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Thread: Let's Get This (Slider) Party Started

  1. #16
    If you have room, get a 10' stroke, you won't regret it as you will be able to straighten and rip 10' solid stock w/o removing the crosscut fence. For sheet goods I would go with the 48" rip width.Suppose you need two 48" crosscuts out of an 8' sheet- if the blade is less than 48" off the wall you won't be able to do it. I would be looking for a used saw and not afraid to add a phase converter, but that's me. Your entry door is quite limiting, not just for getting a new machine in.

  2. #17
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    I agree with the 9-10' stroke for sure since you stated goal is processing sheet goods. I have an 8'6" wagon and while i "can" rip sheet stock on it, things are really tight for a full stroke with the scoring blade engaged. Mine is SCM/Minimax which I'm extremely happy with, but I'd surely be enamored with Felder, too. Great equipment.

    I honestly do agree with the suggestion to perhaps update your door situation; not just for getting a new machine in there, but it will make things a LOT easer for loading/unloading material and finished products, too. It also makes for nice ventilation during temperate times of the year. My setup is a double, outward opening insulated steel door setup which is effectively 72" wide. These are in a space that was originally a garage type door which I trashed many years ago.
    --

    The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...

  3. #18
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    Erik,

    That's fine - the k500 will work for some folks for sure, when I quoted the k500 and the k700 there wasn't a huge dollar difference and I wasn't willing to live with the Hammer internals and I think a few other things for that amount of money. For me it was either Hammer or k700 at the time. But that's me willing to spend a few thousand more as at the time it would have been at the time the last saw I would buy so not a lot of dollars over 25-30 years, I think some forget to think this way when purchasing a piece of equipment like this... .



    Quote Originally Posted by Erik Loza View Post
    Mark, not sure I agree. There are two shops in my area with K500's. One in my neighborhood, in fact. That customer bought his about a year ago. The others are the second owners (they bought it, used) and that machine is about 6-7 years old. Zero issues with either. In fact, both guys love them. I think it's easy to say "if you are a pro shop, you must have this beefy thing", and do I sell a lot of beefy sliders, too, but try to remind myself that for the one-man shop doing a kitchen or so a month, something like a K500S puts them light years ahead of a standard cabinet saw and also makes a lot of sense from cost/benefit standpoint. Just my experience. Pic of 7-year old machine for proof.
    Attachment 423901

    Erik
    Last edited by Mark e Kessler; 01-18-2020 at 1:00 AM.

  4. #19
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    Go look at them for yourself, I would bet the Hammer and k500 will not meet your expectations. The k700s is a good compromise but I am disappointing I didn't get a quote on the 900 series.

    I find the 9' is enough with clamping but I only do 10- 20 sheets of ply a year, with a clamp in the rear position it's a little tight I don't even use the clamps on full sheets. yes Air clamps are over kill, never needed or clamped anything on a slider but now that I have them couldn't live without them for the smaller and tricky cuts.

    FWIW - I am not saying that the Hammer or K500 isn't a good value and won't work, I just know where you are coming from (even though I don't know you- duh) I think the same would be true for the lower end SCM's as well.



    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Hockenberg View Post
    Mark - Technically hobby. BUT, I come from owning a commercial shop and my experience is with a big SCMI slider, Streibig panel saw, Biesse Rover, etc.. I'm used to getting commercial quality cuts on sheet goods and solids. This is why I mentioned a 9'+ slider at the start. I'm not willing to give up on quality to save dollars. At the same time I don't think I need a new Martin/Altendorf, etc. and don't have the space to get one in anyway.

  5. #20
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    Mark H,

    If you are looking at 8' or longer slide than you will be looking at the "S" so K700s for example, technically you can put the 8' on a non "S" but i was told it was not recommended due to potential tipping when loaded heavy

    Here the layout drawing to the K700s

    Mark K

    IMG_4254.jpg



    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Hockenberg View Post
    Patrick - Current K700 schematic shows a chassis width of 940mm (37"). So that's why I'm challenged on the shop door. I'd love to build a new shop building but that adds six figures to the saw price
    Attached Images Attached Images

  6. #21
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    Get the 48", I rarely need it but you can butt up against a wall and put a bandsaw or other things to utilize the space, you won't really loose any space. I don't think its even an upcharge, if you decide you want the 31" you would just need to remove the table and modify it (it's one piece now, used to be 2 - if you have the overarm guard it can be installed in both locations without modifications.

    "- Since most work is the the left of the blade, and I almost never use the 48" capacity on my cabinet saw, will I regret getting a slider with a 31" rip capacity?"


    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Hockenberg View Post
    I'm about ready to retire my Unisaw and move up to a slider. I welcome your advise.

    Here are my requirements/constraints/questions:
    - I'm located in the Denver area.
    - Thinking about SCM and Felder. I suppose these are the default choices. What else should I look at?
    - I frequently work with 4' x 8' sheet goods. My understanding is that a 9' - 10' slider is best to accommodate 8 foot sheets. I have the space for either length. What length is ideal?
    - My shop door opening is small at 32". The Felder K500S should fit through as the width of the main machine is 759mm. Not sure about SCM or others yet.
    - Since most work is the the left of the blade, and I almost never use the 48" capacity on my cabinet saw, will I regret getting a slider with a 31" rip capacity?

    Thanks in advance
    Cheers,
    Mark

  7. #22
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    I wouldnt go for the short rip unless your space limited. I cant count the times I've been cross cutting 12' material with 8' on the wagon. A ton of times using the fence as an outboard stop for wide cuts/off cuts.
    Sometimes I just want to look at pretty pictures,... Thats when I go to the Turners Forum

  8. #23
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    Oct 2007
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Bolton View Post
    I wouldnt go for the short rip unless your space limited. I cant count the times I've been cross cutting 12' material with 8' on the wagon. A ton of times using the fence as an outboard stop for wide cuts/off cuts.
    I agree. Since I got the slider I retired the RAS and don't have a SCMS, so I break stock down on the slider. When crosscutting an 8 or 10 foot piece of lumber the support on the right/outboard side is nice, and I've used the fence for an outboard stop, too. I even made a short fence so I didn't have to pull 3/4 of the fence back to clear the front of the blade.

  9. #24
    i agree with the "get the 10' if you can fit it" - it's common that i find myself needing to straight-line lumber longer than 8'.

    why not consider the entry level Martin machine?

  10. #25
    If your accustomed to Striebig and Martin level machinery, the "entry level" class of machinery tends to feel dinky.

  11. #26
    well, i have a Martin T60, and it most definitely doesn't feel dinky.

  12. #27
    Join Date
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bill Dufour View Post
    I would suggest cutting the wall and framing in at least 36 inch door. Maybe even a french door. Tell the keepper of the purse it will improve energy efficiancy with a new well insulated door.
    Bill D
    I agree. Even though that Felder K500 is 2" narrower than the existing opening, it weighs more than 1,300 lbs and will likely be a massive PIA to wrestle through that door. A 36" or larger would make things considerably easier.

  13. #28
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    I’d also cut the door opening. Easy as can be.

    I’d really consider used. A old Scmi the green years David Kum will maybe chime in on exact models or a used Martin I’d say Also 80’s ish T72....

    I have seen both for sale recently for much less money than new. Like 1/3 of new in great condition and you will have a way nicer machine without all kinds of electronic stuff to worry about.

    Or I’d go no lower than the Martin T-60c. Surely the T60 is not rinky dinky but by comparison to a older Martin 72-73-75 it is. But not compared to new scmi Or Felder the Martin T-60 will be like a Mazda to 5 series BMW. Entry level Scmi and Felder are like tin cans by comparison.

    Recently and local to me there was a t72 in great shape selling for $3500. If I didn’t already have a slider I would have purchased it. Almost did and put it into storage For when I have more space.

    If I was gong to buy anything entry level it would be a Griggrio if they are still in business. They used to make a entry level machine for Martin that was re badged and sold just under the T-60. I’d never pay for the Martin branded one but if the Martin was to expensive for me and new was important Griggrio would win hands down without question.

    Also bar none get the 52 rip fence. It becomes a bump stop and a integral way of at least how I use a slider. And if you have the room get 10hp’ sliding table anything less will become annoying. The first time you can’t do something on your “new very expensive space hog toy” you will surely be bummed out.
    Last edited by Patrick Walsh; 01-18-2020 at 8:54 AM.

  14. #29
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    Jan 2008
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    Western Nebraska
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Hockenberg View Post
    I'm about ready to retire my Unisaw and move up to a slider. I welcome your advise.

    Here are my requirements/constraints/questions:
    - I'm located in the Denver area.
    - Thinking about SCM and Felder. I suppose these are the default choices. What else should I look at?
    - I frequently work with 4' x 8' sheet goods. My understanding is that a 9' - 10' slider is best to accommodate 8 foot sheets. I have the space for either length. What length is ideal?
    - My shop door opening is small at 32". The Felder K500S should fit through as the width of the main machine is 759mm. Not sure about SCM or others yet.
    - Since most work is the the left of the blade, and I almost never use the 48" capacity on my cabinet saw, will I regret getting a slider with a 31" rip capacity?

    Thanks in advance
    Cheers,
    Mark
    Only thing to add is that with my CF741 I'd use the wider rip a lot. Because its a combo machine, the jointer is the right side, I get an effective rip of around 32". It's perfectly adequate to process, BUT when you want to crosscut something like a 10' long board to 6' on the slider, you have a 4' cut off to the right. That means the rip fence has to come off because there isn't enough room to just park it to the right further. It'd be a faster process without having take the fence on and off, so I end up using a chop saw to. That's also less than ideal because it's another station to move stock to and from.

    Most of the stock I get comes in at 10', so a 60" rip plus a little for the fence head would be required to cover the range of possibility. That's just silly though, so I'll deal with it. The sliders other pro's far outweigh this one con.

    My less than perfect solution is to batch process the long crosscuts to minimize the fence removal. Sometimes my feeble old mind misses something though and I end up making an extra step or 5.

  15. #30
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    Sep 2009
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    Three Rivers, Central Oregon
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    A 42" wide insulated steel pre-hung door is under $500, and if you have any carpentry skills installation is not difficult.
    Scott Vroom

    If all you have is a hammer, everything looks like a nail.

    Bernard Baruch

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