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not near me. I’d try a #5 size Stanley or similar. Look at timetestedtools.net. Dan Williol was/is a member here runs the site and sells collectible tools but also a lot of users. I’d see if yo7 like the original blade before going and getting a replacement,Originally Posted by Victor Price Jr
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The rabbit block plane is nice but a specialty item. If you’re looking for a block plane, get just a block first.
[OP]
Member
Done, I'll PM you in a minute.
Contributor
Yes, you will get a lot of opinions, and likely this thread will descend into the same arguments between the same woodworkers over the same things and quoting the same "experts" and internet "gurus"
Based on your list, I can almost guess the some of the videos you have watched. I would caution that there are many ways of doing things and many preferences. I would also say that despite the hype, many acclaimed experts, including ones in glossy magazines, are not that much better than many "unfamous" woodworkers, they just are better at self promotion (I don't include myself in either category, either being that good, or good at self promotion. Though I did have one experience examining a piece of work from a "famous" woodworker, and was pleased to see that his tear out looked exactly like my tear outSchadenfreunde at its best.)
From the perspective of someone who has used planes for 30 odd years, but in combination with power tool woodworking, and who has no desire to work like it is 1699, I would say your list of types is pretty standard for a good compliment of planes. If I was set out into the woods with only 4 planes, a jack, smoother, block, and jointer would be my preference, and likely in that order.
If I didn't have to hand dimension all of my wood, like if I still had a shop and power tools, I would get a block plane first, then a smoother, then a jack, and then a jointer. Especially if I did not have much experience with planes. Not only does this list go from cheapest to most expensive, it also goes in order of skill and utility for someone who still has a complement of power toods.
Nearly every woodworker, regardless of power tool collection, has a block plane. They are useful for so many things, and easy to learn to sharpen and set up. I prefer a standard angle 9 1/2 style to a low angle 60 type, but that is just me. It probably doesn't matter what kind of block plane you get, because you will likely buy more than one; they are that useful.
Next in utility is probably a smoothing plane. It is also a good plane to cut your teeth on learning how to handle a bench plane. They aren't too big and you just need to worry about smoothing, not flattening or keeping an edge 90, those skills are easier to learn once you get the hang of using a plane and sharpening. Myself, I am not a big fan of modern smoothers. When hand tools became popular a while back and companies started making them again, there was this idea that heavier was better, to the point where some planes are like dragging a boat anchor across a piece off wood. Historically planes tended to be on the light side, no one really wants to drag an extra pound of cast iron (and no one ever wanted to drag bronze around) all day long. I much prefer a #4 to a #4 1/2 for most smoothing. It is lighter and easier to use. Also, if you had any questions, there is no issue with handle size. I have hands like a linebacker and have no problems using a #4 or a #3. I prefer a standard Baileys #4 from around WWII to anything currently made, but I have a lot of experience tuning up old planes.
I would agree with Ken on the jack plane; a used #5 is much, much less expensive and more than adequate for anything you would ever use a jack plane for. And they don't weigh as much as new ones. I would also say that the 5 1/2 is only popular with some modern woodworkers. It never had a big historical following. For what a jack plane is traditionally used for, the standard #5 works better. The 5 1/2 became popular as an all around plane, no idea why though; it is too long for smoothing, too heavy for rough flattening, and too short for jointing. I guess it does all of them well enough for some people. I would keep your eye out for a decent used jack plane or two. They are great to learn how to fiddle with planes with, because they are cheap, and no big deal if you mess one up.
The jointer would be the last plane I would worry about picking up. There are so many ways to joint wood without one if you have power tools, and they are really expensive for a hand plane. You can buy a used 6" jointer for the cost of a LN #7. They are handy, but they take a lot of skill to master. By the time you get to that point, you will have a much better idea what you are looking for.
Last edited by Andrew Seemann; 08-14-2020 at 1:22 AM.
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Victor, I have a LN standard BU block plane with an adjustable mouth. The only time I adjust the mouth is to re open it up after it slowly closes down of it's own accord. Mine is the very popular non-rabbeted model (don't remember the number) and it works very well as a general use block plane. However, If I can use a smoother to do the work, I will use it instead of the block plane. My block plane use is definitely used mostly when physical access does not allow a #3 sized plane to be used. I find that a block plane does indeed perform the smoothing tasks very well, but is just not as comfortable to hold as a tote-type or coffin shaped plane. As to finding a smother and jack plane, the large auction web site works. I would be tempted to spend more for the larger joiner or try plane because I feel like those do need to closer to optimal condition to produce the tighter work required.
David
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Maybe a bit of "Show & Tell....before this devolves into the usual "I have (insert brand name) and LOVE it!" sort of thing.
Jointer: Depends on the LENGTH of the board...have used a #3 up to old Heft & Hubris No.8...mainstay?
Show & Tell, Jointer.JPG
A no. 7c..22" long. 2-3/5" wide iron...
Jack plane: Because it is a "Jack" of all trades. Can be a #5-1/4 ( 11" long, 1-3/4" wide iron) up to the Jumbo Jack...I mainly use just a plain old jack..
Show & Tell, Jack.JPG
14" long, 2" wide iron...I have a jack with a cambered iron, another with the straight edge...different jobs, different set up. Some here will try to sell you one of these..
Show & Tell, No. 62, shavings.JPG
This is the first time in almost a year that this has even seen a shaving...
Ok..smoothers? Can be a #3 size, or a #4 size...I use both, depending on what size area I want to smooth out...a #3 can go places that the larger #4 can't..
Show & Tell, smoother.JPG
No. 9 ( size #4)with a 2" wide iron, 9-10" long.
Finally..block plane(s)...can be a low angle, adjustable mouth...
Show & Tell, LA Block.JPG
Or the so-called "Standard Angle" with an adjustable mouth and a screw style adjuster..
Show & Tell, 2 block styles.JPG
Some block plane need a hammer to adjust..save those for peeling paint....
Show & Tell, 2 block, shavings.JPG
These two do a decent job on wood. A #60-1/2, and a Marsh 9-1/2....
I do have a couple #5-1/2 planes...I use those more as a very short jointer, or to get a glued up panel flat. I view a #4-1/2 as mainly a FAT, oversized, overhyped smooth plane-shaped object.
Ok, back to a word from our sponsors....carry on.
Contributor
No personal experience with the rabbet block plane. But I remember being intrigued by it's (supposed / alleged) utility. I decided against it after talking to a L-N guy at one of their road shows. His take was it was more "master-of-none" and less "jack-of-all-trades". He says it's the only L-N plane he never uses, though he might consider it if he was to be limited to only a single plane. His take is you want a real rabbet plane for rabbeting and a real block plane for everything else. His biggest complaint about the rabbet block plane was cutting yourself on the exposed blade corners when you grab it in your palm and wrap your fingers around the sides (as you usually do with a block plane.)
Of course, YMMV.
BTW- I find myself grabbing slightly smaller block planes, e.g. LV apron plane, because they're more comfortable for me for a quick trim here and there, despite their lack of "features" (like adjustable mouth.) I'm no "shining light" you should be emulating, but there is a lot of personal preference about how planes feel. It's hard, especially with so much closed right now, but if you get to a show, a class, or a club where you can actually use some of these options and get a feel for the differences it would make your choice a lot easier.
Barring that, as I "think aloud", your best bet might be getting a premium smoother and using it for everything until you get a feel for likes & dislikes. Then, with a point of reference, you can fill out your collection. (Premium because there are fewer me or the plane issues. Smoother because it is the least able to tolerate the slop you'd have in e..g a old beat Jack plane.)
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I will defer to Andrew on a shop with power tools as I don’t use them — hello 1699. I did want to somewhat explain the choice of the 5 1/2. I started to when I said it is similar to the British panel plane. That form was used, as I understand it, was used as a ‘super smoother’. It would do enough flattening to fine tune that aspect of the board and when set up to take a thou shaving would smooth at the same time. David Charlesworth, who uses a 5 1/2 a lot, shows using it in that way. If you most buy planed boards from your favorite hardwood supplier, then that method works well. Alan Peters, the late British woodworker, used a #7 in much the same way as I understand.
I suggested a #5 since you seemed to indicate you were working on larger furniture types. A second blade and you could rough and smooth with the same plane. However, the same could be done with a #4 (see Paul Sellers). I think a block plane is much more useful in a power shop than in a hand but many devout handtool folks certainly use them.
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Actually, I tend to use my #6 in that panel smoothing role. Since I have a #7 and #8 for jointing, and multiple #5s, my great grandfather's #6 got to be a panel plane. I think he used it more as a light jointer he could carry in a tool box, based on the the blade though.
My block planes get used mostly for chamfering. My favorite one for chamfering is actually one with a messed up bed that causes the blade to be off. The result is that one side protrudes more than the other, so I can go from a narrow to wide shaving just by moving from one side of the blade to the other.
Last edited by Andrew Seemann; 08-13-2020 at 1:40 PM.
Member
Victor,
Try "Time Tested Tools" He sells good user planes.
ken
Member
My $0.02 is along most of the info you got so far. The jointer should be the last one. Watch Craigs list. Not to gloat, but I found 2 Stanley #8 jointers for $25 each. They come up every once in a while. Not often, but they do pop up. If they do, run and grab it. The first one I got the guy says I have someone offering less $ tomorrow, so if you come today, you can have it. Hey Boss, I'm taking some time off.......
I just got a Stanley 5-1/2 back together. Jacks come up all the time on CL. My favorite Jack is actually an old (big sigh) Craftsman for some odd reason. Can't explain that one. I put a $25 dollar limit on CL plane purchases. You never know what you're getting. And some folks want way too much money if they refurb them. They may or may not know what they doing. Yes, I'd spend more on a jointer if it came up.....
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If you have little experience with hand planes, is there any possibility that there is some way that you can test some planes first?
For example, if you live anywhere near the middle of Ohio, I can arrange for you to test some different types of planes.
With your list of planes, you could spend a bunch of money, especially if you are purchasing high end planes. The advantage with the high end planes is that (1) you can spend much less time tuning them up and (2) they are generally much easier to adjust.
If you will be buying a plane, you might want to start with one or two to see how things to be working. There is a learning curve for sure. I have never used any of the "1/2" planes, they are wider and heavier.
[OP]
Member
So, I'm seeing a lot of Stanley "Type XX". I know this relates to the years they were made, but are any more desirable than others? I know I prefer the larger brass threaded blade adjustment screw, but what models will work best? What's the difference between flat and corrugated bottoms?
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I’m not sure that corrugated bottoms do much but others may have a different and more informed opinion. I’ve read it’s not worth looking one way or another.
The later ones have the larger adjuster. I think you’re ok with any before they went to plastic handles in the late 1960’s (?) and 70’s. As a user, the post war ones work just fine. Rex Krueger has a video on YouTube you might find informative.
Contributor
One, of many, resource is:
Hyperkitten's Stanley Page
it has links to other pages too.
I think for pre-WW2 Stanley's condition affects how they work more than specific vintage. Small details changed as they evolved, so some prefer certain periods over others. As far as corrugated or not it seems it's mostly a gimmick and other concerns, condition or favorite feature, are more important.
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