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Thread: adjustable groovers for shapers-which ones ?

  1. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Greg Parrish View Post
    If the 228mm fits your shaper and hood, can these work for both saw and shaper purposes?

    http://us.feldershop.com/en-US/en-US...nit-RB-HW.html
    You can use some groovers in a saw, just need to verify RPMs, spindle size etc but the larger the diameter your tooling the more demands on you shaper and the more it needs to be dialled in perfectly. 0.001 runout makes a bigger difference on 300mm tooling than it does with 96mm tooling.

    B
    https://shorturl.at/mRTU3

  2. #17
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    Greg people with the 500 series saws are limited too 180mm tooling like in the link. The alternative is to get the Forrest dado set that is already bored to 30mm with pinholes. Both will work in the and the shaper with a 30mm spindle. The unit you linked too will work in the 700 series and shaper with a 30mm spindle and the 240mm hood. The problem with both Felder units is neither will cut a 1/4 slot and both leave bat ears.

    http://us.feldershop.com/en-US/en-US...B-HW-oxid.html

    https://www.forrestblades.com/dado-k...ng-case-clone/

  3. #18
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    Thanks John. I thought the 500 and hammer units could use the 200mm blades. Oh well. Regardless, I have that Forest dado blade set new in package. Came with my saw.

    Guess the whitehill 160mm sets are a good deal then compared to the Felder prices.

    Quote Originally Posted by John Kee View Post
    Greg people with the 500 series saws are limited too 180mm tooling like in the link. The alternative is to get the Forrest dado set that is already bored to 30mm with pinholes. Both will work in the and the shaper with a 30mm spindle. The unit you linked too will work in the 700 series and shaper with a 30mm spindle and the 240mm hood. The problem with both Felder units is neither will cut a 1/4 slot and both leave bat ears.

    http://us.feldershop.com/en-US/en-US...B-HW-oxid.html

    https://www.forrestblades.com/dado-k...ng-case-clone/
    D
    Last edited by Greg Parrish; 02-03-2019 at 9:14 PM.

  4. #19
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    Greg the Whitehall stuff doesn't come with the pinholes so you can only use it in the shaper. The good thing is that Felder recognizes the fact that using a dado type setup is allowed in other countries and makes tooling and a wide range of accessories to fit their machines. That Forrest dado set you got is quite versatile and has a great cut. A friend loaned me his to test and it produced a better cut in melamine than the Hammer unit I had with no bat ears or chip out. My current dado is a Freud SD508 that I had bored to 30 mm and pinholes added and gives a flawless cut. The shaper rabbit hole is quite deep for hobby people and I always suggest proper training, not the type you get from a YouTube wanna bee.

  5. #20
    Hi Greg, note that the Forrest Dado stack doesn't always have holes drilled for drive pins like yours does unless you order it as an option. The laws of physics do not know if you have a regular dado stack on the arbor or an adjustable groover without drive holes on the arbor with respect to wanting to spin the nut off. Equal care must be taken in each situation.

    I was looking at Radial Arm Saws a little while ago and found a big mainland European manufacturer of RASs that actually ships the Whitehill 300mm adjustable groovers with their RASs. That's a pretty big groover set!
    Last edited by brent stanley; 02-04-2019 at 11:43 AM.
    https://shorturl.at/mRTU3

  6. #21
    Just looked at the Felder set and for 6.3-20mm it's $1060 USD.....YEOWZA!
    https://shorturl.at/mRTU3

  7. #22
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    The Forrest Dado stack that John posted a link for, does have pinholes for the felder machines.

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by brent stanley View Post
    Just looked at the Felder set and for 6.3-20mm it's $1060 USD.....YEOWZA!
    Since you are so fixated on cutter price what would the equivalent 228mm diameter 6.3 to 12mm and 12 to 20mm with pinholes cost so we can compare apples to apples.

  9. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Delyster View Post
    The Forrest Dado stack that John posted a link for, does have pinholes for the felder machines.
    It's available as an option I see, but the picture on that page doesn't have the pin holes. I edited my post. The point is unless you have aggressive DC injection braking or an aggressively applied manual brake, it's no different than a table saw running a regular dado stack which is done all the time. No question drive pins are better than not and if Greg's unit has braking I would say it's essential.
    Last edited by brent stanley; 02-04-2019 at 10:44 AM.
    https://shorturl.at/mRTU3

  10. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Greg Parrish View Post
    Thanks John. I thought the 500 and hammer units could use the 200mm blades. Oh well. Regardless, I have that Forest dado blade set new in package. Came with my saw.

    Guess the whitehill 160mm sets are a good deal then compared to the Felder prices.


    D
    I guess if you have the Forrest set for the saw you're pretty well set up for dados in the saw then and you're just looking for a set for the spindle. One thing to think about is whether or not the Forrest set is MAN rated and if that is something you're concerned about.

    I also wonder about when you split the adjustable groovers to make both cheeks of the tenon at the same time if it retains the MAN rating? Essentially you're spinning two separate incomplete discs, (separated by your tenon thickness) that each have an enormous break in the cutting circle. Will have to wade into the regs to know for sure....
    https://shorturl.at/mRTU3

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by brent stanley View Post
    I guess if you have the Forrest set for the saw you're pretty well set up for dados in the saw then and you're just looking for a set for the spindle. One thing to think about is whether or not the Forrest set is MAN rated and if that is something you're concerned about.

    I also wonder about when you split the adjustable groovers to make both cheeks of the tenon at the same time if it retains the MAN rating? Essentially you're spinning two separate incomplete discs, (separated by your tenon thickness) that each have an enormous break in the cutting circle. Will have to wade into the regs to know for sure....
    The set I have maintains the MAN rating when inverted for tenons. There isn't a break in the cutting circle as the 2 pieces are indexed.........Rod.

  12. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Rod Sheridan View Post
    The set I have maintains the MAN rating when inverted for tenons. There isn't a break in the cutting circle as the 2 pieces are indexed.........Rod.
    The head would change from a "round form" head to a "non-round-form" head so the maximum allowable projection would change depending on how it's configured. You would have to verify, but I expect it's designed for the 1.1mm projection anyway. There's a LOT more to the regs when you mine down into it all.
    https://shorturl.at/mRTU3

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by brent stanley View Post
    It's available as an option I see, but the picture on that page doesn't have the pin holes. I edited my post. The point is unless you have aggressive DC injection braking or an aggressively applied manual brake, it's no different than a table saw running a regular dado stack which is done all the time. No question drive pins are better than not.
    I know a picture is typically worth a thousand words but reading the actual link helps along with fact that Forrest has this set as an orderable piece. For the record Felder saws and shapers come with electronic braking since for some reason you are taking this sideways.

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by brent stanley View Post
    The head would change from a "round form" head to a "non-round-form" head so the maximum allowable projection would change depending on how it's configured. You would have to verify, but I expect it's designed for the 1.1mm projection anyway. There's a LOT more to the regs when you mine down into it all.
    Brent, the cutter comes from the manufacturer with instructions on how to use it in both configurations, and carries the MAN rating.

    The manufacturer took care of all that for me...........Rod.

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by brent stanley View Post
    It's available as an option I see, but the picture on that page doesn't have the pin holes. I edited my post. The point is unless you have aggressive DC injection braking or an aggressively applied manual brake, it's no different than a table saw running a regular dado stack which is done all the time. No question drive pins are better than not and if Greg's unit has braking I would say it's essential.
    Greg's machine is a Felder, it has electronic braking.......Rod

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