Member
As I understand it, the audiences of the PBS DIY series including Norm, This Old House and the frizzy haired painter is about 80% non-participants. In other words, most of the audience will never woodwork, fix up a house or paint a picture. My widowed MIL (God rest her soul) loved Norm and TOH and watched every episode. She told me she always enjoyed watching a man work and complete the job.
Watching YouTube, I have been running across a number of Ask This Old House episodes. I would think sponsored at some point by Festool based on the number of Festools (is that a proper word?) in the mix. Just can't get past that goofy looking drill. Not to mention the price of anything green. I would be more impressed of they were with Dewalt or Milwaukee or Makita, Something more of us have. Although I think more of you have Festool than I can imagine. Sure I watched and enjoyed Norm but I was never much hooked on PBS. I did, however manage to record most of the David Marks shows.
NOW you tell me...
Contributor
My wife got a kick out of that one, Eric.
Rick Potter
DIY journeyman,
FWW wannabe.
AKA Village Idiot.
Moderator
To the best of my knowledge, Tom Silva got introduced to Festool by Bob Marino (a 'Creeker and now-retired Festool purveyor) a number of years ago and embraced the system for his crew quite a bit, but at that point it there wasn't any sponsorship. He just plain liked and saw value in the system. I do believe at some point sponsorship came into play, but don't know that for sure. If by the "goofie looking drill" you mean one of the C-handled drills, don't laugh too much. For many of us, they are uber-comfortable to use. My little CSX is the most used Festool in my shop! I will admit that seeing Norm use some Festool tools in more recent Ask ToH and related videos did make my smile.Originally Posted by Ole Anderson
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The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...
Member
"Completed", lol, you caught it. I didn't miss her point when she said it either
Member
Interesting. I have read the TOH and NYW producers didn't use anything on the set without cash compensation from the manufacturers. Norm's workshop was said to be on the property of one of the executives and was paid for by PBS and the sponsors. Created an ugly appearance but nobody seemed to care.
Moderator
The NYW shop building was indeed on producer Russell Morash's property, as were the gardens for another PBS show. ToH was likely a little different when it came to tools because the various subcontractors pretty much use what they use, at least for the projects. In the case of Tom, while he was certainly one of the "faces" of the show, his crews doing the work were regular folks and ToH was just one project they were contracted to. Same for the other "faces" that were actual contractors. I'm sure there was a lot of wheeling and dealing on building materials and technology, however...no way the homeowners could ever afford some of that stuff I suspect! Spin off programs like Ask ToH could likely be more managed when it came to things like sponsorship just due to their nature because they were more studio shot and scripted.
Sponsorship comes into play pretty heavily in the YouTube world, too. Many, if not most, popular content providers have sponsors. Triton tools has several folks like April Wilkerson and Matt Cremona, for example. April seems particularly adept at scoring sponsorships and relationships which net "stuff" or at least easier acquisition of "stuff". Triton sent both of them to guitar building school recently at Crimson in the UK who also has Triton as a sponsor. (I'm only using these two as examples because I'm familiar with them...most of my YouTube watching for "how to" is in the guitar building world at present)
Last edited by Jim Becker; 01-05-2020 at 3:36 PM.
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The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...
Member
Another way to look at this is to consider how well Norm would have fared on an even playing field today as a youtube content provider. I think he would have lots of followers and subscribers, though the competition is a lot fiercer than it was a dozen years ago
[OP]
Member
I am not sure how well norm could produce a show. to be yt star you need to be able to also be great behind the camera.
I do find it odd that diy shows and Reno have multiplied, but woodworking shows don't exist outside of the internet now.
Contributor
It is worth noting that most of these YouTube providers today either were trained by Norm's TV show, or were trained by those who trained by viewing his shows.
Due needs to be given to those who paved the way for others. There would not be a competition of YouTube shows for Norm to deal with had he not been a central part on creating this niche. There were a few others that stood out, such as David Marks, but (as I understand) it was TNYW that set the bar.
Regards from Berlin
Derek
Member
Yes, I think Derek is right.
Let me figure out how many youtube woodworking "shows" I've ever watched to completion... umm that would be zero. In my opinion, youtube is for quick snippets of how to do something I'm not familiar with. Who has the time to watch what is usually some bumbling dufass carry on endlessly about irrelevant nonsense before getting to the point. Norm was different, it was designed to be entertainment first and even if you didn't like the project, the presentation was worth the time. I haven't seen anything modern that compares.
Would NYWS work now? I think yes. I'd watch it again if it was the same as it used to be. Not the Ask TOH garbage format.
On a related note, anyone know how Roger Cook is doing?
Contributor
Hi Steve, Happy New year.
I agree completely with your post.
I live in Toronto so I watch Tom on WNED, the Buffalo PBS station. They haven't aired any new episodes, at least that I've seen, too bad as I enjoyed the new format, I found Tommy Mac too frantic and too interested in "being hip with the kids" tto make an enjoyable viewing moment for me.
Regards, Rod.
Contributor
Thinking back to Norm’s shows I wonder how many radial arm saws and hollow chisel mortisers he helped sell!!!
I sure enjoyed his shows but could easily see defects in the project at times from having such a strict timeline for completion.
What bothers me at times on shows like This Old House is some of the major safety violations that an inspector would shut them down for. Primarily when excavating and working in deep holes. No shoring, no step back, being in the deep hole while excavation machinery is running in there. OSHA would have a fit.
As to the topic, I think his show would still do well today - if they could get it broadcast. The individual PBS stations choose what shows to pay for and broadcast. Having moved from Michigan to Louisiana and now back again it is just amazing the content differences that individual stations choose to broadcast. Not sure how many stations would pick his show up.
Contributor
I think 80% non-participants is pretty low, especially for TOH. Even though I'll never rehab a mini-manse, it's still better more entertaining viewing than 98% of broadcast TV.
Member
Norm was popular for so many years in large part because he is so relatable. He's a very nice guy. I watched every episode to see how tools were used and to learn some woodworking. In my opinion, Norm is the starting point of the current YouTube woodworker culture. I look back on NYWS with great fondness, and I really enjoy seeing Norm on current TOH episodes. Norm was good for woodworking. I'm sure Delta was a sponsor of NYWS, but the tools were simply used in the project. I struggle mightily with sponsorships and product placement on YouTube. I know these folks need to make a living. I wish there were full disclosure of paid relationships.
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