Loving my Mini Max Mortiser

[John TenEyck]

You might have read a couple of posts I had related to finding the right mortising bits for my Mini Max mortiser. I tried a long Amana bit but it grabbed too much and had too much run out leaving a rough oversized mortise. It felt down right dangerous in my machine. Based on advise here I bought a shorter 2 flute center cutting end mill. Just perfect results up to the full cutting depth of about 1-5/8" on the 3/4" diameter bit.

That exercise was an effort to help my friend who's building a dining room table and needed to make about 30 or 40 mortises in the pedestal bases. Yesterday he brought his beautifully prepped mahogany stock over and we cut all the mortises. He's using loose tenons so we had to cut mortises in both long grain and end grain. The mortises came out beautiful; nice smooth side walls and all the same width. All the mortises were 1-9/16" deep and range from about 1-1/4" to 3-1/2" wide. He has a chisel mortiser and had contemplated using traditional mortise and tenon joints but he was happy he decided to go with loose tenons and my horizontal mortiser after he saw the first couple of mortises we made.

The Mini Max mortiser (FS 35) is a very robust platform and does its job well, but it has some downright dumb design features. The hold down clamp limits what could be an even greater travel range because it bangs into the fence assembly. The lateral and depth adjustments are under the table and very awkward and finicky to use. The work stop is comprised of two short pieces of steel with a gap in the middle rather than one long stop. That makes working with narrow pieces a challenge unless you add a supplemental fence, and I plan to change it to one long stop made out of aluminum. We joked that it looked like the mortiser was designed after a long Italian lunch and by the newby engineer. But we also both remarked that we would not have wanted to make those big mortises another way. I bought the FS35 because I wanted a wider J/P. The mortiser just happened to come with it. I'm now realizing I got a great bonus in the deal.

John

[Prashun Patel]

Don't rub it in!
I had a chance to get an FS30 last year for about $2400 WITH the mortiser. I passed it up for no good reason. A year later, I'm a Hammer A331 and Domino poorer.

[mreza Salav]

Good to hear it's working fine for you John. My FS350 doesn't have a mortising attachment and I contemplated twice to get one (considered both new and used); not for the same machine but from the bigger FS-41 (or 410) that would fit mine. In both situations I backed out as the price was just a little under a Domino XL and I felt that the bigger domino might be more versatile. Still am not sure which will be a winner as both have advantages over the other. On yours, what is the deepest mortise you can create with an appropriate bit? Domino XL can go up to 2.75"

[Rick Potter]

Hey John,

Nice mortiser, glad you got it working properly.

Does this mean that the router based mortise you are world famous for is now up for grabs? . If so, the line starts here.

[John TenEyck]

Pictures are always good, right? Here's the mortiser on the back of the FS35:

IMG_4321.JPG

Since the mortiser mounts on the back of the machine I can leave it on all the time. It takes up space, but is tolerable. This is the end mill we used yesterday. 3/4" diameter with a 5/8" shank, with a max. cutting depth on my machine of about 1-3/4".

IMG_4326.JPG

This is what the quality looks like in end grain walnut. They were just as smooth in the mahogany we cut yesterday.

IMG_4325.JPG

The Amana long mortising bit gave a result like this in edge grain.

IMG_4323.JPG

You can see it's rough, though still better than a chisel mortiser. It also vibrated in the cut so the 3/4" mortise ended up more like 0.78" wide. With the end mill they come out about 0.755 - 0.760" and look like this:

IMG_4324.JPG

The rough area at the top is from the Amana bit. That was the cut that grabbed so bad that I stopped and decided to try an end mill. The contrast between the two tools says it all.

Mreza, the mortising table has a stroke of nearly 5" and I think you could easily make 4" deep mortises if there is a bit that long that won't flex and wobble too badly. My hope is to find a 5/8" diameter bit that will let me go about 3" deep, and 2-1/2" with a 1/2" diameter bit. I think it's doable.

Rick, no, my world famous horizontal router mortiser still has a home in my shop. I still prefer it for anything up to about 1.5" deep. It's just so simple and fast to set up and use, and I think it's a better choice for small stock with smaller mortises. But for larger pieces of stock like these table parts were, the Mini Max has a clear advantage for cutting large, deep mortises, and I'm glad to have it.

John

[Brent McDonald]

You might have read a couple of posts I had related to finding the right mortising bits for my Mini Max mortiser. I tried a long Amana bit but it grabbed too much and had too much run out leaving a rough oversized mortise. It felt down right dangerous in my machine. Based on advise here I bought a shorter 2 flute center cutting end mill. Just perfect results up to the full cutting depth of about 1-5/8" on the 3/4" diameter bit.

That exercise was an effort to help my friend who's building a dining room table and needed to make about 30 or 40 mortises in the pedestal bases. Yesterday he brought his beautifully prepped mahogany stock over and we cut all the mortises. He's using loose tenons so we had to cut mortises in both long grain and end grain. The mortises came out beautiful; nice smooth side walls and all the same width. All the mortises were 1-9/16" deep and range from about 1-1/4" to 3-1/2" wide. He has a chisel mortiser and had contemplated using traditional mortise and tenon joints but he was happy he decided to go with loose tenons and my horizontal mortiser after he saw the first couple of mortises we made.

The Mini Max mortiser (FS 35) is a very robust platform and does its job well, but it has some downright dumb design features. The hold down clamp limits what could be an even greater travel range because it bangs into the fence assembly. The lateral and depth adjustments are under the table and very awkward and finicky to use. The work stop is comprised of two short pieces of steel with a gap in the middle rather than one long stop. That makes working with narrow pieces a challenge unless you add a supplemental fence, and I plan to change it to one long stop made out of aluminum. We joked that it looked like the mortiser was designed after a long Italian lunch and by the newby engineer. But we also both remarked that we would not have wanted to make those big mortises another way. I bought the FS35 because I wanted a wider J/P. The mortiser just happened to come with it. I'm now realizing I got a great bonus in the deal.

John

I recently acquired the same older FS35 with the mortising attachment on the back. I've spent a bunch of time refurbishing the machine and just about got it dialed in. Now I need to know where to get those tastey two flute center cutting end mills. Can you point me in a direction?

[John TenEyck]

I recently acquired the same older FS35 with the mortising attachment on the back. I've spent a bunch of time refurbishing the machine and just about got it dialed in. Now I need to know where to get those tastey two flute center cutting end mills. Can you point me in a direction?

Any end mill supplier should have what you need. I have bought them from McMaster Carr and at Amazon; turns out the end mills I got from both were made by Niagara Cutter. Just make sure the mills are center cutting. Also, you can't go wrong buying carbide but unless you plan to cut hundreds of mortises you can buy HSS ones much cheaper. I have cut dozens and dozens of mortises with them.

I think you're going to like the FS-35. Mine is a real joy to use. Also, I put a DRO on it earlier this year and like it a lot.

John

[Jeffrey Kretz]

Does a bird's mouth cutting bit compare favorably to a 2 flute center cutting end mill?

[John TenEyck]

Does a bird's mouth cutting bit compare favorably to a 2 flute center cutting end mill?

I can't say for sure, Jeff as I haven't used any, but I think so. I looked into buying some but the cost was so high that I chose to use end mills instead. What I can say for sure is the deep depth Amana mortising bits vibrated like crazy in my mortiser and I would never use them again with it.


John

[Mark Visconti]

I have a fs41 (used) with the mortising table attachment (came with). The thing scares/intimidates the .... out of me and I have never used it. Any safety recommendations other than don't stick your hand or other body part in the giant spinning bit of death? Can I xy the table with the bit in the work just like I would with a router or does one just plunge, retract, move in xy, repeat?

[John TenEyck]

I have a fs41 (used) with the mortising table attachment (came with). The thing scares/intimidates the .... out of me and I have never used it. Any safety recommendations other than don't stick your hand or other body part in the giant spinning bit of death? Can I xy the table with the bit in the work just like I would with a router or does one just plunge, retract, move in xy, repeat?

Yeah, don't put any body parts into that big spinning bit! I'm not sure about your machine, but with mine you can and should extend the blade guard attached to the back of the fence rearward over at least the chuck. In use, your hands are on the X and Y levers, so there should be no way to get into trouble unless you are wearing a tie or some such foolishness.

I find I get the smoothest mortises and least chatter if I plunge about 1/8" at one end of the mortise and then traverse laterally to the other end, then repeat that sequence from the starting end. I can't remember which way to traverse laterally, whether it's left or right, but it's really obvious on my machine that one direction feels a lot smoother and it shows in the cut quality.

A couple of interesting things I've found. If I tighten the clamp on my machine too tightly it causes the X-Y motion to bind. It must twist or bend the mortising table enough to bind on the ways. I'm not sure, but I know there's a limit on how much I can tighten the clamp and, unfortunately, it's not as tight as I often would like. So one option to assist with keeping the workpiece from shifting is to glue some 100 grit sandpaper to the mortising table.

The other thing I found is that if you place the clamp directly over where you are cutting the mortise it will push the upper wall of the mortise down as the bit cuts deeper under the clamp. After the mortise is cut you'll see that the side wall is thin in the middle on the upper side. Sometimes you can put the clamp behind or beside where you are mortising but other times there's no choice. In that case, the way to prevent the problem is by putting an additional piece of wood over the part to bridge the clamping load across the mortise.

Good luck.

John

[Rick Potter]

John,

I recently acquired a 2003 MM C300 Smart Combo machine.

Any tips or ideas on use of the mortiser would be appreciated. For example, do you use any jigs to hold rails and stiles?

[John TenEyck]

John,

I recently acquired a 2003 MM C300 Smart Combo machine.

Any tips or ideas on use of the mortiser would be appreciated. For example, do you use any jigs to hold rails and stiles?

Let me start by saying there are people with a lot more experience using this type of horizontal mortiser than me. What follows works for me. Pick what you like and seek input from others, too.

Number one is to always place a common face down on the mortising table. That will assure joints align flush or with the intended offset. Because of that requirement you have to group parts in order to use work stops to locate parts on the mortising table. That's often a pain the way I work so I use a different approach, one I developed when I built my horizontal router mortiser. I put a pencil line at the middle of the mortising table fence and set the stops equidistant on both sides for the mortise I want to cut. Then I cut a test mortise in some scrap to confirm the mortise is the right width and depth, and set at the right height. Then I place a pencil line at the center of the mortises on my parts, wherever they need to be cut. To cut the mortise I just align the center line on my workpiece with the centerline on the mortising table fence. That way, it makes no difference if I'm cutting the mortises in the left or right stiles. As long as the centerlines are aligned the mortises will come out correct.

I use a square to make sure narrow parts are perpendicular to the fence when clamping them down. Most of the parts I cut on this machine are fairly wide, usually 4" or more, and wide enough on their own that it's easy to register them square to the fence. But with narrower parts the square helps assure that they are. If I were to use this machine more I would likely drill and tap a few holes in the table and use them to clamp a right angle fence against.

I fooled around with a dust collection pick up for awhile, but eventually did away with it. The chips are pretty large and don't fly around very much; it doesn't both me but you may find a DC solution that works for you if you feel it's needed.

I always turn the machine off after a mortise is complete and let the bit come to a stop before removing/changing the workpiece. I know the motor would prefer to run non-stop but I prefer to keep my fingers so if I have to change a capacitor or two in the motor so be it.

I use the shortest bit for the depth I need to get to. I can cut mortises nearly 3" deep with a 4-1/2 or 5" bit, but for mortises only 1-1/2 - 2" deep I use a shorter bit. There's less deflection with shorter bits, they tolerate deeper cuts better, and cut smoother.

I am not super confident in the gripping power of the Wescott chuck used on my machine. I tighten it as much as I can by hand when I first install the bit, and then again after cutting a few mortises.

I hope some of this helps. If I missed something key to you please ask. Work safely and good luck. I'm sure you'll love all the features of that machine. I have nothing but good things to say about my FS-35. It's an absolute pleasure to use.

John