Martin T-17 F Table Saw

[Patrick Kane]

Over the years, ive followed several threads celebrating the quality of some lesser talked about and owned machines. One of which is the Martin T17 table saw. Really, a thread comparing it to the wadkin PK on this forum along with Mark Hennebury's immaculate restoration of a T17 were my first introductions to the model and what planted the curiosity seed in my mind. They arent very common, and ive never seen a martin product in person, let alone a 40 year old version. Since that point, i periodically looked at the various used markets for a T17. More so out of curiosity than a real intent to ever purchase the machine. Over the years, ive only seen a few. I noticed the saw Jeff Heath ended up purchasing about an hour after the ad went up. Seemed like a good deal at the time, which is why i reached out to the seller. Of course, in hindsight it was a screaming deal and i had no chance of gobbling it up remotely. Since then, there have been 2-3 others ive seen. One was a boneyard find that i started a thread on a year or two ago and didnt pursue after some more experienced members suggested letting that one go. Most likely sage advice. A week ago i finally found one that showed some promise. Cheap, mostly complete, wasnt working(i guessed switch) and most importantly of all, a poor listing created by an older gentleman that gave a chance to a guy like myself that is 6 hours away. As most folks who chase used deals know, the good ones are gone in hours. What would have been a gloat-worthy acquisition soured slightly when some local do-gooder stopped by to buy another tool from the old timer's retirement liquidation a few hours before my carrier picked up the machine. Long story short, the guy messed around with the switch, got the saw to start up and cost me a lot of money by trying to outbid me on the spot. I still consider the purchase to be a very good deal, but $500 for a mostly complete and running T17 would have been something. Unloaded the thing at 2am last night and spent a few minutes looking it over during my WFH lunch break today.

First impressions are its smaller than i had in mind. Its not terribly wide or deep. The saw has to be several inches shorter than my other machines, not that i think that is a bad thing. My PM72 is somewhat awkward to do some operations and setups, because its height(its on 4" blocking for pallet jack purposed) and the blade is pretty far infield from the front of the machine. The slider beam and table arent attached to the saw, so it's hard to get a sense for the feel, but those suckers weigh a lot. The beam itself has to be 200lb, and the table/outrigger are another 100lb+. Last comment i will add from my novice opinion of machines is the internals of this thing are immensely robust. I dont know if a machine needs to be this overbuilt, but its immediately noticeable upon poking my head into the cabinet.

A couple questions for T75 and T17 owners. Is there a resource to date machines? I havent looked under the table top yet, but ive read the date is sometimes cast in the underside of the table. Im guessing my machine is slightly older, because i dont have the emergency stop button in the corner. I also am missing the oil lines/points in the rear right of the machine. This kind of sucks, because reaching the oil points without those lines looks like a PITA. Next, i know a parts diagram doesnt exist, but I want to go through and confirm what i am missing. I know i am missing the crosscut fence/extrusion. This isnt as big of a deal, because i think some people prefer to replace with a contemporary extrusion from Felder/Altendorf etc. Easy fix. For knobs/levers, i think i am missing the elevation wheel handle, Motor cover knob, the rip fence extrusion fore/aft adjustment doesnt seem correct(its a long hexagonal rod), a riving knife(thankfully, i have the lever and bracket in place), and it looks like im missing a reticle for the rip fence.

A full re-build similar to Patrick W's or Mark's or anyone else of far greater mechanical skill is beyond my abilities and not in the cards for this one. The adjustments seem pretty fluid already. I will clean and lube the interior as much as possible without having to remove the top. Following Mark's thread, i do not want to tango with disassembling the top and internals and putting them back together. Id like to polish the top as much as possible(its in typical fair to rough condition), clean and lube everything, repaint the machine, and refurbish the rip fence. The fence slides somewhat smoothly, but it looks like the bearing/pads have worn a slight groove into the table over time. Anyway, enough typing, here are some pics.

[Patrick Kane]

A few more photos to add.

Does anyone know what this cast piece with the knob and hole is? I assume this was used to mount the crosscut fence to the sliding table?

How much wear is typical on the V ways of the sliding beam? My thumbnail is for reference. There is a slight groove worn into the machined cast iron from the bearings. Oddly enough, it looks like the wear is on opposite corners. To explain that better, the top V has a groove on the right side and the lower V has wear on the left side. The seller didnt use this saw for the last few years thinking it was dead(bad switch), and even then he had the sliding table off it and used it primarily as a rip saw for rails/stiles.

Is the saw arbor typically this short? It is 1.25" diameter arbor, but it looks like i can only fit maybe a 5/8"-3/4" wide dado. The rod to lock the saw arbor for changing blades is stupid simple, but it is so nice. I cant believe that isnt a standard feature on every saw over $1000.

[Phillip Mitchell]

Congrats on the saw Patrick. Looks like you have some detective work ahead tracking down missing parts, but I’m sure it will be worth it.

What is the stroke of this particular saw?

Did you find it on Craigslist or some other site?

[Brian Holcombe]

I think rebuilding it would probably be wise, not necessarily a full restoration but replace a bearings and clean/lubricate all parts so it can function properly.

I’d be inclined to drag the top and the outrigger out to Jefferson Ironworks and have the table planed. the outrigger would probably be best repairer by someone who repairs slideways, they can repair the surface and scrape the way accurate.

Address all wear issues and replace all wear items and you’ve got a new saw. Most of the hell of restoration work is the stripping and repainting, which is optional if you just want something nice and functional. As much as I like shiny, it comes secondary to the mechanical stuff.

[Patrick Kane]

I think rebuilding it would probably be wise, not necessarily a full restoration but replace a bearings and clean/lubricate all parts so it can function properly.

I’d be inclined to drag the top and the outrigger out to Jefferson Ironworks and have the table planed. the outrigger would probably be best repairer by someone who repairs slideways, they can repair the surface and scrape the way accurate.

Address all wear issues and replace all wear items and you’ve got a new saw. Most of the hell of restoration work is the stripping and repainting, which is optional if you just want something nice and functional. As much as I like shiny, it comes secondary to the mechanical stuff.

I think the stroke is in the neighborhood of 40-42”. I actually haven’t put the beam on the saw nor slid the outrigger at all! The seller never used the sliding table and he didn’t have it on the saw. It’s also best to move it without the slider on, I read in one of the original manuals that Martin shipped the sliding table detached from the saw.

Brian, yeah, will go to that extent most likely. I just ordered all new bearings for the rip fence and sliding table yesterday. All but one or two were completely frozen. Not too bad, I think $90 to replace 7 bearings on the sliding table and then the two minis for the rip fence. However, what I want to avoid like Covid is taking the top off this thing. After looking at Mark’s rebuild thread, the reassembly process looks like a real bear. For the most part, I think the table is in ok shape. Way too much glue residue on it to make any amount of sense, but the original planer marks are very visible on the majority of the table. The area around the blade has obviously had a lot more wear and the planer marks are hard to see there. I haven’t taken a straight edge to see if it’s dipped there or not. Where is this Jefferson ironworks place? I haven’t ever needed the services of a big planer, but I wouldn’t be surprised if someone was running one nearby. Pittsburgh is abundant with small machine shops with huge machines that they gobbled up from the fall of the industry giants decades ago. Unless this thing is dished .01” I don’t know if I’d go through the hassle of having it planed. Superficially, I would lose the serial on the edge of the table and I think it is kinda cool.

Yes, you are right about the stripping and painting part. I didn’t go as extreme on my
Last machine and that process still sucked. The fact that I won’t be disassembling this saw completely means I’ll have the joys of taping a bunch of stuff prior to spraying. That is most likely months or a year in the future.

Does anyone know of an oil gun for these zerks? Looks like the Bridgeport folks suggest a brand named Alemite or similar for about $100. Are all oil zerks universal?

[Joe Calhoon]

This is the oil press Martin supplies. I would look for something better, these leak if stored laying down. Martin supplies a light hydraulic oil for these.
I think you can get 48” or so on stroke depending on position of fence and beam. They had a optional longer beam.
7D54F7FB-99F3-4E0B-B35B-0915DF275929.jpg

[Patrick Kane]

Joe, you are lucky and your lube points are on the outside. I have to insert myself inside the cabinet to get to all the points. From what I’ve read, you spend $80-100 on the gun and then it leaks like a sieve. They are all awful and expensive somehow.

Did you buy that from Martin directly?

I just measured my beam
And it’s 66” long. The sliding carriage is about 12” long, so it sounds like you should be correct that the stroke is closer to 48”.

[Brian Holcombe]

Probably worth checking the top before having it worked on, I just assume after so many years it is no longer flat. That said, it may not matter all that much if there are slight deviations here or there.

Peter G used Jefferson Iron Works for his 30” Porter jointer and from his inspection they did a very nice job.

https://jeffersonironworks.com/

I had Jefferson quote me for a project and they were very reasonable considering the effort involved, grinding locally was much more expensive.

Daryl Smith, who I think is not far from you, scraped a few straight edges and angle plates for me, I think he would be the man for the outrigger. I would ask his opinion on turcite or similar material to build up the damaged areas then have him scrape it. At that point you’d have a super accurate outrigger.

[Brian Holcombe]

Chris Hall seemed to really love this Oiler:

https://www.jensputzier.com/brands/r...eilang-oilers/

[David Kumm]

I've found most pointed tip oil cans work if you are careful. They need to be lined up just right but you get pretty good at putting more oil inside than outside. Dave

[Patrick Kane]

The price seems great, especially if it doesn’t leak a ton. What is the difference between a single pump and double pump?

https://www.jensputzier.com/reilang-...pump-2781.html

Dave, will that tip work?

[Warren Lake]

can you add onto the lines say with compression fittings to bring your oil holes to the outside? Sort like they do on brake lines I think they have them or if not something better. Or just repipe from the source and drill your machine to locate them on the outside.

[Patrick Kane]

can you add onto the lines say with compression fittings to bring your oil holes to the outside? Sort like they do on brake lines I think they have them or if not something better. Or just repipe from the source and drill your machine to locate them on the outside.

Yes, i think that is a brilliant idea, but i would be at a loss with sourcing the parts and swapping the zerks. I need to look at them closer, but do they simply unscrew? I dont know what the lubrication schedule is, but Im guessing at most its a once a month ordeal, which isnt too awful to crawl into the cabinet to perform. The motor cover is pretty big and i can squeeze myself in to get to most of the internal points. This is the one feature i am very jealous of later model T17 owners. The emergency foot stop doesnt do much for me, but the exterior oiling points would be very convenient to have.

[Tom Bender]

An oiling schedule might look more like once every two years or 200 running hours, whichever comes first.

[Brian Holcombe]

I would think once daily when you are operating it. Using a milling machine I pickup the oil pump lever once every hour or so and the same goes for my woodworking machines. I can't think of a situation in which too much oil has damaged a piece of machinery, but I can think of plenty where the opposite has happened.