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Thread: remind me again - HVLP (pressurized) sprayable door and trim material

  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wakahisa Shinta View Post
    John, what do you use to clean your gun after spraying Lenmar Duralaq? I read the TDS, but want to hear your real-time method.

    I have been spraying BM Advance with a Fuji Q5 and T75G gun, but dislike the cure time required for BM Advance. I have a non-kitchen cabinet project coming up and want to try another product. Duralaq sounds like a nice one to try.

    Thanks!
    Lenmar Duralaq WB is a waterborne product. I clean up with soap and water.

    They make a solvent version, too, called Duralaq, but I don't use it.

    John

  2. #17
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    Just hot water for me...
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    The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rob Young View Post
    Ordered a gallon of the WB Duralaq tinted in the color I was told to use...
    And a gallon of the undercoater. You were right, the undercoater is much cheaper than the BIN.

    All should be in middle of next week, they aren't stocked at my BenMoore dealer.

    Plan is to spray two more doors with the undercoater week from tomorrow and all three with the acrylic after that. I'll take notes.
    Whelp, no testing for me this weekend. As the BenMoore dealer in my town doesn't stock the Duralaq line, it had to be ordered in. The good news is that I caught them on the morning they were preparing the order and I could get a gallon of the white poly to tint along with the Duralaq undercoater (primer). Great.

    Called to see if my order was in and they were unpacking the pallet Thursday afternoon and the manifest said it was there (along with all the other stuff they ordered). Fantastic.

    Problem is, while the manifest was the right one for their order, the pallet was not! The pallet shipped to Lawrence, KS belonged to a store in Branson, MO. And vice versa.

    Won't get resolved until Monday at the earliest.

    Rats.
    Don't sweat the petty things and don't pet the sweaty things.

  4. #19
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    Well, I guess you'll have to start building that next project over the weekend since you can't do the finishing.
    --

    The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rob Young View Post
    Whelp, no testing for me this weekend. As the BenMoore dealer in my town doesn't stock the Duralaq line, it had to be ordered in. The good news is that I caught them on the morning they were preparing the order and I could get a gallon of the white poly to tint along with the Duralaq undercoater (primer). Great.

    Called to see if my order was in and they were unpacking the pallet Thursday afternoon and the manifest said it was there (along with all the other stuff they ordered). Fantastic.

    Problem is, while the manifest was the right one for their order, the pallet was not! The pallet shipped to Lawrence, KS belonged to a store in Branson, MO. And vice versa.

    Won't get resolved until Monday at the earliest.

    Rats.
    And still no product delivered to my BM dealer. Well, not quite, they did get the undercoater but the white poly is still not arrived. Two weeks now and I'm really, really not impressed by this dealer's customer service. I have to call them to find out if it has arrived. The undercoater came in mid-week but they never called me.

    Obviously nobody in this area is using Duralaq products otherwise they would be stocked closer in.
    Don't sweat the petty things and don't pet the sweaty things.

  6. #21
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    Well that's disappointing. My local BM dealer stocks the clear and white Duralaq WB in most sheens, and Undercoater. When they don't have it it's never more than a 2 day wait. I'll count myself lucky.

    John

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by John TenEyck View Post
    Well that's disappointing. My local BM dealer stocks the clear and white Duralaq WB in most sheens, and Undercoater. When they don't have it it's never more than a 2 day wait. I'll count myself lucky.

    John
    Bit of a dead zone for lots of finishing stuff that isn't BORG grade around here. Kansas City (KS and MO) are the closest "big" cities but even they aren't that large.

    And while I can get some of the GF products around here if I'm willing to drive between 30 minutes to an hour there is no dealer for their pro-lines. Closest for that is in St. Louis. None of the local ones that carry the usual suspects can tint material. So I'd have to convince the local SW or BM to give it a go and last ask on that was a hard no since it isn't one of their lines. I think they were worried about matching and my later coming back to complain.

    Target Coatings pretty much the same story. Would have to 100% mail order.
    Don't sweat the petty things and don't pet the sweaty things.

  8. #23
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    No one carries the pro line of GF products near me either, except for EnduroVar at my fairly local Rockler. I've never found that a problem, though, except in the Winter months when things can freeze. I've ordered many of GF's products from Homestead Finishing, Woodworker's Hardware, and others. Now I have a pro pricing deal through a friend which has gone a long way towards tying my loyalty to GF. But I still buy Duralaq WB at my local BM because it's cheaper and sprays great. The white Duralaq WB, in particular, sprays infinitely easier than Enduro White Poly.

    What originally attracted me to Duralaq WB was that BM will tint it to any of their colors. TC will tint their products, too, but BM is local to me and I can get product any time of year w/o worry. It was only after I tried it that I found out how easy it sprays. The cost savings was actually secondary, but much appreciated.

    John

  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rob Young View Post
    And still no product delivered to my BM dealer. Well, not quite, they did get the undercoater but the white poly is still not arrived. Two weeks now and I'm really, really not impressed by this dealer's customer service. I have to call them to find out if it has arrived. The undercoater came in mid-week but they never called me.

    Obviously nobody in this area is using Duralaq products otherwise they would be stocked closer in.
    Finally got a call yesterday morning that the Duralaq tintable poly had arrived at the dealer. Picked it up at noon.

    They got me the undercoat but unfortunately the weather here has not been cooperating with my schedule. Because I spray outdoors, I am more concerned with temperature, humidity and wind. Every day that I was able to make time, the weather was not compatible. The forecast for this weekend through Tuesday, I think, looks much better and I can finally get going on my testing of these products!
    Don't sweat the petty things and don't pet the sweaty things.

  10. #25
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    Undercoater!

    I am impressed by the Duralaq undercoater John!

    Decent coverage, still did two coats on bare poplar and MDF. And minimal grain raise, comparable to what the shellac BIN does.

    Undercoater can seems be be a big bunch of titanium dioxide with just enough binder. Powders up great.

    I had two glue stains on the MDF panels and those show through. So I'll spot prime with BIN there. Otherwise looks good.

    20 seconds in my #4 cup so tried 1.3mm N/N on my Acufine 4 stage. Might even be able to go 1.0mm...
    Don't sweat the petty things and don't pet the sweaty things.

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rob Young View Post
    I am impressed by the Duralaq undercoater John!

    Decent coverage, still did two coats on bare poplar and MDF. And minimal grain raise, comparable to what the shellac BIN does.

    Undercoater can seems be be a big bunch of titanium dioxide with just enough binder. Powders up great.

    I had two glue stains on the MDF panels and those show through. So I'll spot prime with BIN there. Otherwise looks good.

    20 seconds in my #4 cup so tried 1.3mm N/N on my Acufine 4 stage. Might even be able to go 1.0mm...

    It is amazing how the viscosity can be so low for something with so much filler in it. Good chemistry at work. And the price is a true bargain. I haven't checked the SDS in quite some time, but I suspect it's mostly calcium carbonate with just a little TiO2 in order to make it that cheap. Regardless, it works great.

    You are right about it not coating very well over glue stains. I found if you scuff sand the glue area then it coats much better.

    Glad you were pleased with how it worked for you.

    John

  12. #27
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    John -

    Something that came to mind after the significant other was looking at the result of the spraying of the doors.

    She would like (and I agree) that the kitchen needs updating. But the Duralaq Acrylic isn't particularly chemical resistant. The MegaVar stuff should be more so being a polyurethane. The acrylic should be fine for doors and trim but not so much cabinets that get wiped down?


    So I started browsing the various TDS docs and really I'm not seeing anything about MegaVar over the WB acrylic products. Thoughs?

    And of course, probably better off using something a bit more tough but given the cost of the Duralaq white acrylic, man, it makes the numbers work better than things that cost $80/gal when laying out those 2 or 3 color coats...
    Don't sweat the petty things and don't pet the sweaty things.

  13. #28
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    Rob, different manufacturers handle the durability thing in various ways. One option is that you can get your color on with the acrylic and they use a more chemically resistant clear over it...but you need to consult with the manufacturer of the color product to understand what's compatible. Fortunately, compatibility is a little easier, IMHO, with waterborne products.

    I happen to use Target Coatings finishes (although I'm interested in trying the Duralaq) and they offer a crosslinker additive that increases chemical resistance over the already decent capability of the base products. I took advantage of that for my kitchen uppers when I replaced them two years ago. The color coats went on and then a couple coats of clear with the crosslinker finished the job. I could have put the crosslinker in the color coats, too, but since I intended to clear coat with the conversion varnish with crosslinker, I didn't feel the need.
    --

    The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...

  14. #29
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    Rob, your concerns are valid with Duralaq WB with regards to chemical resistance. Ammonia cleaners don't play nice with it. I was in the same quandary with my kitchen cabinets a year ago. After some testing I found that Enduro Clear Poly bonds securely to the custom mixed Duralaq WB I wanted to use for the base cabinets. And that's what I used. Two coats of Duralaq WB directly on the raw wood because I wanted the grain to show through followed by one coat of Enduro Clear Poly. A year later they look perfect and are easy to keep clean with a wipe of soapy water followed by a dry towel. Enduro Clear Poly isn't the cheapest thing if you have to pay retail but I'm lucky to be able to buy it by the 5 gal pail at pro prices.

    One area of my kitchen is used as a computer area. I painted that run of cabinets with Duralaq WB white only because they won't be subjected to spills and splashes. Two coats of Undercoater, sanded, followed by two coats of Duralaq WB white.

    MegaVar or another product with KCMA rating would be the safest bet, but I'm happy with the approach I took.

    John

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by John TenEyck View Post
    Rob, your concerns are valid with Duralaq WB with regards to chemical resistance. Ammonia cleaners don't play nice with it. I was in the same quandary with my kitchen cabinets a year ago. After some testing I found that Enduro Clear Poly bonds securely to the custom mixed Duralaq WB I wanted to use for the base cabinets. And that's what I used. Two coats of Duralaq WB directly on the raw wood because I wanted the grain to show through followed by one coat of Enduro Clear Poly. A year later they look perfect and are easy to keep clean with a wipe of soapy water followed by a dry towel. Enduro Clear Poly isn't the cheapest thing if you have to pay retail but I'm lucky to be able to buy it by the 5 gal pail at pro prices.

    One area of my kitchen is used as a computer area. I painted that run of cabinets with Duralaq WB white only because they won't be subjected to spills and splashes. Two coats of Undercoater, sanded, followed by two coats of Duralaq WB white.

    MegaVar or another product with KCMA rating would be the safest bet, but I'm happy with the approach I took.

    John
    Got a reply from Lenmar and here it is:

    The MegaVar WB has shown to have some compatibility issues when applied over the Duralac Waterborne due to the differences in the hardness of the two resins. As such, we would not recommend applying the MegaVar over the Duralac. MegaVar will have much better chemical resistance, but would have to be applied from the wood up as a system on its own.

    My followup question to them was to ask if the WB MegaVar (clear, they don't have a "white" version) can be tinted to a solid color.

    Kind of impressed that they responded reasonably quickly.
    Last edited by Jim Becker; 07-27-2020 at 8:14 PM. Reason: Defaulted text size so it's readable on large monitors
    Don't sweat the petty things and don't pet the sweaty things.

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