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Thread: We are losing our nearest Woodcraft

  1. #16
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Lewiston, Idaho
    Posts
    28,504
    For the record, I do shop online frequently. I am an Amazon Prime member and buy a lot of things for my wife, I and our family online. I have bought a lot of shop essentials, glue, sandpaper, etc. on line. Tools, however, I prefer to see if for no other reason than how they might fit my hands in the case of hand tools ( I am a big guy and have very large hands((think XXXLarge gloves))). For power tools I prefer to see them so I can look for what I would consider design "flaws" that might make them unhandy for my intended use and style of use. As far as power tools, I actually ordered a new CMS from Amazon, but the model they advertised was a different version than what they delivered. While the return process is easy, it's a pain just to have to do it. If I could have seen that it was the newer version I wouldn't have ordered it in the first place.

    BTW as stated earlier, buying online isn't always the cheapest or best deal for a given product. The same can be true about buying something at Costco though it took me a while to prove this to SWMBO.
    Ken

    So much to learn, so little time.....

  2. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Curt Harms View Post
    I think it likely that those of us whose hair isn't gray or missing are likely to be more comfortable and confident buying online. Any business relying heavily on selling machinery and other long lived goods is in for a tough go I think, it's not an expanding market.
    This is very true, and NOT a negative or positive comment on any particular generation. It's just a fact that each generation has certain consumer characteristics, habits and biases, most of which have been formed by the past. This has been studied in marketing school extensively. Retailing will always conform to the habits of the present and anticipated future consumer, not the past consumer.

    One of the demographic changes I have noticed is a much greater awareness of the time invested in getting in a car and going to a brick and mortar store, walking around, etc. If I leave my house to go buy something it seems like an hour to an hour and a half at least, even if the place is only 15 minutes away. There was a time when we never thought about this, but online commerce has made it very obvious and now time investment is part of the overall equation of "cheaper".

    I can't imagine many instances where it makes strategic sense to buy into a mom and pop brick/mortar franchise unless maybe the food service industry.

  3. #18
    One other thought specific to Woodcraft - I would think if a person spends a dollar in a Rockler brick/mortar store OR on Rockler's website, it makes no difference because their stores are all owned thus no conflict of interest.

    If a person goes to a Woodcraft store, handles some tools, goes home to think about it and then places their order online for the convenience, the store franchisee wouldn't benefit from the transaction. In this way, maybe Woodcraft online is in competition on some levels with the Woodcraft franchisee.
    Last edited by Edwin Santos; 05-22-2019 at 1:05 PM.

  4. I am a gray hair, but at least 85% of all my purchases of everything are online. My last big power tool purchases (table saw, bandsaw, jointer, planer) have all occurred online without seeing the tools in person.

    I'm old enough to remember when the salesmen at Sears knew what they were talking about, were helpful, gave good advise, and sold you what you needed.

    At my local Woodcraft store, it's find someone, ask questions, be told that "Jim handles bandsaws and he's not in now," then they'll rush away to greet "Norm" when he walks through the door though Norm isn't buying anything. Five employees gathered around the front desk, yucking it up with the good old boys, and I've got money in my pocket to buy something.

    They promote their "woodworking classes" as sales opportunities to tell you what you need to buy (from them).

    Nope. Not going back to my local Woodcraft store. I can buy online cheaper, faster, and at least Grizzly seems to appreciate my business.
    "If only those heathen atheists hadn't taken God, Jesus, and the Bible out of schools, God and Jesus could have thrown a Bible at the shooter."

  5. #20
    Woodcraft sucked, at least the few I visited.
    We do have a local independent store. They are dealers for Laguna, Martin, sawstop, festool ( I buy all my consumables there, last trip was 500 bucks) I try to get there once a month.

  6. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Chapel Eastland View Post
    At my local Woodcraft store, it's find someone, ask questions, be told that "Jim handles bandsaws and he's not in now," then they'll rush away to greet "Norm" when he walks through the door though Norm isn't buying anything. Five employees gathered around the front desk, yucking it up with the good old boys, and I've got money in my pocket to buy something.

    Nope. Not going back to my local Woodcraft store. I can buy online cheaper, faster, and at least Grizzly seems to appreciate my business.
    This sums up my Rockler experience as well. Maybe it's because I'm in my 30's, but it's just never a great experience. It's usually something like this:

    Walk in, (maybe) receive a hello.
    Tour store for a bit looking for what a need, not being approached by anyone. Ever.
    Find what I need, and head to check-out. Guy One is off stocking shelves. Guy Two is having a conversation with "Norm" either at the counter or nearby. Guy Three just walked away from the counter and isn't seen for 10 minutes, when he comes back and helps me after Guy One never looks my way and Guy Two doesn't seem to care that I'm there to spend money.

    When I wanted to buy a Revo 18/36 I asked the guy as I was checking out if they had them in stock. He didn't know what I was talking about until I pointed, then confirmed they had plenty in stock. When I was ready to buy I stopped in to pick it up, only to find out that it's a drop-ship only item. He didn't even ask if I wanted to order one, so I walked out and ordered it online.

    You need to make it easy for people to give you their money, not make it a chore. Alienating people trying to get into the hobby because they aren't part of your Old Boy's club isn't going to help your sales either. I have a nearby Woodcraft that I might try, but Rockler is only a mile from my house.

  7. #22
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    SE PA - Central Bucks County
    Posts
    65,685
    Interestingly, I've been to the "HQ" Woodcraft store in Parkersburg WV a few times because one of my larger government clients prior to retirement was in that town and I always drove there rather than fly. (the time was about the same when you added in all the extra time for airport security stuff, getting a rental and still having to drive a couple of hours, etc.) It was pretty much the same experience as "local" Woodcraft franchise stores...a brief nod when I walked in the door and back to their conversation. I say this in relevance to what Wes just wrote. While I generally want to just browse in the rare moment I go into a retail brick and mortar store, a little more "welcome" would enhance the chance that I might buy "something". The only Rockler I've been in was in Denver years ago. I don't remember much about the experience...it was too long ago. Honestly, I'm not really a good prospect as a customer for these stores at this point anymore because what I mostly buy is material and supplies. For the latter, "click" is faster and easier and I can immediately go back to working on what I'm creating, especially since I have a computer in the shop because of the CNC and it cheerfully connects to Lee Valley and Amazon any time I ask it to. I order sheet goods via email...and they deliver. Hardwood I go pickup from various places...none of them outside of one is "retail" as in store-front.

    Back in at the end of the 1990s when I was first setting up my hobby-focused shop, the local Woodcraft store as well as the local independent woodworking store were much more engaged when someone walked through the door and actively worked to get to know someone. They were not pushy, but were engaging and happy to see customers. I don't want this to sound the wrong way, but the employees tended to be younger at that point and many of them worked full time or close to it. Like so much of retail now, it's all part timers who are just putting in hours and the demographic "seems" to have aged in the same way that the larger percentage of the customer base has.
    Last edited by Jim Becker; 05-22-2019 at 8:31 PM.
    --

    The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...

  8. #23
    Join Date
    Mar 2015
    Location
    SE Michigan
    Posts
    3,222
    I’ve had a different experience with both my local Rockler and Woodcraft. May not get a welcome when I first walk in the door, but I’ve never spent much time in either with out someone coming over to see if I need help. While the sales folks do have their area of woodworking expertise, they all seem to have good general knowledge and able to help with whatever question I may have. Because Rockler is company owned, I don’t hesitate to order online. I do try to shop at the franchise owned Woodcraft.

    Being a franchisee myself (not woodworking), Jim’s points are right on. 12 months or so before lease renewal, you take a hard look at the business trends and have to decide if you’re going to go another 5 years. Fortunately many of our products are managed by set advertised pricing, Amazon has a local warehouse so taxes apply, and our products are relatively expensive...items folks want to try before purchase. Once they see pricing is the same and we include assembly and delivery, we get very little loss to online sales. I hate to see franchise businesses go away, but I certainly can understand when they do.

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