Stanley Bailey No 5 from the 60's

[Jason Buresh]

Jason, i would not buy it, as there are much better planes around for the same money. By the 60s, Stanley had joined the race to the bottom, quality wise, on their planes. Their Bailey planes from about 1910 or so until maybe about 1930 appeal a great deal more to me, and I think any of the guys above would probably agree with me on that. To identify those, type in "Stanley Bailey Type Study" and use that search to look at some of the sites that come up.

I have read that the Stanley folks that made their block planes never got the memo on quality, however, and Stanley made good block planes way past the 60s dates.

Some of the guys like Jim and Steven will do quite well with even earlier planes, but I have more trouble adjusting them than they do. Any Bedrock, if you can find one very cheaply (not likely) will also be better than the 60s Stanley planes.

I have a type 19 Bailey that I believe was made in the late 40s up to maybe the late 50s. It lacks the better fit and feature of the
Bailey planes mentioned above, but the basics are still there, and it can be tuned up to a very good user. (It was my dad's.)

The Bailey planes made after about 1930 up until world war 2 were still pretty darned good planes, but the frog where the iron rested was skeletonized, whereas the earlier Bailey planes were not. The post 1930 design was cheaper to machine and still very acceptable, but the pre 1930 design was a bit better.

That said, you still want to check out the condition, as some alluded to above. A 1930s Bailey in good shape is a better buy than the more desirable (IMHO) 1910 to 1930 versions, if the later is a rust bucket. In addition to points made above, check out the condition of the iron. If the iron is rusted and pitted to a significant amount on the business end, you will either need to restore it or buy a new iron. If the pitting is deep enough to require a ton of work on a stone or grinder, I would walk away from it, unless the price is way down into the bottom price range, as you will likely need to cut off the iron until it is above the pitted area or buy a replacement iron.

At any rate, I greatly respect some of the posters above, but would still advise you not to buy that plane. Again, study the type studies, and buy one of the much earlier Stanleys. Also if Steven chimes in, he can tell you about the early Millers Falls planes, and these were also very good planes to my understanding, but I don't know enough about them to buy one, so I only buy the Stanley planes since I know them.

I would look for planes at flea markets, garage sales, and pawn shops, and you should be able to find a good candidate for that $45 or much less. You might find one on the auction site for that, and there are plenty of them there, but I think it unlikely you will get one delivered to you for that money, but if you wait long enough, you just might.

Regards,

Stew

Stew, thanks for the reply. I will save my money and be patient. I agree with the people above that it may not be a bad plane but I will wait for better.

[steven c newman]

Well...I'll keep an eye out this weekend.....West Liberty, OH. has a Tractor Fest going on during Labor Day Weekend. Last year, I walked about 2 miles during one day...came home with an "arm load" of goodies....Took most of the day looking at all the vendors set up there....

IF the #5 is still japaned Black...and not Blue....should be a decent plane. Stanley irons are actually easy to reshape....into square to the plane....or give them a slight to heavy camber.. In 1962, Stanley crimped the infamous Whale Tail down. There was a period during the late 60s, when they wore a Maroon ( called Cardovan ) paint job.

Kind of hard to mess up a Jack plane, and they are about the easiest to rehab back to life.

As to Millers Falls....look for their 2 piece lever cap....if it has the one piece ( like a Stanley)...walk away. And..the irons on the type 1 through type 4 are actually thicker than a Stanley iron. Millers Falls started making planes about 1929....and until 1955, they were as good as the best Stanley ones....the Type 5 was a bit cheap, ugly, and not finished as well....and had the single piece lever cap...

[Nicholas Lawrence]

The tool collectors meeting is a really good suggestion. I always go to the local Patina events when I can, and in the early days rarely came away without something I thought was a really good deal. Now I have pretty much what I need and purchases fall into the “want” category rather than an actual need.

Dealers are going to sell at dealer prices (they have to make a living like everybody else), but if they are honest they will give you an education about what you are looking at and tell you the potential issues. I would expect a mix of non-dealer guys with some good stuff at good prices, and guys with decent stuff at so-so prices. There will be a lot in one place though, and it is better than rolling the dice on eBay where you cannot really look at what is being offered.

I should be clear that I do not know that a 60’s No. 5 with yellow paint on the lever cap is a good user. I just think the only way to know is to use it. It might be a good tool that someone has abused, or might be a bad tool that is just a bad tool. Even if it is a golden age tool (whatever that is to you) it might not be a good user. Some golden age tools slipped through quality control and still look new because they would not work correctly and back then people just did not throw things away.

[Jim Koepke]

So I went and looked at the plane closer tonight and I didn't walk out with it. The blade was ground on an angle and there were some scratches in the sole. In the display case it looked like it had never been used. I think both could be fixed but is it still worth the money?

The blade being ground at an angle caught my eye.

It might have been done on purpose to counteract a misaligned face on the frog.

jtk

[steven c newman]

Usually, ones like that I have rehabbed, were because previous owners did not KNOW how to sharpen....and the angle just grew over time...

I figure after about 1-4 hours in my shop, the OP's No. 5 Stanley would look like new, and even work like it should when new. Doesn't take all that long to do.

Mail tends to get here just after lunch....so...open the box, rehab the plane...test drive the finished plane, with the iron sharp....then have Supper. But, then I am Retired, so I have all the time I need to work on such things. Plane would then go back into the box it was mailed in, and sent out the next day's mail....with a return label attached.

[Jason Buresh]

Ok friends I am going to pass on they type 20. I now have an opportunity though to buy a type 13, 1931-1932 in decent shape for $30. Is that a better deal?

[lowell holmes]

You might try a Hock Iron in the plane. You will be pleased if you do. I have Hock Irons and breakers in my Bedrock planes.

[steven c newman]

Yep...go for it!

[justin sherriff]

Ok friends I am going to pass on they type 20. I now have an opportunity though to buy a type 13, 1931-1932 in decent shape for $30. Is that a better deal?

$30 in good shape go for it.

[Stew Denton]

I am with Steven, if it is a genuine type 13 (1925 to 1928) according to the Rexmill type study, it is a good one.

IF you garage sale a long time or hit enough flea markets you might find one of the others from that golden era that may be SLIGHTLY more desirable (which of those are the most desirable is a HIGHLY subjective choice and all folks do NOT agree on which are the best.) IF you go to enough garage sales and flea markets you will almost certainly find a bit better price.

I stress the word IF in the above paragraph, because you might also look a long time and NOT find a better deal. You might also look a lot for 2 years to save $15 or $20 on a plane. How much is your time worth to you? I look at the auction site often enough to think you will NOT find a deal that good on it hardly ever, normally you will pay well more that $30 for that plane there.

If it were me, and I wanted to actually get started using such a plane rather than spend a lot of time looking for a better deal I would go for it, as Steven said.

In my view, that $30 is a fair and reasonably good price for a type 13 in good shape in my humble opinion, if it is really a type 13.

If I were you I would look at the Rexmill site, if you go there it will take you a bit of careful looking to find his type study, but once you find it you will find it is one of the best type studies IMHO. You can then compare the plane you are looking at to the type study to verify what the type # is.

If you look at enough old planes you will find a number of what we here call "Frankenplanes." Stanley did not make planes by "type number," they used the parts on hand, thus you might find a type 13 part on a type 12 or type 14 plane, and also when a part on a plane got broken by being dropped, etc., Stanley would sell a part that would work, and often it was from the current stock. These things are routine, and show up from time to time. This is not a cause of concern and should not hinder you from buying a good plane. If you are a user like a lot of us, how the plane works is far more important than if it is "true to type."

Steven's answer was short and sweet and to the point. I took longer to explain things a bit, but Steven is right on the money to my view, I just flushed out his answer a bit.

Hope you do well.

Stew

[Stew Denton]

Jason, I did not read you question carefully before replying. What you asked is: "Is that a better deal?" (The question was not "should I go for it," which was the question I answered.)

The answer to your question is the same as the answer to the question: "Does the sun come up in the East?" Your darned tootin, it is a better type plane at a better price...you win all the way around.

Stew

[Jason Buresh]

Sorry I realized I made a typo and it is a type 15. According to the age guide it looks like it was made 1931-1932. I will contact the seller and see what happens. Thanks for all the guidance everyone!

[Jim Koepke]

A type 15 at $30 is still a good deal as long as it does have the old style frog.

jtk

[Jim Koepke]

The type study is here:

http://www.rexmill.com/planes101/typing/typing.htm

jtk

[Andrew Seemann]

If the 1931 one comes apart completely -no frozen screws or parts- and isn't beat to h#ll and isn't missing pieces, it will probably work just fine for a jack plane, and $30 isn't a bad price if it is in average condition and not full of rust.

One thing also to consider, is that jack planes don't often need to be the best planes in your arsenal, depending on how you use them. I'm rather picky about smoothing planes, but my two main jack planes are set up to remove material fast. One is set up with a wide mouth; I think it is Revonoc or something like that. The other is a WWII (I think) Stanley. That one is set up to be able to take finer cuts, but nothing like a smoothing plane. Either one would be quite at home shaving down a door or a board for my deck or face joining wood too wide for my jointer. I also have about 4 more sitting on a shelf waiting to be cleaned up one of these days, but that is another story. I still can't turn down a $5 garage sale plane in workable condition