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Thread: Router or shaper

  1. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by Joe Jensen View Post
    Once you use a shaper with a power feeder you will try to use that over a router table every single time. Sure there are cuts you can't do on a shaper so you need a router. I've been a serious hobbiest for over 40 years. I have never owned a proper router table. When I started in the 1970s Router tables we basically a cheap table that held a 1HP router inverted. We bought an old Craftsman 1HP 1/2" spindle shaper and it ran circles around routers of that day and age. I do have a router plate from Woodpecker or some place that holds 2 HP router. I have not used it since I got a Felder saw/shaper that can spin it's router spindle up to 19,000 RPM.

    Why I prefer using the shaper and in my not so humble opinion a power feeder is a must;
    1) so quiet
    2) Power feeder makes cuts nearly perfect
    3) larger cutter diameter creates way less chipout. With the larger diameter cutters and the power feeder I rarely have to sand profiles. Just the end grain

    Downsides
    1) As is always mentioned, cost. You can buy a used shaper and power feeder for about what a premium router table costs but the cutters are way more. I have lots of cove and roundover cutters, All purchased on ebay. I've spend maybe $50-60 for one. A premium router bit the same size is maybe $19.
    Buy yourself a euroblock to take replaceable knives and the cost equation changes in a hurry for shaper tooling. Here's an example of four roundover radii on one knife for $16.50.

    https://onlinesupply.ca/Drilling-Cut...m-2pcs-3302240
    https://shorturl.at/mRTU3

  2. #32
    Join Date
    May 2013
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    Northern Virginia
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    Quote Originally Posted by brent stanley View Post
    Buy yourself a euroblock to take replaceable knives and the cost equation changes in a hurry for shaper tooling. Here's an example of four roundover radii on one knife for $16.50.

    https://onlinesupply.ca/Drilling-Cut...m-2pcs-3302240
    These used to be $14 regular price from Amazon, with many/most $4 to $7 when on sale
    20200109_184423.jpg

  3. #33
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Upland CA
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    5,548
    I am still back on that "reverse the motor" when using a router bit in a shaper.

    My router bits will not fit upside down in my shaper, like the shaper cutters do. Maybe I am using the wrong brand.
    Rick Potter

    DIY journeyman,
    FWW wannabe.
    AKA Village Idiot.

  4. #34
    Here my thoughts Mike,

    You stop a machine to reverse is mickey mouse if you are running for 2-4 hours at a time which I did. No chance id start and stop a machine 50-100 times or more to run stuff.

    You reverse your machine, does your cutter reverse itself as well?

    A router bit in a shaper is still router. Its now a 1,300 lb router table. The mass is good, the speed is less than half what the bit should run at. One machine I looked at was an inverted pin router, Onsrud inverted pin router. Router tooling, they call it a router.

    The shapers here Grrigio SCM and Poitras non of them take a router bit. The 100 plus auctions I saw one shaper that took a router bit the Felder at B and G and I dont know if they had a collet. Point is 98 percent of the shapers out there dont take router bits. Maybe the new nippon Gacci stuff and high end like Martin have that. Two of my machines are original owner and have all the parts available at the time. No router collets.

    Climb cutting on your router table that will go fine till you find one of your parts in your neighbours back yard. Most important I hand held to do template work because that is total control, you climb cut all day long with a router in your hand, not vise versa.

  5. #35
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    Griswold Connecticut
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    Quote Originally Posted by Warren Lake View Post
    Here my thoughts Mike,

    You stop a machine to reverse is mickey mouse if you are running for 2-4 hours at a time which I did. No chance id start and stop a machine 50-100 times or more to run stuff.

    You reverse your machine, does your cutter reverse itself as well?

    A router bit in a shaper is still router. Its now a 1,300 lb router table. The mass is good, the speed is less than half what the bit should run at. One machine I looked at was an inverted pin router, Onsrud inverted pin router. Router tooling, they call it a router.

    The shapers here Grrigio SCM and Poitras non of them take a router bit. The 100 plus auctions I saw one shaper that took a router bit the Felder at B and G and I dont know if they had a collet. Point is 98 percent of the shapers out there dont take router bits. Maybe the new nippon Gacci stuff and high end like Martin have that. Two of my machines are original owner and have all the parts available at the time. No router collets.

    Climb cutting on your router table that will go fine till you find one of your parts in your neighbours back yard. Most important I hand held to do template work because that is total control, you climb cut all day long with a router in your hand, not vise versa.
    Warren
    I think were approaching things fro a differing perspective.
    I did mix up some thoughts on reversing. I was trying to emphasize the ability to reverse cutter direction, shaper cutters versus router bits, and climb cutting with a router bit, and screwed that sentence up. A router bit spinning in reverse on a shaper will not work at all, no matter what. I apologize for that mis-statement.
    I've done a lot of climb cutting with router bits in a router table, router bits in a shaper table, and shaper cutters in a shaper table. Is it nerve wracking? it can be. Can it be done safely? Yes, I believe so.
    I actually purchased a Festool OF 2200 just to be able use larger cutters in a handheld, template, application, as you have pointed out, so I do understand your point.
    I've not yet spent 2-4 hours doing continuous climb cutting. That's a lot of time with a router in your hand, not matter which direction you're moving it.
    The point I was trying to make is that people somehow have been led to believe that a router bit will not work in a shaper table, accepting of course that the shaper is capable of adapting to a router bit, and I have not found that to be a 100% true statement. Are there limits? Certainly there are limits, but it's not black and white.
    Both machines are extremely versatile and adaptable. It's pretty much up to the ingenuity of the user to maximize that versatility, and adaptability.
    "The first thing you need to know, will likely be the last thing you learn." (Unknown)

  6. #36
    Join Date
    Apr 2018
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    Cambridge Vermont
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    2,282
    People need to remember, the OP was asking about Grizzly's 1.5hp baby shaper. It weighs a little over 200lbs. It has an optional cast iron wing that you can get for it. It's not some huge behemoth that weighs a ton or has a massive table to hold the work. It will never be a serious shaper for large cutters. With a top speed of 10k it'll never handle the smaller router bits as well as a router mounted in a table saw extension. I think it would do well with raised panel router bits (and the like) and maybe some smaller 3/4" cutters. I'm sure if only used occasionally it'll do more than it was designed for. For me personally, I can't see any need for it. However for the OP it could fit nicely into his shop.

  7. #37
    Thanks for all the great feedback. Lots of very good comments and it really help to gain understanding. If I do add a shaper I want to skip the multi step process I have done on my other main tools. 3 stages or table saws, jointers and router tables, 2 stages of bandsaw and planer. I think the 1 1/2 may do what I do today but I don’t think it will allow much growth. Anyway with today’s world any additions will need to wait for my job to stabilize again. One thing I am sure off (for now) is along as the hitachi router is working there is no good reason to replace it with the triton. Right now I will dream of a 3 hp shaper
    thanks again
    gary

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