Made in China sentiment

[Mark Rainey]

Good wisdom Mark. International capitalism rules. Governments are close to helpless. Years ago, a college professor referred to the phenomenon as free market fundamentalism.

[Rod Sheridan]

Most people aren't in a business and can't make value judgments about quality products versus cheap products. Its a choice of having a tool or not. The only way you can keep critical industries in the US in a globally competitive environment is through taxpayer subsidies, or massive tariffs. The last time (last year) we tried tariffs to punish China, the backlash against our farmers points out why that works both ways.

The issue with tariffs is that they are paid by the importer, so for example the tariffs on Chinese items imported into the USA are paid by American consumers.

They are punitive, in that they are designed to make you buy the non imported item by making the imported item more expensive. I'm ambivalent about tariffs as they make objects more expensive and sometimes lower income people suffer due to the higher prices.

I wonder if an education program would work to convince people to pay more to keep their neighbours employed?

Regards, Rod.

[Brian Holcombe]

Some items I agree, machines being one. Machines and hand tools don't become functionally obsolete in a relatively short time. Other things become outdated long before they wear out. A high quality 10 year old cell phone may still work perfectly (assuming it'll connect to a network) but it'll hardly be the functional equivalent of even a low end cell phone produced today.

That’s certainly true in many cases, my spending on electronics over a 10 year period is exceptionally low, so I don’t weight them in very high. That said i generally buy quality and use them longer than the company selling them to me would prefer.

Most of the things I like are already old and outdated.

[Jim Becker]

Plenty of people buy Ikea furniture because it is cheap and they figure tastes will change by the time it needs replacement in five years or whatever. I still have almost all of the original furniture I bought when I got my first house. My bedroom furniture is solid wood and the style is pretty timeless. My recliner had to be replaced after 20 years as it was falling apart. I don't think my new recliner will last that long.

Interestingly, I have a good amount of Ikea furniture from the 1980s that was bought from the very first Ikea store in the country. That includes two leather love seats and a matching chair. They were not cheap, either... That said, you are correct that many folks don't consider what they are getting for their lower price point choices and it's telling on trash day all the time.

[Stan Calow]

I wonder if an education program would work to convince people to pay more to keep their neighbours employed?

I remember such a campaign in the late '60s early '70s to support US textile workers - "look for the union label" was the tag line for ubiquitous commercials on TV. People pretty much dismissed the commercials as a joke, as high-wage unions became a target. People voted in their own self-interest with their dollars.

[Paul Haus]

Lot of opinions here. Personally I prefer to buy things 'Made in the USA', but so many things are no longer made here. Most if not all the major US auto manufacturers use parts from China in producing current vehicles. Happens I'm restoring an older car and so many of the electrical and mechanical parts are no longer available except for items made in China. If you want or need a part then many times the only option is China or nothing. How long this trend will exist is anyone's guess, but I expect it won't end any time soon.

[Brian Holcombe]

If you want a made in USA car then buy a BMW, Mercedes or Japanese car, many are made in the US.

[John K Jordan]

If you want a made in USA car then buy a BMW, Mercedes or Japanese car, many are made in the US.

My brother retired from Honda in Ohio. I bought a Honda Accord made there.

JKJ

[Perry Hilbert Jr]

Back in the late 1960's, It became known that the only place in the world that large bearings for hydroelecric turbines were made in Czechoslovakia. The Russians could have held our entire electrical grid hostage, but didn't. zI am amazed at what is made where. My wife's car complete with 3 cylinder engine was made in Thailand. One of the most trouble free cars we ever owned. When I was in college, I bought an Italian motorcycle. Every body was buying Japanese, or English, a few German. My dad said the thing would never last. It is now 52 years old, still runs and is part of a rich guy's collection down in Richmond VA. Chinese stuff is like stuff from everywhere. Some the worst quality imaginable and some pretty darn good. For one of the turnings, I sell, I need a small eyelet attached to the piece. I order them direct from china. Last order was 300 eyelets for $1.27, including shipping. Never had one break or twist off.

[John K Jordan]

...Chinese stuff is like stuff from everywhere. Some the worst quality imaginable and some pretty darn good. ...

And I understand some of both come from the same factories. The Little Machine Shop sells versions of small milling machines and metal lathes that are made in the same factories as the cheap versions that others sell. They told me they pay more for better tolerances and fit/finish. I can believe it. The lathe I got from them appears identical on the outside to one a friend bought. He had to disassemble his completely and rework and clean up internal things like gears, bushings, etc. He looked over mine and couldn't believe how much different it looked outside and and how smoothly things worked. Mine was more expensive, though! Yikes, getting what you pay for, what a concept.

[Rollie Meyers]

I always look for the COO, Country Of Origin on a package & always look for something else when it says "China" on it, sometimes it's impossible to avoid China products, but I try, if it is food it goes back though their food safety standards are somewhere between slim to none, & canned mushrooms, Mandarin oranges, frozen broccoli, cauliflower, are all items I have seen sourced from there. Even have seen China TP with a Prop 65 cancer warning on it.

[Brian Elfert]

I always look for the COO, Country Of Origin on a package & always look for something else when it says "China" on it, sometimes it's impossible to avoid ChiCom products, but I try, if it is food it goes back though their food safety standards are somewhere between slim to none, & canned mushrooms, Mandarin oranges, frozen broccoli, cauliflower, are all items I have seen sourced from there. Even have seen ChiCom TP with a Prop 65 cancer warning on it.

What the heck would be in TP that requires a Prop 65 warning? My made in the USA TP has no such warning.

I buy a pack or two of RV TP every year. Walmart carries three different brands of RV TP. Two are made in China and one is USA. I always get the Scotts brand which is made in the USA. Buying TP from China seems stupid.

[Lee DeRaud]

What the heck would be in TP that requires a Prop 65 warning? My made in the USA TP has no such warning.

A quick google of "toilet paper prop 65" coughed up a mention of PCBs in a lavender-scent version of Angel Soft (USA-made BTW) toilet paper. Possibly it's something in the scent chemicals, but given the truly stunning amounts of toxic stuff involved in paper production, I'm not really surprised.

Note that the Prop 65 complaint I found wasn't because the TP contained trace amounts of PCBs, but because it was lacking the required warning label. But it was dated 2018, shortly before the Prop 65 agency started transitioning away from its prior "no safe exposure level" policy. (Remember the Starbuck coffee Prop 65 brouhaha?) It could well be that the Chinese stuff Rollie mentioned was from before that or the manufacturer hadn't bother to update the packaging.

[Brandon Speaks]

I am certainly not self imposing a rule to not buy made in China over this virus, or at all really.

That said one interesting lesson here and more interesting that the virus place of origin is just how debilitated our supply chain is without China. Imagine for a minute a world war scenario. Battles didnt win WW2 as much as our manufacturing capability being the best in the world did. Now we have very little manufacturing and the countries that do are ones that as to my best guess might not be on our side if something went wrong. I think a move to bring some level of production capability back to the US makes sense and this situation just highlighted the potential vulnerability.

How will this influence my purchasing decisions? I dont know yet. I certainly will not rule out purchase of a Chinese made product if its the best option (and really this is not about China but really anywhere but US and maybe Canada), but I am also getting a little less sensitive to price differences. This may also be influenced by as I have had some time at home and cleaning out junk I am realizing how much disposable junk I have that I dont need and am tossing. Less possessions of higher quality is the direction I feel I am headed overall (there are of course exceptions) which also tends to fit with investing more in USA made products.

To the OPs question, I dont see major changes to my overall purchasing decisions based on country of origin (and nothing singling out China in particular). However, I do support an increase in the US manufacturing base and given similar product at a slightly higher price made here I would be more likely to choose made in USA than I would have before, also given a higher quality made in USA product costing more than a lower quality Chinese product (and I am well aware that USA can make poor quality and China can make high quality, but just in the scenario mentioned) I am more likely to invest in the USA product than I was before. I would be surprised if any shift accounted for more than 2-3% of my annual spending though.

[Edwin Santos]

In light of this discussion, I find myself wondering if people in other countries have similar conversations over the reluctance to buy products from the USA for political or quality perception reasons.

Or is it a uniquely American attitude?