NRS burr

[Richard Dooling]

Most everybody I read uses negative rake scrapers with a burr. Some just use the burr off the grinder but others hone that off and make a new burr.

Now I'm seeing carbide tips ground in NGR profiles. How well does work since, to my knowledge, you can't put a burr on carbide? Even if you could it would be so brittle that it would break off immediately I think. Maybe these tips work okay on very hard woods?

[John K Jordan]

Most everybody I read uses negative rake scrapers with a burr. Some just use the burr off the grinder but others hone that off and make a new burr.

Now I'm seeing carbide tips ground in NGR profiles. How well does work since, to my knowledge, you can't put a burr on carbide? Even if you could it would be so brittle that it would break off immediately I think. Maybe these tips work okay on very hard woods?

Someone very familiar with HSS NRS should buy one and test and compare! It would be nice to know if the were hype or revolution. I imagine they could be constructed with a sort of burr from the start.

[Kyle Iwamoto]

The Easy Wood NR Carbide? I was interested, and picked up the micro NR Round. First off, I am NOT a carbide fan. I'm also not a pro. I do own carbides, and I do use them when they function better than traditional tools. The NR Carbide works, as well as a regular carbide works compared to a traditional gouge. It's not as clean, but the benefits are no sharpening, and ease of use. Same for the NR Carbide. It works, not as well as a real fresh NR scraper with a burr. You don't have to stop and sharpen, it does work and you could use it a long long time to finish up the insides of a bowl. I am impressed, and I did buy a spare. If you already have the handle, it's not a big investment to buy the insert. Not sure if the big ones fit in the same handle, but the micro does fit.
I don't think it has a burr.

[Richard Dooling]

The ones I'm seeing online don't look to have a burr at all.

Kyle, I agree that the carbide can be useful but is generally inferior. I have two and find I'm using them less and less.

I do sharpen the carbide - flat side only, on a diamond hone is pretty good though not as good as factory. I don't see haw you could do that with the negative rake profile.

[JohnC Lucas]

I use the Hunter cupped carbides in a fashion similar to shear scraping. In this fashion they function a lot like a negative rake scraper. They don't have a burr but are very sharp so it's very similar to using a skew as a scraper. I have tried using flat carbides as shear scrapers but they just don't leave a finish as clean as a HSS negative rake scraper that has a fresh burr. I don't mind sanding. It's what really elevates the quality of your pieces. That being said I prefer to do as little as I can so I want the cleanest cutting tools I can use.

[neil mackay]

I would have thought that it would be very hard or nigh on impossible to make a burr on Tungsten Carbide. I dont use a lot of negative scraping, but on the occasion I do I tend to just lift the handle on my regular scraper until its in the negative position. Not for everybody I must admit,but it does the job for me.

[Reed Gray]

The burr is an issue, and there is a lot of debate. No clue as to how the carbide works. Don't have any of that type. With the standard NRS, the skew chisel/same bevel on both sides, most use the grinder burr. That edge is too fragile, as in not enough metal under the burr to support or burnish one without it fracturing. Very high maintenance. With the box type NRSs, most being in the 60 or 70/ 20 or 30 degree range, many use the grinder burr. The debate here is sharpening right side up or up side down. Those who sharpen up side down claim it is a sharper burr. I haven't done much with them this way, but it seems the up side down one is much more fragile than the right side up one. Then there is the burnished burr. Hone off the grinder burr and a few light passes with a carbide tipped burnishing rod. This is a very sharp and very long lasting burr, and cuts the cleanest, and you don't need to constantly go back to the grinder to touch it up. In the harder end grain woods, it can leave a 600 grit surface if your hand is steady enough. Watching Eric Loffstrom at the Oregon Woodturning Symposium last weekend was refreshing. He is at least as different as I am...

robo hippy

[Harold Balzonia]

Stuart Batty invented the term “negative rake scraper” some 18-20 years ago. He says that in order for a tool to be considered a NRS, it MUST have a burr. It’s in his definition, and since he invented the term, I guess he gets to decide. He scoffs at the carbide versions recently promoted and says they are definitely not negative rake scrapers.

At around the 1:40 mark he speaks about this.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=N7BjRcSDurM

[Reed Gray]

Well, Stuart may have coined the phrase, but he didn't invent the tool. I took a work shop with he and his dad, maybe 15 years ago or less, and don't remember either of them using that term.

I just watched that part of the video... I wasn't a member of the AAW at that time, and he said he wrote that article back then, so maybe. I do agree that the carbide versions are not NRSs.

robo hippy

[Randy Heinemann]

After talking with an Easy Wood rep at a recent Woodworking Show, I bought the NR round carbide cutter for my full-size Easy Wood Finisher. He was (he says anyway) he was directly involved in the testing of the NR cutters now sold by Easy Wood and that they cut smoother and make it even less possible to get a catch than the regular Easy Wood cutters and work especially well to smooth out the inside of a bowl.

I have tried the new NR cutter and do like it. It allows more control and is less aggressive than the regular carbide cutter, so it would seem to be mainly for clean up; not roughing out the inside. I currently own HSS scrapers, the Easy Wood tool, and a Hunter carbide tool with a slanted head. I like them all. While I feel that the HSS probably does result in a smoother finish, the NR Easy Wood does work almost as well. (Note: I started out with all carbide since I didn't want to get into sharpening, but sharpen with my Tormek and work with both HSS steel and carbide.)

As far as sharpening the carbide cutters, I also have done that with the diamond Tormek wheel. I find that I can get a good edge on the carbide with this wheel and, to date, it's unclear how many times I can sharpen each cutter, but it's at least 3 or 4 times. I don't believe that sharpening necessarily puts a burr on the edge but Tormek recommended that you use the flat side of the diamond wheel to smooth the flat (top) side of the cutters. I don't do that and it doesn't seem to make any difference after using the flattening method the first time.

My opinion is that, for those who already own an Easy Wood finisher, the NR cutter is a good buy to help smooth the inside of bowls. For those who use only HSS, I think you probably get better results with HSS.

[Kyle Iwamoto]

More on the EWT NR carbide. I'm currently working on a small batch of pens, and just for laughs, I again used the NR carbide on a "finish cut" on the blank. It cuts well enough even without a burr. Not as clean as a sharp spindle gouge, but clean enough. I sand anyways. It cuts cleaner than the regular carbide.
Yep it works, and works well enough. Pretty much catch proof. And as previously mentioned, if you already have the EW handles, it's not a huge investment. I think it's 20 bucks or so well spent. They may even fit other brand handles.