Centroid Acorn

[Gary Campbell]

Given that I know nothing about controllers.....Where does Centroid sit in relation to other controllers? Thank you.

Ron...
I have been building CNC controllers since I retired from CAMaster. I've used and built controllers for Mach 3, UCCNC, ShopBot, WinCNC and Centroid. All in cooperation with and support from the mfgr., except for Mach. In my capacity in R & D with 2 OEMs I had the opportunity to test a few others. I have not built any for Mach 4, but Mach 3 left a bad taste in my mouth that lingers strong enough to not even want to test Mach 4.

I no longer build controllers with anything other than Centroid or WinCNC and would consider them both a tie at the top for making a CNC machine run properly. On a scale of 1 to 10, I put Centroid and WinCNC tied at 9 and everything else on my list above at a 5 or lower. (for comparison)

[bobby milam]

Ron, I went with Centroid on Gary's recommendation. I have been very pleased. they have a great forum that supports everyone regarless of the type of CNC that they are installing it on. The price is pretty low for what you are getting and the forum is exceptional in helping people get any bugs that they can't figure out on their own. It seems to be getting more and more customizable to user preferences also. I don't regret the upgrade.

[Ron Bontz]

Thanks to every one for the info..

[Jerome Stanek]

Had a small glitch yesterday. Homing wasn't picking up the Macro that says how much offset there is. It just Zeroed it at the offset spot. Also I ended up replacing the network cable as some times it would lose connection even after I replaced the bad end. CNC 12 seems to find the controller faster now also.

[Jim Becker]

Sometimes one gets a wonky network cable that only shows it's true face when something demanding is going on. Good move with replacing it!

[Jerome Stanek]

Well after I had been away from my CNC for a while I went out to run a file but needed to surface my table. The problem I had before reared it's ugly head again. It would start to run then one of the steppers would start to stutter some times it was the X1 then the X2. I ended up sending the controller back to Gary to have a breakout board put in and some adjusting. I have been trying to get it to run but it just won't. I have been working on this problem now for over a week and still have yet to run a file. Gary offered to take it back and I think I will take him up on that but. I am going to be out over $100 just in shipping fee not to mention 3 bits. Gary told me that my steppers are to old to run but they do run fine with my old Shopbot controller with Gecko drives I just have to have one of my boards gone over as the Y is acting up but I ended up moving that to the A drive for now.

[bobby milam]

That sucks. I swapped to Centroid on Gary's recommendation and it has worked out well for me. Sorry to hear that it wasn't able to get your machine up and going reliably. Good to hear that Gary is standing behind it and taking it back. I hope you get a solution for your problem figured out.

[Jerome Stanek]

I see that I have to jump a trace on my old controller lucky I have 2 boards to test on

[Gary Campbell]

Jerry is correct. Since 2016 I have been attempting to produce a price friendly controller for aging ShopBots. During 2016 and 2017 this was done in cooperation with ShopBot and used the SB controller and IO boards. Tech support assisting users to get new controller cards connected to old computers was a nightmare, so end of 2017 I stopped selling REZurrection controls with SB controllers and sent a letter to SB stating the same.

Since that time I have been producing controllers using WinCNC and Centroid controllers. One of the best selling versions is the SB alpha replacement closed loop controller that has been extremely well received and has great reviews. But I still get a lot of requests for "standard grade" (read as economy) replacement controllers. I have found a number of drives that will run the old SB motors, they simply cost more than most SB guys are willing to pay. These setups dont cost as much as buying one from the factory, but do cost more than the least costly alternative.

Like many others, Jerry mentions the machine running fine on G203 Gecko drives. True. The G203v was introduced in 2006 and was designed to be back compatible with the thousands ofPK296*8 and PK299 Oriental motors that were very popular in the US as it would handle motors up to 50 mh inductance. The PK296 motor which many of the SB gearmotors are based on is a very low amp draw and has very high inductance. (~30 mh) High inductance motors are designed to run on higher voltage. The formula from Gecko is 32* (sqrt inductance) or 32* 5.65 =180. Which is a common voltage available from a line voltage (AC) Drive.

ShopBot offers a control board with Geckos, the "4G". Its around $1500 and is a bare board that fits in a PC case. PC Case and power supplies are not included. Use of a PC case is questionable due to inability to provide proper cooling and adherence to current safety standards. They also offer an "RBK Upgrade" control box, which may or may not be compatible with all older motors and if I am correct is currently priced around $4000. (no motors)

I no longer will even attempt to make a budget controller that uses motors that were introduced 15 years ago. The process to try and save a number of SB users money came at a cost of hundreds of emails and a few disappointed old friends. I now only offer them with motors and planetary gearboxes. This product (with motors and gearboxes) includes a Lenovo CNC-PC (Win10Pro, 8GB & WIFI) costs around $500 less than the SB RBK (without motors or PC).

Here is a short promo video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RmOXoVowNgk

So as you can see this is about new products, old products and money. Not that price is not important, but I feel my pricing is very fair, and is more than half of the factory products when using an "apples to apples" comparison. I have higher priced control boxes that will run those old motors that are still a grand less than the factory RBK that will run the high inductance motors. I find it hard to advise a friend to spend a grand more to support 20 year old motors that most likely have excessive backlash and could be nearing end of life.

In violation of common sense and industry standard to not offer refunds on custom built electronics products, Jerry was offered new motors at a reduced price or a refund. He even asked about his motor model on the Centroid forum. He received an answer from a long time SB guy with an EE degree explaining the deficiencies of those old motors and recommending he seek out newer ones. Since I made the offer via email, I mis-assumed I would receive an answer via email, not by reading his sob story on 2 forums. Sad, so sad. I suggest sir, that if this is how you conduct business, you would be a perfect customer for a SB control box.

[Jerome Stanek]

As Gary said it is about old products and not money. I was sold on the Acorn from Gary as he claims would be a plug and play but after many hours and back and forth with Gary the only option was spending more money that when he claimed that this would bring my machine up a step. I still can't fathom why the Acorn will run the steppers fine using the arrow keys and the g command but can not handle a simple file that tells the machine to make a full circuit around the table. At least I don't claim something that I can't deliver. Yes Gary did refund money. All I ever wanted was a reliable controller that was supposed to be plug and play.

[Bill George]

On my machine I just sold I ran Mach3 with Ethernet and Warp9 and had a couple of minor issues, but there are thousands of CNC machines running it commercially everyday without issues. I did upgrade to Mach4 and it was light years ahead. I think the bigger issues was the dependence on the parallel port interface and its problems. On my new small hobby sized machine its Mach4 and PMDX USB on Windows 10, seems to be fine.

[Marty Escarcega]

As Gary said it is about old products and not money. I was sold on the Acorn from Gary as he claims would be a plug and play but after many hours and back and forth with Gary the only option was spending more money that when he claimed that this would bring my machine up a step. I still can't fathom why the Acorn will run the steppers fine using the arrow keys and the g command but can not handle a simple file that tells the machine to make a full circuit around the table. At least I don't claim something that I can't deliver. Yes Gary did refund money. All I ever wanted was a reliable controller that was supposed to be plug and play.

I can attest after MANY Centroid Acorn builds that the control itself is solid. You spent the money on the control, but then it sounds like you tried to save a few dollars by keeping the old, open loop steppers. I would have replaced those old motors and spent a few hundred more on closed loop motors and drives. You would have had a much more reliable, robust system. At the very least you should have upgraded the old stepper motors to motors Gary would have or probably recommended. Gary is a stand up guy with many satisfied customers. His background with ShopBot and knowledge of CNC router controls is one of the best I have come across.

I wasn't clear, did you send the control back to Gary? If so, are you going back to your old control?

Best of luck.
Marty

[Jerome Stanek]

Yes I did send it back and will be going back to a controller that works. What bothered me was I was mislead to believe that it was plug and play with my steppers. As for getting the steppers from Gary that would be like you buy a car and after you pay for it they ask you if you want an engine for it. The steppers Gary sells never came up until the controller would only run mine with G moves or arrows makes no sense as the file tells it to move using G code

[Bill George]

As I recall the steppers were new in 2008, as was the machine.

[Marty Escarcega]

Yes I did send it back and will be going back to a controller that works. What bothered me was I was mislead to believe that it was plug and play with my steppers. As for getting the steppers from Gary that would be like you buy a car and after you pay for it they ask you if you want an engine for it. The steppers Gary sells never came up until the controller would only run mine with G moves or arrows makes no sense as the file tells it to move using G code

It wasn't the controller. It is possible the original steppers were not configured correctly in the Centroid CNC12 software.
Why didn't you upgrade the old steppers?
Its like buying a high performance engine for your car and then keeping the original stock tires on it.

Centroid control works. You need to understand the control in order to configure it properly. What are you going to change to? There are certainly many options out there. Its all about matching components, configuration and the user interface and understanding all of them.

Have you done a CNC conversion from scratch?
Hopefully you will find something that works best for you, and learn along the way.
Marty