Good enough vs overkill

[Mark Hennebury]

Both terms are misnomers as "Good enough" seldom is, and "Overkill" never killed anyone.

In wooodworking, as in most things in life, the world is divided into two kinds of people; Those whom adhere to the "Good enough" philosophy and those how fall into the "Overkill" camp.

Which side you belong to determines pretty much everything that you do in your woodworking and maybe even how you go about life in general.

When working from the good enough mindset, you carefully calculate the expected load, factor in "all" of the variables and design and build to minimize use of materials, labor and cost.

Oops...


Sadly i couldn't find a video of the old bridge below, apparently no one makes videos of old bridges, probably because it would be boring as the don't really do much, not like the modern ones.

When working from the "Overkill" mindset.

Time, materials and cost are not a factor. It's simply a matter of how good can this be built. Sadly to me, that is an old fashioned concept.

The Roman bridge of Córdoba is a bridge originally built in the early 1st century BC across the Guadalquivir river, perhaps replacing a previous wooden one. The bridge has been reconstructed at various times since and most of the present structure dates from the Moorish reconstruction in the 8th century.

25699372876_0523937ee5_b.jpg

The Roman arch was the foundation of Rome's architectural mastery and massive expanse of building projects across the ancient world. It allowed the Romans to make bigger buildings, longer roads, and better aqueducts. The Roman arch is the ancestor of modern architecture

(Apparently not everyone knows this.)

Which camp are you in and why?

[Kevin Jenness]

I guess I'm somewhere in the middle. I'm pretty meticulous, but without an unlimited budget you can't ignore time, materials and cost and stay in business. "Good enough for who it's for" or "good enough for government work" leads down the wrong path, but I figure good enough for me is ok as long as I'm really trying to hit a high standard.

I have always liked this quote from a Wooden Boat article on Bud Mcintosh, a respected New Hampshire boatbuilder who got his start during the Depression:

"About the only thing you can say about an old-timer who has survived a miserable occupation like this is that you have finally learned the balance between how good it should be and what they'll pay for, and how good it has to be before you lose your reputation."

[roger wiegand]

"Overkill" originates from the beginning of the nuclear weapon era, some say as early as 1946, the first written evidence of it is apparently in 1957, with usage peaking in the early 1980's according to the Google nGram viewer. It was invented as a technical term to describe nuclear destruction capability that went beyond complete destruction of the target. In that sense it would mean something that goes beyond complete or 100% effectiveness

[Mel Fulks]

And often the terms are mis-used to bolster the speaker's point. Some call carefully priming and painting the bottom of
newly installed expensive door "over kill". The real meaning is " we will have been paid and spent our money long
before this door starts to have open joints at the bottom from "compression ring-set".

[Mike Henderson]

Remember the definition of Quality: "Quality is what the customer says it is."

Meaning that rapid delivery may be quality for some customers. Low cost may be quality for others. Long life with minimum maintenance may be quality for someone else.

You can't impose your idea of quality on your customers. If you do, you probably won't be successful.

Mike

[David L Morse]

Remember the definition of Quality: "Quality is what the customer says it is."

Meaning that rapid delivery may be quality for some customers. Low cost may be quality for others. Long life with minimum maintenance may be quality for someone else.

You can't impose your idea of quality on your customers. If you do, you probably won't be successful.

Mike

Yes. Quality is not an absolute. It means different things in different contexts.

[Mark Bolton]

Why in holy heck in this day and age does there have to be a "side you belong to". That statement in itself is utterly disgusting.

There is a good rule in business.. "perfection is the enemy of profit". It speaks clearly to the fact that those who fall into either "side", either the extreme good enough, or the extreme overkill, do one thing and one thing well... Lose.

The answer is, if you are smart, you reside right in the middle. You are smart enough to know when your being an idiot hack and doing the "good enough" and you are also smart enough to give yourself a firm, swift, hard, painful, slap across the face, when you are doing a bunch of neurotic overkill.

There has got to come a day when we as humans quit pigeon holing people into one extreme or the other because the rationality in the world, in business, in the hobby or profession, resides squarely in the middle.

[Mark Hennebury]

The purpose of life may not be about "profitable business" to everyone.

People live their lives according to their own values.

Woodworking as not all about making money.
Building bridges has a whole lot of oversight, codes, specifications and inspections, furniture making has none, Customers don't know or spec tolerance or joinery etc. completely up to the individual maker to decide "quality"
Guided by your own conscience and values.

Perfection may be the enemy of profit, but you had better hope that some people care about it, your surgeon maybe.

Many of the good things in life have been bought to us by people that were driven by passion, people who have pushed ahead, just because.... That's why we have competitions, games, sports.... to see how far we can go, and motivate others to push on to greater heights.
Seeing great woodwork motivates others to do better, that's what's so great about having the internet available, and forums like this. seeing great work provides inspiration.

I posted the images as an example of the extremes, most answers have been about how people decide when and at what level to work at and why. There are reasons to work all across the range and it is an interesting topic of discussion to me.

Your idea of smart may work for you, but don't force it on me.

Why in holy heck in this day and age does there have to be a "side you belong to". That statement in itself is utterly disgusting.

There is a good rule in business.. "perfection is the enemy of profit". It speaks clearly to the fact that those who fall into either "side", either the extreme good enough, or the extreme overkill, do one thing and one thing well... Lose.

The answer is, if you are smart, you reside right in the middle. You are smart enough to know when your being an idiot hack and doing the "good enough" and you are also smart enough to give yourself a firm, swift, hard, painful, slap across the face, when you are doing a bunch of neurotic overkill.

There has got to come a day when we as humans quit pigeon holing people into one extreme or the other because the rationality in the world, in business, in the hobby or profession, resides squarely in the middle.

[Mike Henderson]

Perfection may be the enemy of profit, but you had better hope that some people care about it, your surgeon maybe.

Actually, surgeons have the saying, "Perfection is the enemy of good." What they mean by that is the surgeon needs to get in, do what's necessary, and get out. Trying to be "perfect" extends the surgery and leads to worse outcomes.

Mike

[Another of my favorite medical sayings is, "When you hear hoofbeats, think horses, not zebras."]

[Mark Hennebury]

Mike,

Just had surgery three months ago.

To expect 10 out of 10 every times is unrealistic. 9 out of 10 is a pretty respectable score by any standards, but i sure hope that they are trying for 10 each and every time.
No one can do more than their best, but you have to try to do your best, to do it.

Actually, surgeons have the saying, "Perfection is the enemy of good." What they mean by that is the surgeon needs to get in, do what's necessary, and get out. Trying to be "perfect" extends the surgery and leads to worse outcomes.

Mike

[Another of my favorite medical sayings is, "When you hear hoofbeats, think horses, not zebras."]

[Brian Holcombe]

There is often a buyer at every price point but the mistake is often in assuming how many of them are at their respective price points. IE Hofmann still exists and appears to be doing well but they made the right move in planning for a small portion of high end consumers.

Danish furniture manufactures do the same, after nearly dying off they recognized this bit of economic reality and reformed their businesses to suit luxury appear and scale.

As example, Wooden plane makers in the US have plenty of business to keep a one man shop running, but scaling it up would likely be their demise.

I would rather have excess demand and just slightly short supply of a high end product than to have excess supply of a ‘good enough’ product even if that meant making less overall.

[Art Mann]

One person's "perfection" is another person's "half-ass". The original poster doesn't seem to have a concept of just how expensive and ridiculous "overkill" can be.

[Mark Hennebury]

Art,
The original poster knows quite a lot about the cost of "overkill" Thanks.

One person's "perfection" is another person's "half-ass". The original poster doesn't seem to have a concept of just how expensive and ridiculous "overkill" can be.

[Kevin Jenness]

If I can make a glued edge joint that is visually perfect using a jointer is that "good enough"? Must I achieve overkill by "improving" it with a handplane to be fit to call myself a furnituremaker? Can I use spline tenons for the corner joints of a table frame or a door, or must I use fox-wedged tenons? Am I one of the "crap people" if I use a miterfold instead of a lock miter on a cabinet return?

There is an element of moral hectoring here that I find a little off-putting. I agree that I need to aim high in my work to produce work that I find acceptable, but I think I can safely decide what is "good enough" without gilding the lily (aka overkill).

[Patrick Walsh]

And not everything is life is about money.

I get to many money is very much the number one motivator the number one consideration. I get not everyone has the fortune to have the luxury to be concerned to the Degree a bunch of board old guys do. It we should all care. And so long as we put money first, we build crap, we build crap it go’s in a giant hole, it goes in the]at giant hole and we are very clearly kill in ourselfs. But if we as a group a species change our thinking, our perspective, maybe even our motives we can actually do something about it.

I believe there are a number of things that should trump money.

Not destroying the planet as in marks video just the starting point of a giant Iceberg directly related to at last marks perspective and mine..

One person's "perfection" is another person's "half-ass". The original poster doesn't seem to have a concept of just how expensive and ridiculous "overkill" can be.