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Thread: Hand tools only

  1. [QUOTE=Michael Bulatowicz;2973775]
    Quote Originally Posted by Dominik Dudkiewicz View Post

    Have you measured your hand saw dust output with the saw sharp vs dull?

    In my limited experience, a dull hand saw produces far more fine dust than a sharp one. I saw this (no pun intended) the first time I sharpened my Veritas dovetail saw. It was pretty dull by that point, but I had been anxious about sharpening it myself as I had never sharpened a saw before. I was amazed to find that when sharp it produced a pile of tiny shavings rather than any dust I could see.
    Saws were/are definitely sharp. A dull saw probably does produce more dust but even a sharp saw creates a lot - and it's the dust you can't see easily that is more dangerous. Also, for most cuts with my table or bandsaw I can't see or smell any wood dust at all.

    Cheers, Dom

  2. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Koepke View Post

    A ripsaw should produce those 'tiny shavings' when sharpened. If it is making dust, it is time to sharpen.
    Are you measuring the dust put into the air with a decent meter, such as the Dylos? I can guarantee that you will notice it, no matter how sharp the saw. As usual, it's the dust you don't "see" that is the most harmful.

    I use both Japanese and western saws. The Japanese saws are somewhat "worse" as regards dust because the dust tends to be finer, and you're blowing it away from the kerf so that it can be seen. With the western saws, which I keep sharp, the issue is quantitatively somewhat less than that, but still present. It's a problem particularly with the exotics, which you can easily develop a sensitivity to, if you haven't already (and then it can be game over for working with that species, or any wood at all in some cases.) You can never eliminate it entirely, but you can reduce your exposure.

  3. #33
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    You can never eliminate it entirely, but you can reduce your exposure.
    Some woods, like rosewood, get me to wearing a dust mask to help avoid the dust of smell.

    jtk
    "A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty."
    - Sir Winston Churchill (1874-1965)

  4. #34
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    Are you measuring the dust put into the air with a decent meter, such as the Dylos? I can guarantee that you will notice it, no matter how sharp the saw.
    No, my point is merely one of observation. A well sharpened ripsaw being used in rip mode will make small, curled shavings. If it is not, it likely needs sharpening. There will be particles of dust produced at the same time. That is the nature of dust, it is kind of like rust in that way. It never sleeps and just keeps reproducing.

    jtk
    "A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty."
    - Sir Winston Churchill (1874-1965)

  5. #35
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    Shaker Table Project, apron start.JPG
    This cross cut saw makes a nice pile of sawdust....
    Shaker Table Project, second pile of the day.JPG
    But not as bad as other tools in the shop..

    DVD Cabinet, saw a line.JPG
    As for this 8ppi cross cut Panel saw..
    DVD Cabinet, real saw dust.JPG
    Right now, the only "rip" saw in use...
    DVD Cabinet, nasty wood.JPG
    Leaves a thin layer of sawdust.....

  6. #36
    Join Date
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    Charlotte, MI
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    I use no power tools of any sort in my woodworking, right down to the treadle grinding wheel I use for sharpening. I do have electric lights that I use when taking pictures or when working at night (as I'm often forced to do). I work this way as I prize authenticity and period accuracy in my work. I consider myself more of an experimental archaeologist than I do a furniture maker.
    Your endgrain is like your bellybutton. Yes, I know you have it. No, I don't want to see it.

  7. #37
    I use power tools when it makes sense to me. If I'm prepping a ton of stock, I might run it through the table saw. Once in a blue moon. Mostly I'll just use a handsaw to cut the wood as I go, and a plane to flatten and square it up.
    I am in the middle of an acoustic guitar build right now. I have used a power tool twice; both times a router. Once to rout the channel for the back strip, because trying to use a handsaw and a chisel to cut a 22" long, .050" deep channel in a .110" thick back doesn't make as much sense as using a router for that job. All of the binding channels front and back I cut with a gramil and chisel.
    The second time was routing the truss rod slot in the neck. A) I don't have a 3/16" chisel, and B)the router cuts a nice, smooth bottomed slot to a precise depth, which lets me not stress over how thick or thin I can actually go on the neck carve.
    The only other power tool I will use is a hand drill, to drill the holes for the bridge pins and tuning keys. Yeah, I could use a non powered version, but truth be told, these two tools are guided freehand over the piece I'm working on, and though technically "power tools" they require a steady hand to use. I'm not just feeding stock through a thickness sander, for instance.
    I prefer hand tools for a variety of reasons.
    I have the time, I'm not in a production setting. I do this for the joy of working wood and making something.The hand tools are not loud or whiney. In fact the sounds they make are quite pleasant to my ears. The work is much slower, and there is more tactile interaction with the wood; I tend to run my hands over the piece constantly, searching for imperfections my eyes cannot see. I don't need dust collection, I'm not engulfed in a cloud of fine wood dust/particulates that require a dust mask, unless I'm sanding. And if I'm good enough with the plane, that is minimal.
    And finally, at the end of the day, imperfections and all, I made that with my hands. There is a certain satisfaction that comes with that for me.
    There are also budgetary concerns for me; many of the power tools I simply can't afford. But I think even if I could, I would just buy more expensive versions of the hand tools I currently use, and call it good.
    Last edited by Mike Baker 2; 12-16-2019 at 11:39 AM.

  8. Dom,

    I know it's a bit off topic but what do you use for dust collection on your tablesaw/bandsaw and do you have pictures you can share? Thanks!

    Jonathan

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Josh Robinson View Post
    How many of you do not use any power tools in your shop or only Use a band saw or very infrequently use some other power tool? Why do you choose to work this way?

    Working this way because I've got a rare form of leukemia. Exposure to electrosmog and strong magnetic fields affect my health (and is measurable in my bloodtests...). No WiFi, mobile phone, digital amplifier etc. Due to arthritis (a complication) I cannot do everything with hand tools but I minimize the use of power tools whenever I can.

  10. Quote Originally Posted by Jonathan Elliott View Post
    Dom,

    I know it's a bit off topic but what do you use for dust collection on your tablesaw/bandsaw and do you have pictures you can share? Thanks!

    Jonathan
    Quote Originally Posted by Jonathan Elliott View Post
    Dom,

    I know it's a bit off topic but what do you use for dust collection on your tablesaw/bandsaw and do you have pictures you can share? Thanks!

    Jonathan
    Hi Jonathan,

    It is a little off-topic, but here are a couple of picks of the bandsaw and table-saw. I run a Clearvue 5HP Cyclone dust collector. I've attached some older photos I have on the laptop. The bandsaw has three 4" ports with an adjustable overhead port and the table-saw has a 6" port in the cabinet with a large radius bell-mouth entry on the inside and a 4" overhead port and shop made adjustable guard/hood. Both overhead ports contribute a lot to the effectiveness of the dust collection.

    Attachment 421735

    20190522_072641.jpg

    Sorry couldn't get this one not to rotate.
    20190522_074158.jpg

    Table-saw -

    20161010_070409.jpg

    20161010_070605.jpg

    IMG_20190522_102703_266.jpg

    And this is the move-able port I use with hand tools.

    IMG_20190522_102703_296.jpg

    Cheers,

    Dom

  11. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jonathan Elliott View Post
    Dom,

    I know it's a bit off topic but what do you use for dust collection on your tablesaw/bandsaw and do you have pictures you can share? Thanks!

    Jonathan
    Jonathan, I built this very simple collector (at the blade) about a year ago. It is very effective. The bandsaw is a Hammer N4400.





    The collector is simply a PVC pipe, which has a slit for the blade. It is blocked at the far end.

    The tablesaw is a Hammer K3 slider, and has dedicated dust extraction from the cabinet that works well. This is supplemented at the blade guard.

    Regards from Perth

    Derek

  12. #42
    I have the same setup. Very effective. Not yet made it permanent on my bandsaw

  13. Thanks Dom and Derek, I'm sorry for dragging this into this thread but really appreciate the photos. I'm getting ready to set up a 5hp Clearvue so it helps a lot. I really want to keep dust to a minimum.

    Jonathan

  14. #44
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
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    Northeast WI
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    I have quite a few power tools. Table saw, band saw, scroll saw, miter saw, bench sander, drill press, etc. I also use a jig saw, router, hand sander etc. For home improvement projects, these tools save time and effort. I have not and will not rip multiple 4x8 sheets of plywood with a handsaw.

    That being said, I have been using hand tools more and more in my projects. It seems like I spent a ton of time moving power tools, plugging and unplugging, hooking up dust collection and setting up cuts just to make a few small cuts. I can grab a hand saw and make those cuts in a fraction of the time, with even less noise and no dust being thrown in my face.

    I also don't miss putting my hand and limbs near a 4000 RPM wheel of ultra sharp teeth

    Overall I find hand tools less stressful. Just my 2 cents

  15. #45
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    Jason,

    What may sound odd is my consumption of sandpaper has gone down considerably since learning more about using planes. My tendency now is to use planes, scrapers or rasps before using sandpaper.

    jtk
    "A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty."
    - Sir Winston Churchill (1874-1965)

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