Combination Machine Questions

[Annu Marwaha]

Hello All,

I’m in the process of getting either a Hammer c3-31 or Minimax 300 Lab Plus. I’ve reached out to both companies and want to see if I can find someone willing to let me take a look. I have a 3rd garage (12’x30’) that I will set this up in. Couple of questions:

Is it difficult to add leveling castors to these? I want to be able to slide the machine from the long side of the room to the center of the room and the wheel kits that come with the machines look cumbersome.

I typically use a track saw to break down sheets so I wasn’t sure if I really need the sliding table that comes with the Minimax. They are about the same price so I was leaning towards the Hammer since they more presence in the US.

If any one has experience, how hard is it to align the planes of the jointer table; or the sliding table to the cast iron part of the table saw?

Thanks,
Annu

[Rod Sheridan]

Hi, the mobility kit from Hammer is my favourite method of moving the machines.

Alignment isn’t difficult however it may be advantageous to have a Felder tech commission the machine, depending upon your skill level and tool compliment.

Neither of my machines needed on site adjustment.....Rod.

[Annu Marwaha]

Thanks Rod. My concern is that my garage floor slopes quite a bit. For my current contractor saw setup, I installed 4 leveling castors in the corners so that I could get it level. I’m not sure if this is possible on these machines. I’m also worried that due to the weight, the twist style leveling castors would be a pain to work.

-Annu

[Mike Wilkins]

Reconsider the sliding wagon on the tablesaw. I have found this to be one of the safest methods of making cross cuts and it keeps your digits a safe distance from the blade action. You could keep the machine next to a wall on the planer/jointer side of the machine, moving it away when these functions are needed. These machines have still, stable chassis, so it should not be a concern unless you have one wheel hanging in mid-air, which could easily be shimmed level.

[Kevin Beitz]

Check out Grizzlys Mobil bases.

[Carl Beckett]

I have a MM 300 Smart. It uses a 'johnson bar' type mobility setup. Essentially you hook a wagon tongue onto the front of the unit and when you push down it lifts the machine and can roll around where you want it. Quite easy to move around considering the weight that is being pushed.

As for leveling - I do not know.

But are you suggesting you would not get the sliding table? (I think maybe you mean the outrigger that provides supports on the table?). I would get it, and just hang it on the wall when not in use. Many here leave the outrigger off most the time. But I end up leaving mine on all the time (but 12" isnt a wide space!)

[Greg Parrish]

I just picked up a Felder KF500 used, and it came with a pallet jack. It’s one of the narrow fork pallet jacks and fits right under the tunnel beneath the machine. My hammer jointer/planer and my minimax MM16 bandsaw both have the mobility kits for comparison. My point is, I don’t know how I made it all these years without owning a pallet jack. I can level the saw with feet but can still move the saw easily. The pallet jack made easy work of moving my lathe last week, and I’ve used it on numerous other shop moves. Given the need to change saw directions and locations due to the narrower floor dimension in your shop, a pallet jack might be an easy way to go if you will be moving the saw a lot.

Thanks Rod. My concern is that my garage floor slopes quite a bit. For my current contractor saw setup, I installed 4 leveling castors in the corners so that I could get it level. I’m not sure if this is possible on these machines. I’m also worried that due to the weight, the twist style leveling castors would be a pain to work.

-Annu

[Jim Becker]

There are various ways to level a machine once it's in your shop. It's a lot easier if you can park it in one spot...mobility complicates leveling because even moving it an inch or three can completely change the leveling settings on many floors. Some machines are drilled and tapped for machine levelers; some require using add-on leveling systems. Some of us just use pieces of plywood. My shop floor slopes and my slider, while oriented perpendicular to the slope, has the "front" corners raised 3/4" to level the machine. Only my SCM/Minimax sliding table saw, CNC machine, heavy lathe and workbench are "officially" leveled. I don't worry about it for other machines, including my SCM/Minimax J/P and Bandsaw.

[Richard Coers]

Personally, I think leveling casters would really increase the time to moving the machine. These things are heavy! Then you are down on your hands and knees working with a tiny ratchet lever and having to look up at a level for all 4 corners. I'm thinking you would add at least a half hour every time you moved the thing! Nothing I would want to do with my Minimax combo.

[Rod Sheridan]

Hi, I’ve never worried about level as it isn’t important.

Any indeed or outfeed extensions clamp to the machine so level isn’t important.

I’m sure none of mine are level because I move them, and my basement floor has a slope for drainage......Rod.

[Jim Becker]

What about everything being at least co-planer, Rod? Cast iron and steel do bend a remarkable amount when a heavy machine hasn't been at least setup so everything is "level" with everything else on the machine. That was a lesson I learned keenly years ago when I was setting up my 800 lb Stubby lathe with centers in both the headstock and the tailstock pointing at each other from a close distance. It took some jiggering to "level" things up so that the machine had zero twist and the centers were perfectly lined up. I would imagine this could affect a combo machine in at least a small way, but whether or not it's meaningful or not I don't know.

[Rod Sheridan]

Hi Jim, I have never had an issue with that, nor have I fielded any customer complaints regarding that. Many of the machines we sell offer mobility as an option.

The sort of machines I own aren’t heavy, they’re a maximum of 800 pounds.

Now, I’m sure the machines do deflect, however not an amount that would affect your use of them
At work, many of the machines I deal with are on vibration isolators and move during load changes, yet they maintain their alignment, even though they may be 50,000 pounds in weight.

Regards, Rod

[Greg Parrish]

Level on the slider is probably mostly about keeping the slide from running away. As long as everything is in common plane it should be fine. I still say a pallet jack would be great for the OP unless he goes with the wheel kit.

[Dan Friedrichs]

My C3-31 is in a garage with a steep slope to the floor (the prior owner really didn't want standing water, apparently), and I've never had the slider move by gravity - maybe if you upgrade to the more expensive model with the nicer bearings you start running into that issue

At least on the Hammer, the factory mobility kit is nice, and I wouldn't trade it for leveling casters. That sounds like a huge pain. It's nice to be able to quickly turn the machine to accommodate especially long boards, etc. Having it level is completely unnecessary.

[Scott Allen27]

I am in a similar situation - combo machine in a 2 car garage.
I chose the Minimax CU300 Classic , and have no regrets. Its a great machine.
I also debated whether or not to get casters. I chose to get them for a couple reasons.
Primarily, I didn't really have space to store a narrow fork pallet jack - if I did I would have just gone that route.
However, there are also casters that have a urethane pad , which really helps dampen vibration.
These are the ones I got:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Not cheap, but worth every penny to me. You can ratchet them up, move the machine, then lower them back down on the pad. It does take a little time to level it, but it doesn't really bother me, since I don't move the machine much.
Also, they are great for getting the machine level on bad slabs - and I do think these machines benefit from being truly level.

Also, between the lab and the Hammer. I went and looked at a Minimax lab before I chose the CU300 - it actually seemed like a really nice little machine - almost like a scaled down CU300.
I will say this, if you can swing it, move up to the CU300. Get the 8.5" slider. It is not too big for a 2 car garage. Just take advantage of the space outside your garage door. Position the machine with the back facing the door, and then position the outrigger a couple feet back of the top end of the slider - and you can do must cuts (anything under about 7') with the door closed.

Also, I know everyone already knows this, but Sam Blasco is awesome to work with - contact him if you want more details about the CU300.
Good luck!