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Thread: 3D Planning Software

  1. #31
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    That's how it works Grant
    --

    The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grant Wilkinson View Post
    I'd like to try fusion360, but I just went on their site and the only free version seems to be a one-year subscription for home users. Do those of you on here who are using it have a an older version that is free forever? I am a home/hobbyist user.
    That's the version you want. It's for hobbyists and companies with less than $100k in revenue. You have to renew it each year.

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Will Blick View Post
    Great info Tim...
    can u please elaborate on...

    > Overall, the plan functionality is pretty limited.

    a few examples would be really helpful... I have not used other software to know its shortcomings.. thx
    You create the model and then you create drawings which the model is placed into. You can only dimension 2d models. The dimensioning overall is fairly limited. You have very little control on the appearance/fit of dimensions. Everything is a single lineweight. If you're just using this for your own plans it's probably fine but I produce plans for resell. It's just not as robust as Autocad in the plan department (not that it ever will be) or even Sketchup for that matter. It's still a fairly new program though and they have made improvements but plans probably arent high on their list of features they'd like to address.

  4. #34
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    I agree w/ Tim. Autocad 2D is great for making work that goes to vendors. Fusion 360 is not. It's the only thing I wish I had the paid version of SketchUp for, but man switching my ten years of Autocad brain off is way hard to do.

  5. #35
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    Thx Tim, very interesting...
    So F360 can only dimension in 2d, and has limited dimensioning tools.
    I can see how that is very limiting if you are re selling drawings, u are trying to present your work to a wide audience.

    I am curious of your thoughts ...
    Since F360 is owned by Autocad, they surely have the tools to expand F360s tools such as dimensioning, its not like they have to reinvent the wheel. Do you think they will do this in the future?

    What is the purpose of F360? It seems like a different, but yet reduced versoin of the Autocad product line, which I assume has consistency of workflow and UI throughout the product line. Why not just reduce the amount of features of AutoCad to offer the lower priced versions? It appears that is what what F360 is for anyway? If they did just reduce the feature set of Autocad on the lower priced versions, then, upgrading will reduce the learning curve for users, vs. jumping into a different product, different UI, different toolset, workflow, etc. , right?

    I am starting to suspect F360 was an acquisition by AutoCad, as an attempt to capture the lower end of the market?

  6. #36
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    I did manage to create this dwg below for a vendor. It was interesting to make, but I did get it done. I forget why I don't have tolerances on the dwg.


    Template.jpg

  7. #37
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    Will,

    I've had the same thoughts. I thought I kept the URL, but I guess not. There is a flowchart that shows all the upgrades they are planning to do with the software. It is quite extensive. I think that Fusion 360 is maybe just a totally different idea.. it's all online. It's easy to share (kind of like Google Drive). It is very strange to see a company that excels at making a drawing software package have a hard time with a drawing software package.

    I'm not 100% sure what it is, but I'm sure they want to compete with SketchUp and others. The license for AutoCad is expensive. They already do have a lite package. It's still expensive. Anyway, my plan is to make enough money that I can start using the real software. : )

  8. #38
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    I guess if F360 gets too many features
    they will chip into their sales of AutoCad products, which would be sensless.

    Agreed on the sharing issue with F360, thats the future of nearly all software today. OnShape is the same.

    My guess is, AutoCad feels the pressure of the lower priced competitors whose software continues to get more powerful every year. Like all software, over time, the products become way more powerful and feature rich, and prices fall...such as spreadsheets. More users create more reveneue, the lower the price, the more users. This is prob. happening in CAD now, a result of an ultra competitive market.

    Its hard to analyze differences in software that you dont know a lot about to start with. Hence the value of getting insights from experienced users who have used many programs.
    I see CAD from Corel and Alibre that seem to be very feature rich, but yet, get very little traction in the market vs. the big players. The field is probably due for a big shake out soon.

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tim M Tuttle View Post
    ...You can only dimension 2d models...
    I don't understand what that means and I'm pretty familiar with drafting practices. Do you have an example you can show of what you mean by 3D dimensioning?
    Beranek's Law:

    It has been remarked that if one selects his own components, builds his own enclosure, and is convinced he has made a wise choice of design, then his own loudspeaker sounds better to him than does anyone else's loudspeaker. In this case, the frequency response of the loudspeaker seems to play only a minor part in forming a person's opinion.
    L.L. Beranek, Acoustics (McGraw-Hill, New York, 1954), p.208.

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Will Blick View Post
    Thx Tim, very interesting...
    So F360 can only dimension in 2d, and has limited dimensioning tools.
    I can see how that is very limiting if you are re selling drawings, u are trying to present your work to a wide audience.

    I am curious of your thoughts ...
    Since F360 is owned by Autocad, they surely have the tools to expand F360s tools such as dimensioning, its not like they have to reinvent the wheel. Do you think they will do this in the future?

    What is the purpose of F360? It seems like a different, but yet reduced versoin of the Autocad product line, which I assume has consistency of workflow and UI throughout the product line. Why not just reduce the amount of features of AutoCad to offer the lower priced versions? It appears that is what what F360 is for anyway? If they did just reduce the feature set of Autocad on the lower priced versions, then, upgrading will reduce the learning curve for users, vs. jumping into a different product, different UI, different toolset, workflow, etc. , right?

    I am starting to suspect F360 was an acquisition by AutoCad, as an attempt to capture the lower end of the market?
    Fusion is an original Autodesk product but it is geared heavily towards CAM. If anything, it's probably a lite version of Inventor. Plans are not what it was made for so I doubt making them as full featured as I would like is near the top of their list. They have to pick and choose what to work on and they'll judge that based on user feedback. Most of the Fusion threads I run across involve CAM.

    They would never remove features from AutoCAD. That's one of their flagship products. And AutoCAD and Fusion are not really competitors. Two very different markets.

  11. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by David L Morse View Post
    I don't understand what that means and I'm pretty familiar with drafting practices. Do you have an example you can show of what you mean by 3D dimensioning?
    Fusion only allows dimensioning of 2D views. Like this:

    Screen Shot 2019-09-20 at 1.38.55 PM.png

    In Fusion, 3D is limited to notes and labels:

    Screen Shot 2019-09-20 at 1.38.11 PM.png

    In Sketchup (and many other programs including AutoCAD), you can dimension 3D views which comes in very handy in woodworking plans IMO.

    Screen Shot 2019-09-20 at 1.37.48 PM.png

  12. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Will Blick View Post
    I guess if F360 gets too many features
    they will chip into their sales of AutoCad products, which would be sensless.

    Agreed on the sharing issue with F360, thats the future of nearly all software today. OnShape is the same.

    My guess is, AutoCad feels the pressure of the lower priced competitors whose software continues to get more powerful every year. Like all software, over time, the products become way more powerful and feature rich, and prices fall...such as spreadsheets. More users create more reveneue, the lower the price, the more users. This is prob. happening in CAD now, a result of an ultra competitive market.

    Its hard to analyze differences in software that you dont know a lot about to start with. Hence the value of getting insights from experienced users who have used many programs.
    I see CAD from Corel and Alibre that seem to be very feature rich, but yet, get very little traction in the market vs. the big players. The field is probably due for a big shake out soon.
    AutoCAD was never intended to be a hobbyist application so programs like Sketchup and Fusion arent really a threat. While Sketchup is powerful, using it to create a working CD set would be foolish. Whatever the cost of AutoCAD (or Revit), you'd quickly spend that much many times over by trying to make changes in Sketchup.

    I think AutoDesk created Fusion because it was a blank slate. The cores of AutoCAD, Revit, Inventor, etc, are old and they've had to evolve to the changing technology landscape. One of the really great things about Fusion is that it's a local application with data in the cloud. So if I change computers I dont have to worry about transferring settings or drawings. I just install Fusion and login and everything is right where I left it. It's really great when you work off of multiple machines. I think they are also using Fusion as a test run for this approach to licensing which absolutely blows away the licensing of any other paid app.

  13. #43
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    Very interesting, thx Tim.

    I knew F360 integrated CAM, but was not aware that was the products hallmark.

    When u say, "plan", you do mean 2d drawings, right? just making sure.

    Considering your experience in CAD, and knowing the needs of the hobbiest ww, i.e. a typical workflow, design a 3d model of what we want to build, render to see wood types, then when happy, break parts out and dimension in 2d for detailed cut list.... is there CAD programs better designed for this simple and limited workflow? (which is also acts like standard CAD, so we can also design an occasionaly metal part to have CNC'd, etc)
    Or would you say F360 is as good as any for this workflow / basic tasks?

  14. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tim M Tuttle View Post
    In Sketchup (and many other programs including AutoCAD), you can dimension 3D views which comes in very handy in woodworking plans IMO.

    Screen Shot 2019-09-20 at 1.37.48 PM.png
    Oh, I can see where that would be nice for plans you sell. I've never had a need for that so that's new to me. Thanks for your explanation.
    Beranek's Law:

    It has been remarked that if one selects his own components, builds his own enclosure, and is convinced he has made a wise choice of design, then his own loudspeaker sounds better to him than does anyone else's loudspeaker. In this case, the frequency response of the loudspeaker seems to play only a minor part in forming a person's opinion.
    L.L. Beranek, Acoustics (McGraw-Hill, New York, 1954), p.208.

  15. #45
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    BTW, I was only dimensioning in 2d in F360
    Kinda dissapointed its not avail in 3d.
    IMO, a very useful feature
    Maybe I did not make the right choice ;(

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