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Thread: HF DC Retrofit OR Mini Gorilla?

  1. #1

    HF DC Retrofit OR Mini Gorilla?

    Hi all,

    I'm looking for advice on DC. I'll cut right to the chase - I'm between retrofitting a HF single stage DC unit OR spending quite a bit more on Oneida's Mini Gorilla. The HF retrofit would cost $539 (it would include adding Oneida's 5" SDD ($169) with 17 gallon steel drum ($101) and their HEPA Cartridge Filter Upgrade ($269)). The Mini Gorilla runs $1,349. https://www.oneida-air.com/dust-coll...dust-collector

    My shop is a two car garage. All my tools are on mobile bases. I have no DC piping. I collect dust from my tools 1 tool at a time. I don't own a joiner and have no plans to get one any time soon. I do have a DeWalt 735 planer, Bosch 4100 TS, Rockler router table and a vintage DeWalt GWI RAS. My biggest dust maker is a Craftsman Professional 12" disk/6"x48" belt combo sander with 4" DC ports.

    Anyone have a retrofit HF DC? Can anyone share their experience with the Mini Gorilla? Can a retrofit HF unit even be compared to the Mini Gorilla?

    Thanks for taking the time to help me get this right.

    Mike

  2. #2
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    I have a modified HF like you are envisioning. Not sure where you came up with some of your costs however. You can get the SDD with 16 gal drum from Woodcraft for $209. The Merv 11 filter from Wynn is $188.
    I haven't seen the Mini Gorilla, but looking at it and the specs, it's a downgrade from the HF in several ways. The HF has almost double the CFM and I have no problem running two 4" hoses at the same time. The Wynn filter has a lot more surface area which will help the CFM as well.
    It's never too late to have a happy childhood.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jul 2017
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    I have a previous model mini gorilla and it's okay. I bought it used and got a decent deal on it but I wish I would have gotten something more powerful. I know people say to keep things mobile in a small shop but that damn mini gorilla was always in the way. It annoyed the hell out of me. A couple of months ago I mounted it on the wall and ran one branch to my table saw and the other is a Rockler 28' dust right hose that I connect to other tools. I am pushing it beyond its limits and it does an okay job but I wish I would have gotten something more powerful and did a DIY two stage setup. Now I am just saving up to get a CV1800.

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Schoenthal View Post
    Not sure where you came up with some of your costs however. You can get the SDD with 16 gal drum from Woodcraft for $209. The Merv 11 filter from Wynn is $188.
    Chris - Thanks for the reply. I was looking at the 5" SDD because the HF blower inlet is 5". The 5" SDD doesn't come with a container. The smallest available at Oneida is the 17" steel drum. So my costs estimate is a little pricier than the 4" kit. I did not look at Wynn for the filter cartridge. I could save money there, thanks for bringing it to my attention.

    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Schoenthal View Post
    The HF has almost double the CFM
    I agree, the Mini Gorilla specs do not look great but Oneida points out that 600CFM is "actual CFM" meaning tested with cyclone, filter and 10' of hose - not just "free fan" with nothing attached for inflated performance numbers. I wish that there was an industry standard. It sure would make comparison shopping easier.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Tim M Tuttle View Post
    I have a previous model mini gorilla and it's okay. I bought it used and got a decent deal on it but I wish I would have gotten something more powerful. I know people say to keep things mobile in a small shop but that damn mini gorilla was always in the way. It annoyed the hell out of me. A couple of months ago I mounted it on the wall and ran one branch to my table saw and the other is a Rockler 28' dust right hose that I connect to other tools. I am pushing it beyond its limits and it does an okay job but I wish I would have gotten something more powerful and did a DIY two stage setup. Now I am just saving up to get a CV1800.

    Tim - I have read a few reviews about the 1st Gen. Mini Gorilla that commented on a lack pf power. The 2017 Fine Woodworking review raves about the 2nd. Gen. I have no idea what FWW's policy is regarding tested items - whether they get paid or not - so I'll take it with a grain of salt and rely on real world reviews like yours. Still, I wonder what changes were made to the 2nd Gen - if any?

  6. #6
    Join Date
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    It does not make any sense and is misleading to publish a single CFM number for a dust collection machine. What if your hose needs to be 15 feet to work in your situation instead of 10? The good machines always furnish a performance curve that allows you to predict the CFM and performance for a wide variety of conditions. The curves are the only point of comparison between machines that mean anything. Even then, some machines might provide a lower CFM but a higher filtration rating so that the lower CFM machine is the better one for actual dust reduction.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Art Mann View Post
    It does not make any sense and is misleading to publish a single CFM number for a dust collection machine. What if your hose needs to be 15 feet to work in your situation instead of 10? The good machines always furnish a performance curve that allows you to predict the CFM and performance for a wide variety of conditions. The curves are the only point of comparison between machines that mean anything. Even then, some machines might provide a lower CFM but a higher filtration rating so that the lower CFM machine is the better one for actual dust reduction.
    Art - Oneida specifications says 583 Actual CFM at 2" S.P. and had a performance curve for the 2nd Gen. Mini Gorilla. Additionally, I found HF's 2HP DC performance curve online - apparently it's from a Wood Magazine test...
    Attached Images Attached Images

  8. #8
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    Oneida is a reputable company and I would expect them to publish performance curves for all their machines. Harbor Freight is not, with regard to equipment specifications. It is fortunate that someone else did the measurements for comparison sake. I am proud that Oneida is being honest because that curve exhibits poor performance for the money spent.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Ray View Post
    Tim - I have read a few reviews about the 1st Gen. Mini Gorilla that commented on a lack pf power. The 2017 Fine Woodworking review raves about the 2nd. Gen. I have no idea what FWW's policy is regarding tested items - whether they get paid or not - so I'll take it with a grain of salt and rely on real world reviews like yours. Still, I wonder what changes were made to the 2nd Gen - if any?
    The motors are the same HP but different manufacturers. The inlet is the same. They changed the size of the filter for gen 2. The amp draw on the motor for gen 2 says 16 amp typical. I have my gen 1 on a 15 amp circuit with a couple other things plugged into it and I dont blow the breaker so maybe the newer motor is a little more powerful.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Tim M Tuttle View Post
    The motors are the same HP but different manufacturers. The inlet is the same. They changed the size of the filter for gen 2. The amp draw on the motor for gen 2 says 16 amp typical. I have my gen 1 on a 15 amp circuit with a couple other things plugged into it and I dont blow the breaker so maybe the newer motor is a little more powerful.

    Tim - thanks for the comparison.

  11. #11
    You can do better than the Oneida drum price and the Wynn cartridge filter price. I found a steel drum from about $80 and I think a plastic was cheaper. But I am seriously thinking of getting a 30 gallon drum. I will have to empty it twice as much but I don't think I want to handle a full 55 gallon steel drum. I have several 30 gallon trash cans so my theory is to fill them from the DC drum then go to the dump when I have 3 or 4 full ones. I googled the cartridge mentioned in the Gray House Studios build and I think it is less than $100. I like the long narrow layout too and the area is greater than the Wynn. Fine filtering is about the same. I think I can buy the HF, the cyclone you are looking at, the cartridge and miscellaneous pieces for $600. I'd rather not have to do the build and I am sure the Oneida mini-gorilla would look better but I think the HF will work fine. I also plan to just leave it in one place and run piping to the tools it will hook to. So the nice mobile base of the Oneida is a waste for me.

    Looks like performance is very similar but HF might be slightly better. And if it isn't enough, you can put in the Rikon impeller.

    Not a lot of class in an upgraded HF and it will be some work but the price difference seems to large to ignore.

  12. #12
    Join Date
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    Any particular reason you’re not considering the fiber barrels from Oneida ? They come in several sizes and are lighter and cheaper.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Dwight View Post
    You can do better than the Oneida drum price and the Wynn cartridge filter price. I found a steel drum from about $80 and I think a plastic was cheaper. But I am seriously thinking of getting a 30 gallon drum. I will have to empty it twice as much but I don't think I want to handle a full 55 gallon steel drum. I have several 30 gallon trash cans so my theory is to fill them from the DC drum then go to the dump when I have 3 or 4 full ones. I googled the cartridge mentioned in the Gray House Studios build and I think it is less than $100. I like the long narrow layout too and the area is greater than the Wynn. Fine filtering is about the same. I think I can buy the HF, the cyclone you are looking at, the cartridge and miscellaneous pieces for $600. I'd rather not have to do the build and I am sure the Oneida mini-gorilla would look better but I think the HF will work fine. I also plan to just leave it in one place and run piping to the tools it will hook to. So the nice mobile base of the Oneida is a waste for me.

    Looks like performance is very similar but HF might be slightly better. And if it isn't enough, you can put in the Rikon impeller.

    Not a lot of class in an upgraded HF and it will be some work but the price difference seems to large to ignore.
    Jim - Thanks for the reply and the suggestion to check out Gray House Studios. The cheapskate in me wouldn't allow me to go the route of the Mini Gorilla. (That and the fact that there wasn't a landslide endorsement of the Mini by members here.) So I've ordered all the parts to do the HF retrofit. Here's what's on the way: 5" SDD, 17" steel drum kit and Wynn 13F230NANO flanged filter with 13" filter pan. (I did consider Clear Vue's Filter Clean Out Box over Wynn's filter pan and probably should have gone in that direction to save a few dollars). Hopefully I'm up and collecting dust in the next couple of weeks.

  14. I know you made a decision and it will probably work well for you. Just in case others stumble on this thread in the future, I thought I would add some input. I replaced an older bag DC with the Oneida Mini Gorilla last fall and don't regret the decision for a minute. It really feels like the perfect solution for my particular shop space.

    Keep in mind a few things. My shop space is tiny (about 100 sqft) and in my home basement. I required very good filtering. I mostly use hand tools and own very few machines (13" planer, 14" bandsaw) which are only used one at a time. Money wasn't a big factor and I'll always buy quality American tools when available. I needed a solution which was portable and maximized performance in the smallest amount of space. I feel like the mini-gorilla provided everything I needed in one integrated solution with minimal tradeoffs.

    I connect a 5" hose from the oneida to a machine, only employing a reducer at the connection to the machine. The 2nd generation mini-gorilla is lighter and features a much better canister latching mechanism than the previous version. These features are appreciated even though I don't have to empty the canister more than twice a month in my shop. Hope this feedback helps someone else with their decision.

  15. #15
    I have a 3hp cyclone, vented outside, and while it is pretty good, wish I had just purchased a 5hp cyclone and had it over with, rather than thinking about moving up a little at a time. Much cheaper to just go with the biggest hobby type cyclone one time.

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