PSA: Hand Sanitizer recipe

[Ole Anderson]

You must have cruised Norwegian. We were on the Epic in December of '13.

Holland America numerous times. Must be a Phillipino thing.

[roger wiegand]

"Hand sanitizer", whether commercial or home made is lousy at killing this virus. Wash with soap and water.

[Roger Feeley]

Ok, thread hijacked.

My first industrial arts teaching job was at a jr high school for kids who had been expelled from at least two other schools. The way I got them motivated was building speaker enclosures. The book we used was Badmieff and Davis “How to build speaker enclosures”. The district was very prosperous so burying speakers and crossovers wasn’t a problem. I had the kids using a frequency generator and oscilloscope to calculate free air resonance. The math teacher chipped in to calculate volume and the parameters on the tuned port. My shop class became a speaker building class. That got me through the semester.

I remember one kid in particular who got in a lot of fights. He was going bald and the other kids teased him so he pretty much beat the crap out of everyone. About the time he made his reputation, he would be expelled and would have to pulverize a new student body. We let him (and everyone else) wear a hat.

[Scott Snyder]

"Hand sanitizer", whether commercial or home made is lousy at killing this virus. Wash with soap and water.

Pardon, but your comment is contradicted by the CDC and is just plain wrong.

"If soap and water are not readilyavailable, use a hand sanitizer that contains at least 60% alcohol.. Cover all surfaces of your hands and rub them together until they feel dry."

1) Essentially all commercially available hand sanitizers contain at least 60% isopropyl alcohol.
2) The CDC is staffed by Infectious Disease specialists as well as virologists.
3) May I ask, what are your credentials?

The only thing more harmful than no information is BAD information.

Have a nice day.
Scott Snyder M.D.

[Roger Feeley]

Hi Scott,
not to pick nits but I read that there are alcohol free sanitizers out there which aren’t effective against viruses. That’s why the CDC is careful to specify the alcohol content. In the Coronavirus panic, some folks are buying the alcohol free stuff at crazy prices.

I was just joking with my family that we could make our own sanitizer.
— we keep glycerin around to make bubble stuff for the grandkids.
— I have all sorts of alcohol including ever clear for pie crusts, rubbing and denatured.
— the bride makes soap so we have essential oils for a nice smell

[Scott Snyder]

Hi Scott,
not to pick nits but I read that there are alcohol free sanitizers out there which aren’t effective against viruses. That’s why the CDC is careful to specify the alcohol content. In the Coronavirus panic, some folks are buying the alcohol free stuff at crazy prices.

Thank you for the clarification and for reaffirming my contention about bad information.
Admittedly there is some hyperbole in the lay press about COVID-19 but I contend that managing critically ill patients on a ventilator gives credence to the adage "it matters whose ox is being gored". It's difficult to see hyperbole in the ICU.
Scott

[David Bassett]

... "If soap and water are not readily available, ...

If what is reported to come from local health officials is correct, that is the key bit. They explain that hand sanitizer doesn't work well on dirty, oily, or sweaty hands and is only really effective in "touching up" / maintaining a recent good hand wash. Clearly it's better than nothing when it's all you have, but don't grab some and walk passed the sink.

[roger wiegand]

Pardon, but your comment is contradicted by the CDC and is just plain wrong.

"If soap and water are not readilyavailable, use a hand sanitizer that contains at least 60% alcohol.. Cover all surfaces of your hands and rub them together until they feel dry."

1) Essentially all commercially available hand sanitizers contain at least 60% isopropyl alcohol.
2) The CDC is staffed by Infectious Disease specialists as well as virologists.
3) May I ask, what are your credentials?

The only thing more harmful than no information is BAD information.

Have a nice day.
Scott Snyder M.D.

A mere PhD in molecular genetics and 30 years of experience in antiviral and other anti-infective drug discovery. I've looked at more ways to kill viruses than you can shake a stick at, but I'm not a doctor.

Here's the recommendation form the CDC website: "Household members should clean hands often, including immediately after removing gloves and after contact with an ill person, by washing hands with soap and water for 20 seconds. If soap and water are not available and hands are not visibly dirty, an alcohol-based hand sanitizer that contains at least 60% alcohol may be used. However, if hands are visibly dirty, always wash hands with soap and water."

Hand sanitizers are recommended as a backup when soap and water is not feasible because they are less effective than soap and water for this virus. So yes, use them if you don't have access to soap and water, but know that you could be doing something more effective. Thorough and correct use might well be only a log difference, but the quick swipe with sanitizer probably is much worse than that. In the lab we showed across several virus families that 60% ethanol was pretty marginal (2-4 log kill) for surface decontamination, 90% was better (5 log), but only something like 10% bleach or betadine was fully effective.

You have a great day too.

[Doug Dawson]

only something like 10% bleach or betadine was fully effective.

Bleach is awesome. Hard on the hands though. (I think 6% is the Clorox supermarket stuff, 10-12% stuff is the pool chemical that I keep around in boxes.) Stains clothes, of course, so be careful.

[Frederick Skelly]

Those are sure impressive credentials Roger. Thanks for the information Sir.
Fred

[Tom Stenzel]

... In the lab we showed across several virus families that 60% ethanol was pretty marginal (2-4 log kill) for surface decontamination, 90% was better (5 log), but only something like 10% bleach or betadine was fully effective.
You have a great day too.

So if I stop at the liquor store and pick up some, um, tonsil sanitizer it needs to be 120 proof or more. Hmmm. I might not be able to follow that advise to the letter.

Thanks for the info though.

-Tom

[Pat Barry]

So if I stop at the liquor store and pick up some, um, tonsil sanitizer it needs to be 120 proof or more. Hmmm. I might not be able to follow that advise to the letter.

Thanks for the info though.

-Tom

I stopped at multiple grocery and drug stores today and all were sold out of Isopropyl alchohol and other DIY hand sanitizer supplies.