Good and reasonably priced track saw

[Mark Bolton]

> Track saws can be very cumbersome and slow to use with the hose, the depth lock (thumb to release depth) and the electronic speed control in that if your finger flutters on the trigger for a split second the saw will wind down like its unplugged.

the more u spend, the more problems are solved. I too found my Festool track use a bit cumbersome, but effective. But then, I went with the TS55 Battery saw, and it was a game changer. no cord, no dust hose. I was doubtful of both the dust collection ability and the power.... remarkably, both were superb. Now, finally my track system is easy to use.

But on the subject of cumbersome, with all tracks, measuring can be tricky....which side of the blade is your waste piece, blade thickness, support pieces for track for over cut, thin board cut, etc. You need to be a problem solve to get all the set up right, so I agree on those parts, but thats what it takes to get a dust free, splinter free and straight cut. .

Dust free is a convenient conclusion as is splinter free. Broken record, all depends on what your doing. Cut some sharp nasty material, and youll roach your "vinyl strip". If you keep a few on hand thats fine.

Setting up on one side of the cut or the other is a nightmare which us why I say its still a coarse break down tool not a finish item. Even finely tuned there is enough rack in the saw/track to produce a less than usable end cut unless you take great pains.

But it is a handy tool.

Call me old school but I dont think I will ever trade a cord for a battery. But Im in the profit making world. Cord management as painful as it is is still far better than the best batteries on the planet when your focused on production. Its just not there yet. Power, endless power, and if your hoping for DC, youve got the hose anyway so a cord is nothing more to deal with.

I find myself breaking down with the nuisance of the cord and hose at times (especially for solid surface) merely for the dust collecton of the fines. The TS by no means catches it all, but any amount of sweeping that can be avoided is appreciated for the nuisance of the hose and cord.

[Will Blick]

BTW, it was a few years ago, one of the ww magazines tested all the Track Saws... and IIRC, the Makita tied the Festool for first place for power.

[Will Blick]

AGreed that a cord has endless power...and agreed if you have to deal with a vac hose anyway, the cord is minor issue. Hence why I mentioned the battery system eliminated both.

As u know, Festool serves mostly those in the trades, hence why they made their battery saw have enough capacity to cut 3/4" Ply the length of a football field on a single charge. I never cut that much at once, but it is very impressive how much capacity I have experienced of the dual battery system. Most users like myself, keep a spare set on the charger.

I am not a Festool fanboy by any stretch, I call em as I see em, and have had issues with their products.

I never cut nasty material, so never experienced the problems u suggested. But u do raise another good point, the cost of maintaining the splinter strips, splinter guard on the saws, bottom pads, they can add up fast.

As for racking, twisting, etc. The best you can do is use good technique, push straight down so the bottom rail pads bites the material (which is why you need to keep the bottom clean, and replace those pads as well over time) I also gave up on joining rails, as these joint(s) introduces an additional point of error, either during set up, or flex during use. But as mentioned above, the long rail for a full sheet cut is about $330....

[Jack Lilley]

I just bought a WEN off Amazon. It was less than $200 with 2 sections of track and clamps, has good reviews on youtube. I won't use it allot so it should be good enough for me. It works great, smooth, clean and straight cuts. The dust collection works well.

[Will Blick]

That's great Jack, you can't go wrong at that price.

Since these threads get read long after they die out, I would like to add...
Everyone has different needs for these track saws. For me, its on/off use...
If I was to start this journey over, I would have not invested so much in my track system. Instead, I would have widened my shop space for the cabinet saw. I would use a low cost track system to break down 8ft sheets (or have the lumber yard do it) to sizes close to my final dimensions, then clean them up on my cabinet saw. If no side is larger than 4ft, I could have made it work. its rare I have parts greater than 4ft on their longest dimension.

I dont work on job sites, so for those users, they don't have this option. I also dont do large architectural ww that sometimes requires long rips. Live n learn

[Dave Sabo]

But on the subject of cumbersome, with all tracks, measuring can be tricky....

um.............no, its not. Have you ever used one? You simply measure like anything else. Then draw your witness marks and lay your guide rail with the splinter strips on the edge of those marks. The splinter strip tells you exactly where your kerf is going to be. The cut is always on the right side of that splinter strip. (well with saws other than Kreg) . Figuring your waste side is no more or less difficult with a tracksaw than it is with a skilsaw.

You need to be a problem solver to get all the set up right,

Yup! this is pretty much what woodworking is whether you use a tablesaw, handsaw, chisel, router or any other tools. Design, layout, and thinking about workflow is the job.

Dust free is a convenient conclusion as is splinter free

for some, for others it's a necessity.

VCut some sharp nasty material, and youll roach your "vinyl strip

such as ........?

I've cut honeycomb aluminum and carbon fiber with mine and neither time did I have to replace the splinter strip because of roaching.

Even finely tuned there is enough rack in the saw/track to produce a less than usable end cut unless you take great pains.

Simply NOT TRUE . We've been using tracksaws for over two decades fitting imported kitchens costing upwards of $100k. The panels we cut onsite range from high gloss lacquer, laminate, and exotic veneers like rosewood, ovangkol, and walnut. A fubar or unacceptable panel costs thousands and takes months to re-order. There's really no room for error. We've never re-ordered because our tracksaws screwed the pooch. And, I can tell you we don't spend more than 3-4 minutes measuring, marking, setting the track, and then cutting.

BTW, it was a few years ago, one of the ww magazines tested all the Track Saws... and IIRC, the Makita tied the Festool for first place for power.

Could be, but real world users pretty much all agree that the Festool electric is light in the pants. Their battery version is stronger. Mafell is king of power.

the cost of maintaining the splinter strips, splinter guard on the saws, bottom pads, they can add up fast.

Not for me. I have never, repeat never replaced the top glide strips on any festool tracks in 20+ years. Nor have I replaced the bottom anti-slip pads. I used one that's 15+ years old on Monday all still original. It gets used several times a months on very expensive kitchen panels. The splinter guard does get replaced, especially with a new blade. But it's the cost of the tool, just like a new sawblade or sandpaper. You don't paint replacing those as a drawback, do you ?

I also gave up on joining rails, as these joint(s) introduces an additional point of error, either during set up, or flex during use. But as mentioned above, the long rail for a full sheet cut is about $330....

Again , not for us. We get very accurate results joining two festool rails , and they don't flex while cutting. The secret is to verify (and modify if necessary) the end's' squareness and to leave a very minute gap between two joined rails. .5mm or so. If you want a long rail 8' or more, then Makita's 108" is an absolute bargain at around $200. This assumes your saw works on that type rail, which many do.

[Will Blick]

---Quote---
But on the subject of cumbersome, with all tracks, measuring can be tricky....
---End Quote---
um.............no, its not. Have you ever used one?

Yes Dave. If you read my posts, I have $5K tied up in Festool rail system including both the TS 55 and TS75 and quite the asoortment of rails, clamps, measuring devices, etc. Again, I wrote all this above, sorry to repeat myself. I have been using the rail system for 12+ years...maybe its possible Dave when I hit 20 yrs of use, my experiences will match yours?

> You simply measure like anything else. Then draw you witness marks and lay you guide rail with the splinter strips on the edge of those marks. The splinter strip tells you *exactly *where your kerf is going to be. The cut is always on the right side of that splinter strip. (well with saws other than Kreg) . Figuring your waste side is no more or less difficult with a tracksaw than it is with a skilsaw.

Thx for explaining the obvious Dave. How to draw a line...hmmm, never knew how to mark a line, thx. I dont want this thread to go off on a complete tangent. But IMO, u are over generalizing. Maybe if you use the SAME saw, with the SAME blade, with the SAME rails, and do the SAME type of cuts over and over, then yes, you can get better results and consistent results. What happens when you use a blade that has slightly wider or less wide kerf, now your splinter strip is not true to the old blade. Placing measurements along a 8ft sheet itself can be slightly prone to minor errors, specially when you are shooting for a parallel cut to the reference edge. Is it possible, of course it its. Is it easier than setting the fence on a sliding TS? Not in my experience.
Also, when cutting thinner long strips, specially on short width boards, the waste side is UNDER the rail! Often you have to then support the rail when the piece is not of sufficeint width to support the rail. Again, this is what happens in my real world, but obviously not yours. These are all real issues Dave, and are even mentioned on the FOG.

> You need to be a problem solver to get all the set up right,
---End Quote---
Yup! this is pretty much what woodworking is whether you use a tablesaw, handsaw, chisel, router or any other tools. Design, layout, and thinking about workflow is the job.


Thx again for mentioning the obvious. Again setting my fence on TS is simple, fast and reliable. I use the Incra LS system, VERY accurate and easy to set. I dont find the same true for setting rails. Maybe if I set the rail once, with edge guide measuring, and its right, then repeat it for 100 cuts, yeah, its a fast and reliable system, but not everyone does this. For me, almost every cut I make on sheet goods is different length. Maybe we have different work type, different workflow? Is that possible Dave? I dont want to de rail this thread to get into more details.


---Quote---
Even finely tuned there is enough rack in the saw/track to produce a less than usable end cut unless you take great pains.
---End Quote---
Simply *NOT TRUE *. We've been using tracksaws for over two decades fitting imported kitchens costing upwards of $100k. The panels we cut onsite range from high gloss lacquer, laminate, and exotic veneers like rosewood, ovangkol, and walnut. A fubar or unacceptable panel costs thousands and takes months to re-order. There's really no room for error. We've never re-ordered because our tracksaws screwed the pooch. And, I can tell you we don't spend more than 3-4 minutes measuring, marking setting the track and cutting.

I will agree with the previous posters who mentioned this, as its been my experience too. I have cut many long rip cuts with single rails. They often need to be straight for edge glue ups. I will use under rail clamps, to help prevent no movement. I then check my cut edge with my 6ft Starett straight edge, (prob. .001" tolerance over the entire length), and occasionaly I will get some straight cuts. Other times I see the flashlight shining through the cut edge and the Starett. HOw far out? it varies, 2-10 thou. Why does this happen? You can get some rail deflection...which should not be that big of a surprise, its a long rail, and the rails are not exactly robust. (for good reasons) Yes good technique helps, but again, I dont find it 100% perfect like you do. When I took a Festool class 10 yrs ago, even the instructor had a cut or two which was not perfectly straight. So, maybe you are greatest Festool user on planet earth, and the rest of us need to catch up to your skillset.


---Quote---
the cost of maintaining the splinter strips, splinter guard on the saws, bottom pads, they can add up fast.
---End Quote---
Not for me. I have never, repeat never replaced the top glide strips on any festool tracks in 20+ years.

Either have I...and I dont recall anyone saying they replace the top strips, right??

> Nor have I replaced the bottom anti-slip pads. I used one that's 15+ years old on Monday all still original. It gets used several times a months on very expensive kitchen panels.

> I have had these anti slip pads disinigrate over time when exposed to desert heat, some finish or glue can occasionaly get on them. Also, they loose their tack, I do keep them clean, as I noticed the rail does not move on the material as much when the anti slip strip is wiped cleaned. Again, maybe your anti slip strips can be full of fine sawdust, and yet, still bite the wood as well vs. cleaned anti slip strip...if so, kudos to you Dave! Thats not my experience.
As for cost, I simply mentioned, there is also maint. cost with these items, as this thread was about minimizing cost. Just trying to be helpful.


> The splinter guard does get replaced, especially with a new blade. But it's the cost of the tool, just like a new sawblade or sandpaper.

Or, what happens when they loose their tack, and begin to fall off, a mix of temperature extremes, being bumped, etc. This is my experience Dave, sorry it does not jive with your experience.

This response reminds me of typical FOG responses of 10 years ago, if you dont drink the GREEN KOOL AID, the force will be after you! I buy lots of Festool tools...and many of them I like, some I have a few small issues with, but I like to be honest with fellow ww's, vs. blind loyalty to a manufacturer. I noticed on the FOG recently, many users are coming out of the closet and being honest, nice to see that.

[David Buchhauser]

I couldn't read the yellow print, so .....

---Quote---
But on the subject of cumbersome, with all tracks, measuring can be tricky....
---End Quote---
um.............no, its not. Have you ever used one?

Yes Dave. If you read my posts, I have $5K tied up in Festool rail system including both the TS 55 and TS75 and quite the asoortment of rails, clamps, measuring devices, etc. Again, I wrote all this above, sorry to repeat myself. I have been using the rail system for 12+ years...maybe its possible Dave when I hit 20 yrs of use, my experiences will match yours?

> You simply measure like anything else. Then draw you witness marks and lay you guide rail with the splinter strips on the edge of those marks. The splinter strip tells you *exactly *where your kerf is going to be. The cut is always on the right side of that splinter strip. (well with saws other than Kreg) . Figuring your waste side is no more or less difficult with a tracksaw than it is with a skilsaw.

Thx for explaining the obvious Dave. How to draw a line...hmmm, never knew how to mark a line, thx. I dont want this thread to go off on a complete tangent. But IMO, u are over generalizing. Maybe if you use the SAME saw, with the SAME blade, with the SAME rails, and do the SAME type of cuts over and over, then yes, you can get better results and consistent results. What happens when you use a blade that has slightly wider or less wide kerf, now your splinter strip is not true to the old blade. Placing measurements along a 8ft sheet itself can be slightly prone to minor errors, specially when you are shooting for a parallel cut to the reference edge. Is it possible, of course it its. Is it easier than setting the fence on a sliding TS? Not in my experience.
Also, when cutting thinner long strips, specially on short width boards, the waste side is UNDER the rail! Often you have to then support the rail when the piece is not of sufficeint width to support the rail. Again, this is what happens in my real world, but obviously not yours. These are all real issues Dave, and are even mentioned on the FOG.
> You need to be a problem solver to get all the set up right,
---End Quote---
Yup! this is pretty much what woodworking is whether you use a tablesaw, handsaw, chisel, router or any other tools. Design, layout, and thinking about workflow is the job.
Thx again for mentioning the obvious. Again setting my fence on TS is simple, fast and reliable. I use the Incra LS system, VERY accurate and easy to set. I dont find the same true for setting rails. Maybe if I set the rail once, with edge guide measuring, and its right, then repeat it for 100 cuts, yeah, its a fast and reliable system, but not everyone does this. For me, almost every cut I make on sheet goods is different length. Maybe we have different work type, different workflow? Is that possible Dave? I dont want to de rail this thread to get into more details.


---Quote---
Even finely tuned there is enough rack in the saw/track to produce a less than usable end cut unless you take great pains.
---End Quote---
Simply *NOT TRUE *. We've been using tracksaws for over two decades fitting imported kitchens costing upwards of $100k. The panels we cut onsite range from high gloss lacquer, laminate, and exotic veneers like rosewood, ovangkol, and walnut. A fubar or unacceptable panel costs thousands and takes months to re-order. There's really no room for error. We've never re-ordered because our tracksaws screwed the pooch. And, I can tell you we don't spend more than 3-4 minutes measuring, marking setting the track and cutting.

I will agree with the previous posters who mentioned this, as its been my experience too. I have cut many long rip cuts with single rails. They often need to be straight for edge glue ups. I will use under rail clamps, to help prevent no movement. I then check my cut edge with my 6ft Starett straight edge, (prob. .001" tolerance over the entire length), and occasionaly I will get some straight cuts. Other times I see the flashlight shining through the cut edge and the Starett. HOw far out? it varies, 2-10 thou. Why does this happen? You can get some rail deflection...which should not be that big of a surprise, its a long rail, and the rails are not exactly robust. (for good reasons) Yes good technique helps, but again, I dont find it 100% perfect like you do. When I took a Festool class 10 yrs ago, even the instructor had a cut or two which was not perfectly straight. So, maybe you are greatest Festool user on planet earth, and the rest of us need to catch up to your skillset.


---Quote---
the cost of maintaining the splinter strips, splinter guard on the saws, bottom pads, they can add up fast.
---End Quote---
Not for me. I have never, repeat never replaced the top glide strips on any festool tracks in 20+ years.

Either have I...and I dont recall anyone saying they replace the top strips, right??

> Nor have I replaced the bottom anti-slip pads. I used one that's 15+ years old on Monday all still original. It gets used several times a months on very expensive kitchen panels.

> I have had these anti slip pads disinigrate over time when exposed to desert heat, some finish or glue can occasionaly get on them. Also, they loose their tack, I do keep them clean, as I noticed the rail does not move on the material as much when the anti slip strip is wiped cleaned. Again, maybe your anti slip strips can be full of fine sawdust, and yet, still bite the wood as well vs. cleaned anti slip strip...if so, kudos to you Dave! Thats not my experience.
As for cost, I simply mentioned, there is also maint. cost with these items, as this thread was about minimizing cost. Just trying to be helpful.


> The splinter guard does get replaced, especially with a new blade. But it's the cost of the tool, just like a new sawblade or sandpaper.

Or, what happens when they loose their tack, and begin to fall off, a mix of temperature extremes, being bumped, etc. This is my experience Dave, sorry it does not jive with your experience.

This response reminds me of typical FOG responses of 10 years ago, if you dont drink the GREEN KOOL AID, the force will be after you! I buy lots of Festool tools...and many of them I like, some I have a few small issues with, but I like to be honest with fellow ww's, vs. blind loyalty to a manufacturer. I noticed on the FOG recently, many users are coming out of the closet and being honest, nice to see that.

[Mark Bolton]

AGreed that a cord has endless power...and agreed if you have to deal with a vac hose anyway, the cord is minor issue. Hence why I mentioned the battery system eliminated both.

As u know, Festool serves mostly those in the trades, hence why they made their battery saw have enough capacity to cut 3/4" Ply the length of a football field on a single charge. I never cut that much at once, but it is very impressive how much capacity I have experienced of the dual battery system. Most users like myself, keep a spare set on the charger.

I am not a Festool fanboy by any stretch, I call em as I see em, and have had issues with their products.

I never cut nasty material, so never experienced the problems u suggested. But u do raise another good point, the cost of maintaining the splinter strips, splinter guard on the saws, bottom pads, they can add up fast.

As for racking, twisting, etc. The best you can do is use good technique, push straight down so the bottom rail pads bites the material (which is why you need to keep the bottom clean, and replace those pads as well over time) I also gave up on joining rails, as these joint(s) introduces an additional point of error, either during set up, or flex during use. But as mentioned above, the long rail for a full sheet cut is about $330....

Yep, the rails are a pain to say the least. Its a tricky adjustment and I find myslef fiddling and fumbling with track saw all the time, sometimes pretty frustratingly lol.

I bought a 118" guide rail as opposed to the joining and have two shorter rails. Its handy when its handy for sure. I agree about the battery and modest use. Heck, a lot in the trades now are 100% cordless but I dont think a lot of them spend much time remembering/comparing to corded. Many years ago I had finally sworn off cordless all together frustrated with the cost of replacement batteries/rebuilds, climbing up somewhere with a couple/three batteries, and so on. When I switched back to corded I smacked myself daily thinking of all the time Id wasted not stringing a cord.

Then a bought a guys entire commercial tool collection who got injured and in the job box was every Makita LXT tool out there and about 12-15 batteries and 3 chargers. 3 of them were impacts. Those three impacts put me back on cordless impact drivers for life lol. But we are now again running low on batteries as they go kaput so the irritation sets in again. Doing zero field work now and being in the shop only makes corded a lot easier but not so much with impacts.

[Dave Sabo]

Will & David - hard to navigate who's response is who's but I am definitely not a green kool aid drinker. Festool has done a piss poor job with Kapexgate (and that's assuming the current "fix" even works) .Their battery drill program in 12v is a decade behind pretty much everyone and their battery platform compatibility is also asinine. So don't be sorry.

And what might be obvious to you and me is probably not to the newbie or even Brad who came here asking about a saw to work on big slab tables. He wanted something with depth setting accuracy and dust collection. Some of y'all's comments are misleading even if they are accurate for some users. I am simply pointing out that yours is not the only perspective. People should have all the info. For your operations it sounds like you're rough on the consumables and they need replacing often which must cause a financial strain. For the average retired hobbiest, I can see where this might be a concern - if they really use it a lot. Even then , don't you think the wood cost is going to be a bigger hurdle ? For the hobbyist that can afford a good tracksaw setup, I doubt $100 a year for some wear items is going to be a big issue.

Bottom line is these are wear items people expect to replace at intervals. You two probably complain about having to by 4-6 different grits of sandpaper for a project or having to swap pieces when they wear out or gum up with finish. Lord help ya when the pad goes out. Are you advocating not using sanders because they eat consumables ? Sure one should think about total cost of ownership and use, but not pulling the trigger becasue something will wear out is daft.


Sure a format or slider would be better for some or many operations. On a reg. tablesaw you will never convince me that muscling a big slab or 4x8 sheet is easier or faster than taking a small saw to the work. Additionally, Brad is weary of spending 600$, so what do you suppose he'd think of a slider's $8-$50,000 price tag ? And that's assuming he even has enough shop space to accommodate a 8.5 - 10' stroke.

Yes cutting thin strips is a disaster with a tracksaw. But again, Brad didn't ask about that kind of operation. And I'm sure you are also aware of the other obvious that some tools are better suited for jobs than others.

If it's a hobby, you have to pay to play. Golf and tennis require new balls frequently as well as expensive tools to play. If it's a business, strips and sandpaper are part of the overhead that the customer pays. You sages know this already, though.

[Will Blick]

> I am simply pointing out that yours is not the only perspective. People should have all the info.

Huh?? u might want to go re read your previous post. No one here was denying your opinions. It was you, who was citing I was wrong about my actual experience using these products for 12 years. lets get real here...

> Even then , don't you think the wood cost is going to be a bigger hurdle ? For the hobbyist that can afford a good tracksaw setup, I doubt $100 a year for some wear items is going to be a big issue.

Dave, did I ever complain about the cost of consumables in my post?? Answer = NO. I was simply mentioning it, as the basis of this thread was saving $ on a track saw, remember??

> You two probably complain about having to by 4-6 different grits of sandpaper for a project or having to swap pieces when they wear out or gum up with finish. Lord help ya when the pad goes out.

I can only speak for myself... I have prob. $3K in Festool sandpaper and pads in inventory. Do I complain about it? No, I keep buying it. Seems now, u are making even more accusations about how I work, and what bothers me. U keep digging yourself a deeper hole.

> Are you advocating not using sanders because they eat consumables ?

No, where did u pull that one from??

> Sure one should think about total cost of ownership and use, but not pulling the trigger becasue something will wear out is daft.

There is a LOT of items, I dont purchase due to maint. cost, such as high end european cars, where an oil change is $1300. So maint. cost matters to most of us. We all have different thresholds of what is too much. I think its rude you are passing judgement on how others make purchase decisions.



> Sure a format or slider would be better for some or many operations. On a reg. tablesaw you will never convince me that muscling a big slab or 4x8 sheet is easier or faster than taking a small saw to the work.

I can only assume you are NOT reading what I am writing, or simply not comprehending what I am writing. You are supporting my position here, not contesting it. But you dont realize it ! I made it clear, I dont like handling anything on a stationary saw larger than 4ft in one dimension...hence why I have track saws. Pls re read my posts before commenting on them so this banter does not continue.

> Additionally, Brad is weary of spending 600$, so what do you suppose he'd think of a slider's $8-$50,000 price tag ? And that's assuming he even has enough shop space to accommodate a 8.5 - 10' stroke.

Who was suggesting Brad buy a 50K TS? Answer = NOBODY!!


> Yes cutting thin strips is a disaster with a tracksaw. But again, Brad didn't ask about that kind of operation.

Dave, do you realize what you wrote in your last post??
"People should have all the info. "
I was doing exactly what you are preaching, and yet, u now have a problem with it? Make up your mind, pls!
Its called a forum Dave, this is where we share information. These threads will be read for many years, many people benefit from information that is relevant to the issue at hand. That is all my posts did.

OK Dave, bring on your next false accusations and personal attacks? I await....