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Thread: Berkeley bans natural gas in new homes

  1. #1
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    Berkeley bans natural gas in new homes

    Berkeley California just banned natural gas in new homes. This is supposed to reduce carbon emissions . Of course the local power company still burns coal to make a good percentage of the electrical. They are building new gas fired power plants to meet demand. I wonder if clothes dryers are already banned. They will pay someone $273,000 to check plans for no gas.
    Bill D.
    PS very few new homes get built in Berkeley anyway. I wonder if they plan to turn off the gas furnaces in all the public buildings and give them personnel electric heaters instead.

  2. #2
    FYI there is one coal fired power plant in the entire state of California a 6 1/2 hour drive from Berkeley built in 1978 and it produces 0.2% of the electrical capacity. Also California is phasing out gas fired power plants as they cannot compete with solar and wind. Yes there are some under construction but there are more retirements than new construction.
    https://archinect.com/news/article/1...oming-obsolete
    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-u...-idUSKCN1Q12C9

  3. #3
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    I did not know they were so low in buying coal power these days.
    Bill D
    Last edited by Lee Schierer; 08-29-2019 at 8:07 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bill Dufour View Post
    I did not know they were so low in buying coal power these days.
    Bill D
    California and much of the west coast is powered by hydroelectric and nuclear.


    jtk
    Last edited by Lee Schierer; 08-29-2019 at 8:08 AM.
    "A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty."
    - Sir Winston Churchill (1874-1965)

  5. #5
    Given the location it doesn't surprise me. Even in Texas they are beginning to be frowned on due to safety issues. I do work for someone that has rental properties and I had to go into all of his houses that had a water heater in a closet and retro-fit ventilation into the attic because of the danger of potential gas leak.

  6. #6
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    Not exactly the responses you were looking for was it Bill?

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Day View Post
    Not exactly the responses you were looking for was it Bill?
    Wow, go Berkley. They just saved the planet. One of you environmentalists types explain to me how this is a noble action in any way, all I see is naivety.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edward Dyas View Post
    Given the location it doesn't surprise me. Even in Texas they are beginning to be frowned on due to safety issues. I do work for someone that has rental properties and I had to go into all of his houses that had a water heater in a closet and retro-fit ventilation into the attic because of the danger of potential gas leak.
    Do you have to have CO alarms in Texas? In California several years ago they required them in all occupied dwellings. Not when the house was sold but right then. I thought this was only a California law?
    Bill D.
    D

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve Rozmiarek View Post
    Wow, go Berkley. They just saved the planet. One of you environmentalists types explain to me how this is a noble action in any way, all I see is naivety.
    California legislators are the absolute masters at naivete.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Bill Dufour View Post
    Berkeley California just banned natural gas in new homes. This is supposed to reduce carbon emissions . Of course the local power company still burns coal to make a good percentage of the electrical.
    Bill, I think a single source of pollutants (e.g., power plant) is better to manage and improve than a distributed source of pollutants (e.g, cars and houses).

    I've lived in the Berkeley hills when my wife went to grad school there, and being on a fault line the natural gas lines are always a concern -- so this could be about safety as well and not just greenhouse gases.

  11. #11
    A private residence doesn't have to have them but all of the rental properties do. In Texas in private residence you don't even have to have a smoke detector if you don't want one.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doug Garson View Post
    FYI there is one coal fired power plant in the entire state of California a 6 1/2 hour drive from Berkeley built in 1978 and it produces 0.2% of the electrical capacity. Also California is phasing out gas fired power plants as they cannot compete with solar and wind. Yes there are some under construction but there are more retirements than new construction.
    https://archinect.com/news/article/1...oming-obsolete
    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-u...-idUSKCN1Q12C9
    CA is the largest importer of electricity in the nation, 15 terrawatts? something like that. their fossil fuel percentage when you factor in imports is still over 35%

    a lot of that is from Wyoming, where they burn the coal next to the mine and have transmission lines going directly to CA.

    anything to outsource the bad stuff, and then feel all high and mighty when you say you only have 1 coal plant left in the state, then turn around and crap on all the people and industry that actually supplies your standard of living.

  13. #13
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    So if other states decide to lower the amount of electric to Cali and send it to other states what would be Cali plan. They are making it hard to deal with but that is just my opinion

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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Herman View Post
    CA is the largest importer of electricity in the nation, 15 terrawatts? something like that. their fossil fuel percentage when you factor in imports is still over 35%

    a lot of that is from Wyoming, where they burn the coal next to the mine and have transmission lines going directly to CA.

    anything to outsource the bad stuff, and then feel all high and mighty when you say you only have 1 coal plant left in the state, then turn around and crap on all the people and industry that actually supplies your standard of living.
    Setting aside the unfounded commentary on the mind-set of the people who passed the ordinance, let's look at the facts. Berkeley has opted in to a source of electric power that is 100% carbon-free, so they are not getting their electricity from your fossil fuel plants: cite. As a city, Berkeley does not have the authority to change California's sources of power, much less the energy policy of the United States. It is doing what it can within those limits to fight climate change. You can call these people naive, but I call them realistic. I'd call them farsighted, but it doesn't take much in the way of foresight to see that we need to change our ways to address the coming crisis.

    Note to the moderators: if the discussion up to this point was not political and prohibited, I don't see how my post can be. Just some necessary factual corrective.

  15. #15
    While this is not about natural gas, I expect to see serious limits being put on the sale of gasoline powered personal vehicles within the next several years. Prices of electric vehicles are coming down, availability of charging stations is improving and the vehicles are pollution free (the pollution is at a electricity generating station where it can be better controlled). More and more solar and wind generation is coming on line and electricity storage is improving for nighttime availability.

    I expect that large trucks will continue to be diesel for quite a while.

    Mike
    Go into the world and do well. But more importantly, go into the world and do good.

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