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Thread: Disappointing Festool interaction. No More ??

  1. #16
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
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    Atlanta
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    507
    Calvin , part of this is Festool's fault and part is yours. Sorry.

    Festool is partly on the hook for allowing this air of mystery to surround their stuff like it's made of myrrh and fairy dust and that it will last forever. And for customers trying to justify their outlay on the purchase. Fact is, Festool doesn't have some magical manufacturing prowess that translates into overwhelmingly better tools.

    Sure, being made in Germany by a well trained work force, using better raw materials, and being engineered to a higher standard than say a Harbor Freight widget - makes them better than tools from a lesser manufacturers. BUT - this makes them incrementally better. Not exponentially better. Fact is their bearings aren't ten times better than Makita's. And their batteries and associated tech aren't better at all then Panasonic. Nor is their plastic or castings or .......

    I think your expectations are too high. That's not a lifetime vac.

    What could you have got circa 2007 instead? Fein Turbo Mk1. Design and factory have changed - good luck getting parts for it. WAP- got bought out, doubtful a circuit board is available form them. Could have got a Porter Cable 78xx - for which you can still get a circuit board in theory. Coulda got a Bosch Airsweep which was made until fairly recently and still has circuit boards available. Most or all are not as capable as the CT22 and not much cheaper at the time.

    Call back your dealer and ask for an OEM radio for that 99' and report back if it's available; and if so the price. Some parts are still available for the CT22, just not what you needed. When it comes to electronics it's easy to understand why. Try and get a 2007 board for a Pioneer or Sony stereo.

    Did you think about calling Festool before you shipped out a big and expensive to ship vacuum to at least get a read on the problem ? Would have saved you a lot of aggravation.

  2. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Derek Cohen View Post
    I had the control board go on a Fein about 7 or 8 years ago ( my fault). The cost of a replacement control board was too high. I had the technician wire it off the control board, meaning that it now worked with a single (full) speed.

    Regards from Perth

    Derek
    Do what Derek suggests - just wire it to run at full speed when you turn it on. Then if you want to have the vacuum turn on when you turn on the tool, use an iVac and if you want to control the speed, use one of those router speed control devices. Total cost, less than $70.

    Mike

    [And just to follow up on a previous discussion of the use of a router speed control device on a shop vac. Look up "Fan Affinity Laws". As you slow down a fan, the cubic feet per minute flow goes down linearly with the reduction in the RPM. So if you slow down the fan RPMs by 50% you reduce the CFM by 50%. But the power required goes down by the third power. So the power required (and the heat generated) is 1/8 of the power full speed.]
    Last edited by Mike Henderson; 06-02-2020 at 11:03 PM.
    Go into the world and do well. But more importantly, go into the world and do good.

  3. #18
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Okotoks AB
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    1,946
    Quote Originally Posted by Calvin Crutchfield View Post
    Unfortunately, I cannot have it repaired. I was not going to pay $60 to have it shipped back to me and still be broken.
    That makes no sense. The electronics are just a sophisticated switch that could just be replaced by a simple switch. About $4 worth of parts + labor. Or one of those aftermarket router speed controls if you needed the variable speed. So you've thrown out a many hundreds of dollars worth of vacuum to save $60?

    But I do agree that not having parts for it is just something that will off customers. It can't be that big a hardship to stock those parts longer.
    Last edited by Keith Outten; 06-06-2020 at 4:31 PM.

  4. #19
    Somebody make a deal with Calvin to pay him $60 and have Calvin direct Festool to ship it to you (since he doesn't want it). Better than letting it go to waste.

    Mike
    Go into the world and do well. But more importantly, go into the world and do good.

  5. #20
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Tippecanoe County, IN
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    636
    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Henderson View Post
    Somebody make a deal with Calvin to pay him $60 and have Calvin direct Festool to ship it to you (since he doesn't want it). Better than letting it go to waste.

    Mike
    That's a great idea. In fact, depending on where in Indiana Calvin shipped it to I might be interested. If Lebanon, that's only a forty minute drive.
    Beranek's Law:

    It has been remarked that if one selects his own components, builds his own enclosure, and is convinced he has made a wise choice of design, then his own loudspeaker sounds better to him than does anyone else's loudspeaker. In this case, the frequency response of the loudspeaker seems to play only a minor part in forming a person's opinion.
    L.L. Beranek, Acoustics (McGraw-Hill, New York, 1954), p.208.

  6. #21
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    West Lafayette, IN
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    Same here. Lebanon is 45 minutes for me too. Id happily go pick it up!!!

  7. #22
    A few thoughts,

    Yes it’s kinda annoying when you think of their 3 year bumper to bumper marketing scam. It kinda makes one think I’m buying something that’s gonna last forever. And it might, or it might not. Kapex, probably not, from what I have seen a CT probably not, a drill a domino you might get lucky?

    We have this conversation in many forms across the forum. Everything is built these days to fail or companies go out of business. I don’t agree with it morally, actually I don’t agree with it in any way. If that’s the answer to employing a exploding population I say less people is the answer. But everything from washers dryers, your fridge, car you name it. Pretty much 10 years.

    Now I loooooooooove tools. Well machines and hand tools, I’m not much a fan of contractor type tools or Festool to be honest. Great instal tools but always a better option in the shop. I struggle weekly regarding buying two brand new Martin machines “I own one I purchased new”. But spending $55-90k on a machine that’s parts are supported for 20 years after date of manufacture is not a risk I can feel good about taking. Someone else with high production numbers will feel different. I have been told over and over again by other Martin owners or dealers how “great” 20 years is in today’s market for parts availability. And I guess it kinda is, but in contrast to a $90k purchase not so much. At least not for this hourly woodworker. If I was actually wealthy and not just willing to accept scraping by in life to do something I enjoy I’m pretty sure I wouldn’t think twice about the purchase.

    As a human I’d still be moral pissed this is what we as humans have regressed into..
    Last edited by Patrick Walsh; 06-03-2020 at 8:33 AM.

  8. #23
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    Griswold Connecticut
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    6,611
    Quote Originally Posted by Calvin Crutchfield View Post
    I had a CT 22 dust extractor. I do not know how long I had it, but I was told by the service center that it was 13 yrs old. I was also told that the electronic board was bad and they no longer support it or stock parts. I had to ship from CA to IN!

    So, 10 yrs or so is the lifetime of a festool tool? No Thanks.

    I wasn't given the opportunity to get a small discount on new one, or even offered a refurbished one. Thats was it. Sorry . . next!

    I am a supporter of quality tools and was getting ready to buy a few more things. Domino and track saw. Even though I want them, I can't let myself do it.

    Any similar experiences? Should I be disappointed or is that kind of time frame too long to expect support?

    Thanks . . .
    Calvin
    Your experience with consumer electronics is not uncommon. Try buying the control board for an LG Refrigerator 13 years after purchase. I remember the last time I fixed my ASKO dryer, the timer board was $400.00, and there were only two in the US. That was a $900.000 dryer in 1994.
    I bought a Honda Lawn Tractor in 1991, that was $3300.00. 15 years later it pooped out. Honda no longer supported it, the store I bought it at wouldn't work on it, nor would they give me the wiring schematic of the TRIAC control module, so I could troubleshoot it. I understand your frustration. My next Tractor was a John Deere.
    Now as to a repair;
    Your Festool is obviously not under warranty any longer. Find an appliance repair store, that works on vacuums, within driving distance, and drop it off. It's an odds on bet that they will replace all of the capacitors on the board and fire it back up. Every part on that control board was sourced by Festool, so it is entirely repairable, and at worse, just jumper around it.
    At the end of the day, it's still just a simple vacuum cleaner, with tight tolerances and filtration. Don't spend $60.00 to ship it anywhere.
    Last edited by Mike Cutler; 06-03-2020 at 8:51 AM.
    "The first thing you need to know, will likely be the last thing you learn." (Unknown)

  9. #24
    Join Date
    May 2017
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    Germany
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Cutler View Post
    Don't spend $60.00 to ship it anywhere.
    You might have misread his second post. He already shipped it to the service center in Indiana and they want $60 to ship it back to him.

  10. #25
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    Feb 2003
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    Griswold Connecticut
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    6,611
    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Kreinhop View Post
    You might have misread his second post. He already shipped it to the service center in Indiana and they want $60 to ship it back to him.
    Oops!! That's embarassing.
    "The first thing you need to know, will likely be the last thing you learn." (Unknown)

  11. #26
    I have a Festool sander that crapped out. I loved that sander but knew better than to send it back. I’m sure shipping, repair cost and return shipping would mean I could nearly buy a new one.

    See it’s a freaking trap and marketing scam..

  12. #27
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Okotoks AB
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    1,946
    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Cutler View Post
    Oops!! That's embarassing.
    Not as embarrassing as throwing away an expensive vacuum because of $60.

  13. #28
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    Perth, Australia
    Posts
    7,338
    Have Festool rewire it while it is with them. I am sure their repair department is good for that. Use a little extra guilt if they balk at the job.

    This is a simple job, and they may not even charge for it.

    Regards from Perth

    Derek

  14. #29
    Derek, they will never do that. Everything runs through legal and legal will say, "you want to do what?" That will be the end of it. Liability drives the day. I lost my Fein a couple years ago and about further destroyed it disassembling it. Sadly it is now a hopper for off-cuts. I believe that the law in the states says that you must support a product for seven years after production ends, of that specific model. Change a diode on the board and its is a new model.

  15. #30
    The OP's problem is s symptom of our times. "Bells and whistles, features, ease of use, smart", all buzz words to describe in this case a vacuum that needs a circuit board to operate as... a vacuum! If this thing was used by a site crew professionally for 10 years I'd say thanks for the memories but the OP's description of it's easy life is anything but meritorious service. I have a very dumbed down Craftsman shop vac that has an on off switch and a variable slider, I've stripped the motor down twice and lubed it, it's 28 years old and the best vac I've ever owned. I used it as my shop DC when I started out! It will not turn on and off when I use it on my ROS and it doesn't let me know how many hours of run time are on it or how many pounds of crap it's sucked up. It does let me know about upcoming maintenance intervals by squeeling like a pig.

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