[OP]
Contributor
I had to cut down one of our dogwoods today. It never recovered from Hurricane Michael. The largest diameter of the tree is approximately 6-7 inches in diameter. In order to mill turning stock, can I leave the pith in it so as to get some 2x and 3x stock? I know for lumber its advisable to remove the pith. What do y'all say?
My Dad always told me "Can't Never Could".
SWE
Contributor
I typically have poorer results leaving the pith in. I checked on the Wood data base and the T/R (tangential to radial shrinkage) ratio is not real high. That is a plus or positive for you.
You might consider cutting, say, an 9 or 10 inch long section, cut it down the middle, mounting it like a propeller and turning an oval, live-edge, bowl. There is a you tube video on how to make a nine inch bowl from a 4" log (by Mike Peace). If you haven't done one, it is kind of fun.
If you do decide to leave the pith in, I'd strongly recommend sealing the end grain or even wrapping the end grain with stretch-wrap.
Come back with pictures to show us your final results and recommendations for others. Here's a picture of a type of "dogwood".
dogwood.jpg
Last edited by Brice Rogers; 04-09-2020 at 10:51 PM.
Moderator
Steve,Originally Posted by Steve Eure
Dogwood is one of my favorite woods to turn. I've cut a LOT of dogwood over the years, some of it large enough to get 3x6x15" blanks without the pith. One tree was over 12" diameter and I have some trees here on the farm maybe 16"+ in diameter, huge for dogwood.
dogwood_tree_A.jpg
With 6 and 7" diameters you should be able to get some 2x2s and even 3x3s near the base if you cut them so the pith is in the center of one side instead of on the corner, and leave a little wane on the outside corners which will get turned away. If it were me, I'd probably try to turn some green, try to dry some rounds no bigger than 4-5" in diameter and cut the largest and the rest into turning squares to dry. The wood is so tough that you can probably get away with leaving the pith in the blanks if there is no brown heartwood around the pith. I'd watch it carefully over the first few weeks and if cracks started I'd immediately cut it up into smaller squares.
I don't have a lot of experience with the small diameters logs/limbs. One thing going for dogwood is it is incredibly strong. The T/R ratio is about 1.6 which is moderate but the volumetric shrinkage is almost 20%. As a result, I've had blanks and turnings warp like crazy but rarely crack. The most cracking I see is radial cracks which start from the bark and work their way inward, sometimes opening pie-slice shaped voids all the way to the pith. Like all species, the extent of these depends on factors like the drying rate and the individual tree - some are less stable than others.
Just last week I had to take down two small very straight dogwood trees when cutting an access road and I have sections from 4" diam to 7" diameter. I gave some to a friend who plans to turn them green into long-stem goblets and such. That might be the safest if you like turning such things. I plan to process most of it into spindle turning squares 2x2 and smaller, wax the ends and dry them. Since the trees are straight the blanks should dry straight. I often use 1x1 squares and smaller for things like conductor batons and magic wands, drum sticks, finials for ornaments, tool handles, utensil handles, finger tops, repair parts for spinning wheels, hairsticks, needle cases (tiny lidded boxes), and [gasp] pens. I save pieces down to 1/2". If I have larger pieces I like to make things like lidded boxes, ring keepers, mallets, gavels, throwing tops, and pepper mills. Dogwood is great for threading. I use dogwood a lot at the lathe for wooden extensions on live centers, jam supports to hold things with drilled holes, etc. If you cut the pith out save the thin quartersawn "boards" from the center for for things like pushsticks. Made some fidget spinners from some of those. Thicker small boards make great spoons (with power carving.) Even very small pieces are in demand for miniatures since the wood is hard and heavy and has such fine grain. I've carved dogwood earrings and pendants. I also use it for some non turned things since the wood is so tough. For example, my grandson and I made this copy of a Gerber folding knife entire from dogwood, including the spring that lets the blade pop open:
folding_knife_IMG_7676.jpg
BTW, if you dry the wood, dogwood takes a little longer to dry than some due to it's density and small pores. The bigger pieces of dogwood I'm using now have been drying since 2006 but things like 2x2s are usually dry in a year or two. (I track the weight of blanks to know when they are dry.) If you turn something round off center from the pith and the wood is not quite dry, prepare for significant warping! I've hand pieces go almost egg-shaped! This was to be a lid for a turned box and the wood wasn't quite dry. The calipers are set to the widest diameter, the vertical in the picture:
warp_dogwood.jpg
One thing about dogwood which can make it quite unstable and crack easily - if the tree is large enough to have a dark brown heartwood it dries at such a different rate than the sapwood that blanks that expose both on a face are quite likely to crack. I have some success heavily sealing such sides. But with small trees you may not have any dark heartwood.
Is your dogwood mostly white? I've had it from nearly "holly white" to creamy brown with everthing in between. I got one log that was striped inside with reds and greens, and dug up one old stump that was wonderfully spalted!
JKJ
[OP]
Contributor
Thanks Brice and John for the quick response. John, the wood is an off white color with no dark heartwood that I've seen so far.
I took one piece that was approx. 24" and cut it in two pieces and squared it on the band saw. I ended up with 3x squares a foot or so long. I left the pith in it and it is centered. I'm planning on sealing the ends and drying it slowly in my makeshift kiln. If it fails, at least it is free wood. It sure is pretty and dense right now. I have turned a few small items in the past from one other tree that died a few years ago. One bowl turned out beautiful. Looking forward to milling some tomorrow.
Thanks again guys for the info.
My Dad always told me "Can't Never Could".
SWE
Moderator
At the worse case, dogwood makes some of the best firewood!
I've never tried to accelerate drying with a kiln, mostly since I never built a kiln! I started air drying everything almost 20 years ago. I seal the end grain immediately, watch for developing cracks over the first few weeks, then put it up till dry. My failure rate is extremely low - I wonder if some of that is from drying slowly. I process so much wood that even with longer drying times I have way more dry wood than I can turn before I kick the bucket. (I almost always turn dry wood.)
BTW, I seal with "thick" anchorseal. This works better than two coats since the second coat of thin anchorseal doesn't cover well. I make it thick by pouring some into a plastic coffee can and leaving the lid off until it thickens from evaporation.
Like most woods, dogwood will slowly darken with age but not as much as many other woods. Both the cocobolo and dogwood grinders are a little darker now but they both still look good after a dozen years of use.
peppermills_two_comp.jpg
The stand for this pod box is dogwood, as are the second and fourth conductor's batons. The one on the end is a "tap" baton, made from tough dogwood so a band director can vigorously tap out time on the music stand without damaging it like one made from holly! Three of the tool handles are dogwood, darkening a little after years of use.
pod_box_comp.jpg batons2.jpg handle_adapters.jpg
JKJ
Last edited by John K Jordan; 04-09-2020 at 10:59 PM.
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