Results 1 to 13 of 13

Thread: cabinet door workflow

  1. #1

    cabinet door workflow

    I'm trying to find a good process for finishing 12 cabinet doors. The plan is to use SW Proclassic, with Target Coatings EM6000 top coat. I have a cheapy HomeRight sprayer. What is your workflow for painting, and top coating cabinet doors? Do you paint the fronts first, and the backs second? How many coats of topcoat? Do you sand between each layer? I saw a video about hanging the doors, on a coat rack, and painting both sides at once. Is that better than one side at a time? I've spent a lot of time on these doors and don't want a crappy finish to ruin the project. Thanks

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Apr 2016
    Location
    Tasmania
    Posts
    2,162
    John, I recommend that you re-think the products you are planning to use. Firstly, it is risky using products from different manufacturers. There is no guarantee that they will be compatible and failure can be immediate or show up just when you have relaxed with relief that you had gotten away with it. Secondly, coatings like the SW Proclassic are not really designed for top coating with a clear. If you want a painted finish, use a primer and coloured top coat from the same manufacturer and are designed to work together. You will also get technical support from the manufacturer if you are using their products all the way through. Mix manufacturers and no-one will give you the time of day. Other guys will recommend good options for coating products. I am on the other side of the planet so my choices have different brand names.

    When spraying, do the backs first and then the fronts. Set your self up some temporary racks so that you can spray them in one area and then move them to your drying rack. Doing the backs first means there is a lesser chance of visibly marring the coating if you turn them fractionally too soon. Doing them flat takes a bit longer but you get to work in a comfortable position. Hanging up means you have to get around and under each door and your chances of runs are much higher.

    Always sand between coats. Dust nibs etc get worse, not better if you leave them. 320-400 between coats is the usual. Cheers
    Every construction obeys the laws of physics. Whether we like or understand the result is of no interest to the universe.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    WNY
    Posts
    9,648
    In addition to the excellent advise from Wayne, I have doubts your sprayer will handle ProClassic. It's a great product, and needs no topcoat, but it's really, really thick. It's only sprayable with an airless or pressure feed gun without thinning, and thinning it very much is not a good idea. You might want to look into Target Coatings EM-6500 which can be color matched by TC to any of Benjamin Moore's 6000+ colors. It has much lower viscosity and can be sprayed with a much wider range of spray guns.

    With regards to spraying, bottoms and edges first, as Wayne said. I always spray flat whenever possible. It's just so much easier and more forgiving if you spray a little heavy. When the bottoms are dry I spray the tops and the edges again on the first coat. After that, bottoms and edges, then the tops.

    Spraying hanging doors looks like it makes sense, until you try it.

    John

  4. #4
    Thanks for the advice. I didn't know that paint companies have technical support! Unfortunately, the ship had already sailed on the materials, as they have been order. Do you put all the coats on a side and then move to the opposite, or do you put one coat on all sides, then repeat?

    Thanks,
    John

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    SE PA - Central Bucks County
    Posts
    65,688
    You are not likely going to be pleased with the EM6000 over the Pro Classic. I suggest you either use the Pro Classic by itself (it doesn't really need to be top-coated and is quite durable) or use EM6500 white which can be top-coated with EM6000 clear in your desired sheen since they are the same product chemically. My kitchen lowers are painted with Pro Classic white and have been holding up extraordinarily well. (in full disclosure, they had the two generations back predecessor to EM6500 on the when they were built in 2003, but spraying them in-place wasn't an option when they finally needed refreshed two years ago...hence, the Pro Classic which was brushed on)
    --

    The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Apr 2016
    Location
    Tasmania
    Posts
    2,162
    As Jim said, it's not going to be worth it to put the clear over the paint you bought. Save the clear for another job. It is not just that the look won't be perfect, rather that you are risking out right failure of the coating system. Cheers

  7. #7
    I've used both ProClassic oil and wb, as well as Emtech pigmnented lacquer. Of the three, I think the Emtech is the best as far as final finish. I don't know about durability. I sprayed all three through an HVLP gun w/ 1.4mm tip. I've also sprayed the alkyd ProClassic through a turbine. Either way, it needs to be thinned.

    I consider myself and "advanced amateur" when it comes to painting. But I'll tell you what does and doesn't work for me.

    The finer the tip, the better the finish what you want for cabs. Big tips spray big drops - good for laying on a thick coat fast, like painting a wall.

    Small orifice means the paint has to be thinned, and some latex paint has to be thinned a lot. On the ProClassic wb its not so bad, probably about 10-15%. 20-30 seconds through a Ford cup seems to work well for me using either type of sprayer. I've heard some people use windshield washer fluid to thin instead of water. Never tried it.

    I prefer spraying horizontally because 1) I can see the surface better and 2) thinned paint runs easily, IOW amateurs can get drips :-). I alternate coats on each side, sanding between coats. Primer: 220 grit, top coat: 320. I use BIN shellac based primer almost exclusively, but it doesn't have any filling ability. I like it because of the rapid dry time and it sands well.

    Advantage to vertical spraying is doing both sides at once. I used cup hooks screwed into the bottoms and hang from coat hangar. But you have to be very careful not to spray to heavy or it will run and you have to get a system to store painted panels away from overspray.

    Give it a try, but I'm not too sure about your sprayer giving a quality finish. A very economical way to start, if you have a capable compressor, is a Harbor Freight purple gun. Practice til you get the paint thinned enough. With 1.4mm HVLP you have to thin quite a bit.

    Bottom line: I suggest you need a different sprayer. Go ahead and get a Ford cup this will help you understand viscosity and give you some reference. Oh, and a roll of kraft paper & a piece of plywood to practice on :-).

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    SE PA - Central Bucks County
    Posts
    65,688
    Thinning beyond 10% isn't the best idea for a water borne finish, even for 100% acrylics like the ProClassic. Per John T's recommendation, I recently upgraded to a pressure assisted gun with the PPS container to help deal with spraying some finishes that just were not going on well with what I had been using for a long time. I absolutely agree with the Ford cup recommendation and acquired one of those awhile back to help to better understand what the gun setup needs are for a particular finish.
    --

    The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...

  9. #9
    How do you think the EM6000 is going to react with the Proclassic? For what it’s worth the paint is white. I used Proclassic gloss on a cabinet/ bench seat a few years ago and we couldn’t clean it very well. I was hoping that the top coat would be a little more cleanable.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    SE PA - Central Bucks County
    Posts
    65,688
    EM6000 is designed to "burn in" between the coats of itself. I have no way of knowing if the chemical properties that allow for that in the EM6000 are going to react in a negative way with the ProClassic. There's zero issue if you use the EM6500 for your white and then future top coat with EM6000 clear. Mixing finishing manufacturers can bring risk.

    I've not had any issue keeping the ProClassic (satin) clean in our kitchen. Everything wipes right off. For "clean-ability", I'd choose E8000cv instead of EM6000 for better chemical resistance. My new uppers have EM6500 tinted for color and are top coated with EM8000cv. The lowers, as mentioned, have ProClassic because they were painted "in place" when I renewed things a few years ago.
    --

    The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...

  11. #11
    Quick update. I tested spraying the proclassic, both original and thinned with water. It seems to work okay. I have no experience with spraying anything, but it looks okay. It went on even over the test pieces. The thinned stuff was easier to put on too thick and it ran a little. I'm going to test to look of just the paint and one with the topcoat just to compare. I'm sure I'll look back at this experience and think, "What was I thinking doing that?"

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Mar 2016
    Location
    Millstone, NJ
    Posts
    1,590
    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Becker View Post
    EM6000 is designed to "burn in" between the coats of itself. I have no way of knowing if the chemical properties that allow for that in the EM6000 are going to react in a negative way with the ProClassic. There's zero issue if you use the EM6500 for your white and then future top coat with EM6000 clear. Mixing finishing manufacturers can bring risk.

    I've not had any issue keeping the ProClassic (satin) clean in our kitchen. Everything wipes right off. For "clean-ability", I'd choose E8000cv instead of EM6000 for better chemical resistance. My new uppers have EM6500 tinted for color and are top coated with EM8000cv. The lowers, as mentioned, have ProClassic because they were painted "in place" when I renewed things a few years ago.

    Jim do you catalyze your em6500?
    Also how many coats did you end up with of 6500/8000

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    SE PA - Central Bucks County
    Posts
    65,688
    Quote Originally Posted by George Yetka View Post
    Jim do you catalyze your em6500?
    Also how many coats did you end up with of 6500/8000
    I've only used the crosslinker with the EM8000cv. The number of coats varies based on "how it's looking", honestly. With my current gun, 3-4 is more than adequate for the clears. For the EM6500 colored product, typically two coats.
    --

    The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •