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Thread: Notre Dame what changes in the rebuild?

  1. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Walsh View Post


    You know so my purist vision is mostly driven by the fact that generally speaking even most craftspeople and tradesman today homeowners and and developers alike could give a rats ass about craftsmanship so long as the $$$ is rolling in.
    I've often thought about the point you are making and wondered if the craftsmanship we see in world monuments is there because of deeper motivations than a simple paycheck. I'm talking about motivations like spiritual devotion, commitment to the emperor or republic (patriotism you might say). I also wonder whether there was a time when pride in a trade and a sense of belonging to that trade inspired a standard of craftsmanship that might have become diluted once tradesmen started thinking about themselves only. Standards and a tradition of quality might be one of the good things that came out of trade unions and guilds the way they existed once upon a time.

    Sorry for drifting off topic, but I guess we're in the off topic forum so maybe it's okay? Interesting discussion though.

  2. #32
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    I'm sure you are correct. Who will cause the the repair and how will it be paid for. Maybe a fund appeal should be started.

  3. #33
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    It is entirely possibly to install a modern roof structure on Notre Dame that looks 99% the same as the structure prior to the fire except to those allowed up into the attic. My understanding is there is a false ceiling that hides all the roof timbers.

    Have they started to remove all the scaffolding yet? I assume it is all scrap metal at this point due to heat from the fire.

  4. #34
    I can see both sides of this. I like the shape and "texture" of the design Edwin posted. There is one element I strongly disagree with: turning a Cathedral into a farm and farmer's market. I think that some level of respect and reverance is still appropriate even if the french people choose to remodel rather than preserve.

    At the same time, this is Notre Dame, not just any old building. It's a world heritage site because of its architecture and its history. I don't think subsequent generations HAVE TO stay with what their forefathers built. But this building is 700 years old and is still magnificent. To me, significant changes warrant very careful consideration.

    I really enjoyed reading Tom's thoughts, as one who makes these trades regularly.

    At the end of the day, the french will decide what makes sense to them. Like them or not, they are a people proud of their history. I'm betting they'll ultimately move in the sort of direction Tom showed in his pictures and preserve rather than remodel.

    Fred
    "All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing."
    - Sir Edmund Burke

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by lowell holmes View Post
    I'm sure you are correct. Who will cause the the repair and how will it be paid for. Maybe a fund appeal should be started.
    That happened immediately with funding from both the French government and a large number of private parties. Money is not likely going to be a major issue with this one...
    --

    The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...

  6. #36
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    Notre Dame Cathedral is owned by the Roman Catholic Church/Archdiocese of Paris, not the French government, correct? Why would the Archbishop of the diocese, all those Cardinals and or Pope Francis allow the cathedral to be turned into some generic commercial secular tourist attraction? It was consecrated to the Virgin Mary. Just because a fire occurred doesn't change that fact.

    I assume the catholic church leaders will decide how best to rebuild it.
    Vortex! What Vortex?

  7. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by lowell holmes View Post
    I'm sure you are correct. Who will cause the the repair and how will it be paid for. Maybe a fund appeal should be started.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Becker View Post
    That happened immediately with funding from both the French government and a large number of private parties. Money is not likely going to be a major issue with this one...
    Last update I saw was in late April and at that point, the total amount committed was well over $1 billion USD. Those were all voluntary donations without anyone "asking".

  8. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by Joe Mioux View Post
    Notre Dame Cathedral is owned by the Roman Catholic Church/Archdiocese of Paris, not the French government, correct? Why would the Archbishop of the diocese, all those Cardinals and or Pope Francis allow the cathedral to be turned into some generic commercial secular tourist attraction? It was consecrated to the Virgin Mary. Just because a fire occurred doesn't change that fact.

    I assume the catholic church leaders will decide how best to rebuild it.
    Wrong. Notre Dame Cathedral is owned by the French state which has granted exclusive use of it to the Archdiocese. It is expected that both will have a say in how it will be repaired and rebuilt.
    If there was a disagreement between the two parties, my bet would be that the buck stops with the French government. A lot of this stems from a 1905 law that separated church and state in France which basically resulted in the state taking ownership of church properties and granting exclusive perpetual use rights back to the church.

    This said, I wouldn't worry too much. The French government is as hung up on tradition as anyone, and I would be surprised to see them advocate for anything generically commercial. However, anyone who has been to Notre Dame, especially in the summer, would agree that it is as much a tourist attraction as anything else. There are always throngs of tourists there. I'm talking thousands of people.

  9. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Edwin Santos View Post
    Wrong. Notre Dame Cathedral is owned by the French state which has granted exclusive use of it to the Archdiocese. It is expected that both will have a say in how it will be repaired and rebuilt.
    If there was a disagreement between the two parties, my bet would be that the buck stops with the French government. A lot of this stems from a 1905 law that separated church and state in France which basically resulted in the state taking ownership of church properties and granting exclusive perpetual use rights back to the church.

    This said, I wouldn't worry too much. The French government is as hung up on tradition as anyone, and I would be surprised to see them advocate for anything generically commercial. However, anyone who has been to Notre Dame, especially in the summer, would agree that it is as much a tourist attraction as anything else. There are always throngs of tourists there. I'm talking thousands of people.
    France is a secular state, that is nominally catholic. The public alarm over the fire was based more on the assault (by fire) on a cultural icon than on a religious icon.

    BTW, I thought the aforementioned glass roof was utterly brilliant.

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