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Thread: T23 restoration

  1. #16
    I found the fuses just a few blocks down the street! The oil system should be back together soon.

  2. #17
    That's quite the setup. Cant wait to get my T23 up and running. I just got my door cutter set from Rangate and am excited to use it.

  3. #18
    So, my T23 has some serious issues with the electrical components. As if that wasn't likely with the fuses missing.

    To make a long story short it doesnít work. I contacted a technician listed on the Martin USA site named Don Williamson with WorkHorse Machinery in Yelm, WA. Super nice guy and very knowledgeable. Don has been working on Martins for 15 years and also much bigger industrial equipment from Weinieg (spelling?) and others. I highly recommend calling him if you need help with older Martin equipment.

    Don contacted a guy Named Al with Martin USA to see if it was possible to get parts for the T23. Alís recommendation was to just go with a VFD wired straight to the motor and bypass all of the old components.

    I kind of like this idea as I think it would be more reliable in the long run. But there is at least one issue that I am not sure how to deal with and that is the oil pump. What is the power required for that and how would I supply it? On the electrical schematic it looks like it says that itís 24-30vdc? Is that right? I donít see any markings on the pump.

    By the way, the previous owner says they will refund my money but that leaves me upside down $800 for shipping/ fuses, etc, and they have to get the machine back. I would prefer to keep it if I can get it to work. So I am thinking if I can work out the oil pump issue and they will pay for the VFD then I will keep it.

    So, am I missing anything, and how do supply the oil pump?


  4. #19
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Ouray Colorado
    Greg, these machines are 40 plus years old and anything coming from a coastal area will need all the contacts cleaned. I had to replace all the wires and clean all connections in my box. Bypassing everything might work. The only complex electrical part of these is the 2 speed motor.

    the pump is powered by a rectifier and is 24 volts.
    You have To realize restoring one of these has a lot of unknowns and a lot of work. I’m happy I did it but a huge amount of time.

  5. #20
    Hi Joe,
    It needs more than just cleaning and rewiring. At least a transformer and maybe barrel switch/ switches. The parts donít sound available. The VFD would be easy enough to do. The technician I talked to said to just wire to the 3600 rpm side and let the VFD control motor speed. I would need to figure out the oil pump. Would I just buy a 24vdc power supply and put it on a switch?

  6. #21
    I just ordered a 24vdc supply. It will be here in the morning and Iíll try it on the pump.

  7. #22

    I’m sorry about your troubles.

    Honestly it sounds like this is barely a parts machine.

    You had better hope that dam pump works once you get the switch figured.

    If the pump is not good I have a solution but it’s not inexpensive. The delivery rate of the oil is very specific and I spent well over a month sourcing a pump the parts to make it all work as designed from the factory. I also had a very helpful willing and savvy engineer friend in my back pocket whom also has it bad for these old machines.

    It’s was not fun as I needed the machine to be producing work. Now had I not needed the machine and had the time it could have been fun as I’m pretty committed to saving these old Martin machines. At some point though you have to consider just buying a new one.

    Honestly I don’t like the idea of a vfd as at the end of this all the cool stuff about this machine is gonna be lost with a vfd then a switch for the pump. I would think if you dig hard enough you should be able to replace transformers, rectifiers, fuses switches so forth and so on and keep it very much intact as it was from the factory. It will take great electrical knowledge how and a shit ton of digging around online. It can be done though.

    I might honestly look for another machine and make sure it’s largely good and make one good machine of the two. A t21 in great shape just sold very close to me. They are out there but you gotta wait and you gotta buy a clean one.

    If the pump is shot and you don’t care A gravity syst4m can be employed to deliver the oil pretty easy. Again it’s gonna be getting the flow rate dialed in properly. That should also be easy. What won’t be possible without a electrical pump of some sort is a system that circulates the oil. You will have to just collect it in a container and toss it. Honestly it uses so little oil that would be no big deal. For me though it was to far a departure from a modern machine even for one of these vintage beauties.

  8. #23
    The small picture you posted of the starter and wiring looks original an untouched. Running it all off a vfd would not be my first choice.

    Maybe time to learn a little more about control systems and how that one works.

    Al at Martin only said that because they literally want nothing to do with anything over 20 years old.

  9. #24
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Ouray Colorado
    I found some good used replacement electronic parts from the panel on EBay. Parts that are not available new.

  10. #25
    Like when you restored your machine or now.

    Man if I found any of that stuff Iíd hoard it for a really bad and rainy day.

    Quote Originally Posted by Joe Calhoon View Post
    I found some good used replacement electronic parts from the panel on EBay. Parts that are not available new.

  11. #26
    Join Date
    Sep 2016
    Modesto, CA, USA
    What is the flow rate for the bearings? If it is low a bijur type pump could be used. How many outputs do you need? Figuring out the correct metering valves may take some time. From what I have found the drippers for irrigation 1/2 gallon/hour is the lowest flow available. I would think oil would flow slower then water through the same orifice.
    Bil lD

  12. #27
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Central WI
    That electrical panel looks worse than it probably is. If it is like my T21, you have either four Klockner Moeller 22DIL starters or two fed by a drum switch. Each speed has its own starter. I try to keep the original electronics but if you go the vfd route, I'd talk to someone who could program the vfd to accept two motor parameters so you could run either speed. Using only the top speed cuts the torque for the most used 4500-6000 range. I'd rather use the low speed at closer to 60-70 hz than the top speed at 30 hz. Dave

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