corners so that I could hopefully maximize the height of any under bench storage.
    20200907_204403.jpg20200908_175515.jpg20200908_175521.jpg20200908_183837.jpg

    Perfectly level, whew...
    20200908_184047.jpg

    Will have more updates as I make the mounting blocks and get the top put in the next few weeks.
    My garage is such a mess right now with 2-4x8 benches in various states of complete. I'm excited to get them combined and start cleaning up the shop.
    Last edited by Jon Steffen; 09-08-2020 at 11:15 PM.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Sep 2016
    Location
    Modesto, CA, USA
    Posts
    9,876
    I used a hollow core door and ripped it to width. You could rip it with a handsaw no real accuracy needed. I filled the void behind the rip with some glued in solid stock planed to fit.
    Bil; lD

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    Comfort, TX
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    557
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    1
    Curious with the torsion box you are building, will you have a solid top or a Parf System top with 20mm hole? If the latter, how will you clean sawdust from the torsion boxes?
    Tim in Hill Country of Texas

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    SE PA - Central Bucks County
    Posts
    65,675
    That's a very nice project. 'Glad that you went with the Noden setup. I got to test a pre-production version of the Craftsman Hardware Kit from Geoff and I was impressed with it. You will appreciate having that adjustable height for sure. Be sure you get some wide stance feet on there to properly support that larger table. I used some 2" angle iron and dual-locking casters on my auxiliary bench that uses the hardware kit and Geoff's OEM mobility kit on my main bench. (the latter is the original all metal A-a-B) In both cases, they are wide enough to insure nothing will ever tip with a project loaded up top or if I, um...sit...on the edge of the bench.
    --

    The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    Comfort, TX
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    I went back and looked at pics. Its not enclosed on bottom so dust just falls to floor. I am building mine as a TS outfeed table and will have drawers underneath.
    Tim in Hill Country of Texas

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