Dining table twist

[Phil Holt]

Hello all. Wanted some advice on a small problem I am experiencing. I’m building a dining table that is 80” long by 50” wide. The legs are 5x5 turned maple. The apron is also maple. I’ve attached the apron to the legs with pocket holes and a brace at a 45 degree angle and that is fastened to the leg as well with 3” lag screws. When I go to move the table, (Too is not attached) I can lift one end and twist it quite a bit. Like the apron itself is twisting. The joints don’t seem to move at all. Is this due to the length of the apron? Can I eliminate this at all? Or is it perfectly fine?

[Steve Jenkins]

It’s fine. Like picking up an empty picture frame from one corner.

[Jamie Buxton]

Most dining tables twist a bit. That’s how they get all four legs to touch the floor, because the floor generally is not flat.

[Andrew Hughes]

When the top is attached it will help with the twist. 50 inch wide top is super duper wide. I hope you have a long boarding house reach. That’s two inches wider then a sheet of plywood.

[Matt Day]

Guessing the OP wanted two people to sit at each end, though that will conflict with people on the sides. An odd size for sure, but there are likely circumstances (Room size, wife, client, etc) that ask for it.

[Jamie Buxton]

A 50”-wide table leaves plenty of room in the middle for serving dishes, flower arrangements, candles, etc.

[Richard Coers]

With that much wood in the leg, I would have used mortise and tenon joints. Pocket screws are not structural to me. Depending on the thickness of the top, it would make me nervous to drag your design across the floor. 50" wide? Going to be a challenge for kids to pass food across the table!

[Aaron Rosenthal]

With that much wood in the leg, I would have used mortise and tenon joints. Pocket screws are not structural to me. Depending on the thickness of the top, it would make me nervous to drag your design across the floor. 50" wide? Going to be a challenge for kids to pass food across the table!

Richard got it first.
I HAVE built tables using pocket screws as part of my joinery.
I’m now rebuilding them (12) using drawbored Mortise & Tenon joinery.

[Dave Sabo]

I’m also going to pile on.

Pocket screws are a disgrace in this application. Tenon is the only way to fly on something this scale.

[Frederick Skelly]

Phil, welcome to SMC. Glad to have you join us!

Yes, I would expect a little twist without the table top, especially with a project this large.

Like several others, I'm concerned about the long term durability of pocket screw joints on a large, relatively heavy table. You or your customer will move it around to clean from time to time and that will stress the joinery. I'm curious. What's driving you to use pocket screws? Do you have other options in your shop? (Example: a router can cut mortises on each side and you could retrofit tenons.)

Let us know and maybe we can think of ways to help.

Fred