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Thread: Feeds and speeds GWizard

  1. #1
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    Feeds and speeds GWizard

    Someday soon I will finally have the shop cleaned, organized and ready to use my FLA CNC machine for real. It was a struggle getting the 3 Phase spindle up and running so the Mach3 software can control the speed.

    I am wondering how many folks are using GWizard? I have a trial downloaded now and they have a Sale going on for a 3 year package. But is there a difference say between Melamine board and MDF board when cutting? The software treats it the same and I have noticed a couple of other materials, not changing settings between selections.
    Last edited by Bill George; 12-26-2018 at 9:04 PM.
    Retired Guy- Central Iowa. , LightObject 40w CO2 Laser and Chiller, MakerGear M2 3D Printer. Qe60+ Vinyl cutter. Fine Line Automation 4x4 CNC Router- Mach3

  2. #2
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    Our router is also a 4 x 4 FLA - 960 oz.NEMA 34 steppers with a 3Hp spindle. I think you'll most likely find that the spindle Hp and the ability to secure the material being cut are the limiting factors for panel cutting feedrates more than anything else. The FLA frame is rigid enough to handle cutting wood panel products like MDF, melamine, etc at much faster rates than the 3 Hp can handle. Our 3Hp spindle starts to bog down at full .75" depths at anything over about 150 ipm. A larger spindle could handle double or triple the rate without a problem. Because of that, I usually cut 2 passes at .375" depth at 250 - 300 ipm.

    You'll quickly develop an ear for the right feedrates in MDF vs melamine, etc. Depends much on the tooling, part sizes and other factors.
    Last edited by Mick Simon; 12-28-2018 at 10:05 AM.
    Semi-retired, teaching CNC for Fine Woodworking at the local community college. FineLine Automation Saturn 2, EnRoute Pro, Aspire, Mach3.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mick Simon View Post
    You'll quickly develop an ear for the right feedrates in MDF vs melamine, etc. Depends much on the tooling, part sizes and other factors.
    Some of the best advice you will ever get. No book or chart will ever get you cutting as well as your own eyes and ears. There is no easy button for speeds and feeds, no how much those selling some generic info wants you to believe differently.
    Gary Campbell
    CNC Technology & Training
    The Ultimate Woodworking Machine
    GCnC411(at)gmail.com

    YouTube: Islaww1

  4. #4
    I've had pretty good luck so far following the tool manufactures specifications for rpm and feed rate.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gary Campbell View Post
    Some of the best advice you will ever get. No book or chart will ever get you cutting as well as your own eyes and ears. There is no easy button for speeds and feeds, no how much those selling some generic info wants you to believe differently.
    This is the approach I've taken since your training and it's been working great.

    Quote Originally Posted by Martin Wasner View Post
    I've had pretty good luck so far following the tool manufactures specifications for rpm and feed rate.
    The advantage you have is that you have a "big" machine with substantial power...exactly what the tooling manufacturers' specifications are aimed at. For those of us with smaller machines, we can't use those tables outside of "relevant reference" because our machines can't even come close to those speeds/feeds. Many of us also tend to do smaller work and even 200ipm becomes impossible physically because of acceleration/deceleration time/space. So we tend to start at the conservative side and work things up until the machine "tells" us that we've reached the realistic performance optimum for a cutter for speed/feed in the material we're working with.
    --

    The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Becker View Post
    This is the approach I've taken since your training and it's been working great.



    The advantage you have is that you have a "big" machine with substantial power...exactly what the tooling manufacturers' specifications are aimed at. For those of us with smaller machines, we can't use those tables outside of "relevant reference" because our machines can't even come close to those speeds/feeds. Many of us also tend to do smaller work and even 200ipm becomes impossible physically because of acceleration/deceleration time/space. So we tend to start at the conservative side and work things up until the machine "tells" us that we've reached the realistic performance optimum for a cutter for speed/feed in the material we're working with.
    I didn't read his spindle power initially.

    We're cutting 3/4" plywood with a " compression at 800ipm. I wish I could go faster, but I think the cut quality will degrade

  7. #7
    Vortex has an app that you can input your spindle power, material being cut, type of cut and it'll spit out a tool recommendation and feed rate.

    They're semi local to me, so they've been getting my business mostly based on the quick turn around

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Martin Wasner View Post
    Vortex has an app that you can input your spindle power, material being cut, type of cut and it'll spit out a tool recommendation and feed rate.

    They're semi local to me, so they've been getting my business mostly based on the quick turn around
    Yes I have that app for my iPhone and it seems good. I will spend my money someplace else than on G Wizard. Thank you for the helpful advice guys!!
    Retired Guy- Central Iowa. , LightObject 40w CO2 Laser and Chiller, MakerGear M2 3D Printer. Qe60+ Vinyl cutter. Fine Line Automation 4x4 CNC Router- Mach3

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Martin Wasner View Post

    We're cutting 3/4" plywood with a " compression at 800ipm. I wish I could go faster, but I think the cut quality will degrade
    Switch to a 3 flute, and you can cut at 1200ipm with the same rpm, and same finish quality.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Gerry Grzadzinski View Post
    Switch to a 3 flute, and you can cut at 1200ipm with the same rpm, and same finish quality.
    I was told not the way to go. I don't remember why.

  11. #11
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    One would think that if the advice was good, it would be memorable. Try it, you may get a pleasant surprise
    Gary Campbell
    CNC Technology & Training
    The Ultimate Woodworking Machine
    GCnC411(at)gmail.com

    YouTube: Islaww1

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Bill George View Post
    Yes I have that app for my iPhone and it seems good. I will spend my money someplace else than on G Wizard. Thank you for the helpful advice guys!!
    GWizard is a very good program, but you have to set it up based on your specific machine's abilities. It takes into account a lot more variables than just chipload, rpm and feedrate to come up with it's suggestions. You can override most of the calculated variables as well. The slider for roughing and finishing overrides also is quite handy. Best to watch some of the tutorials before using.

  13. #13
    The only downside is that the bits are more expensive, and they can be resharpened fewer times (smaller overlap on the upcut and downcut sections of compression bits).

    A few years back, I got about twenty 3 flute Onsrud's for $40 each, and we ran at 1200ipm until we ran out of them.

    One other issue might be that with low acceleration, your machine might struggle to reach 1200ipm. On our Morbidelli, it only takes about 2-3" to reach full speed.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Gerry Grzadzinski View Post
    The only downside is that the bits are more expensive, and they can be resharpened fewer times (smaller overlap on the upcut and downcut sections of compression bits).

    A few years back, I got about twenty 3 flute Onsrud's for $40 each, and we ran at 1200ipm until we ran out of them.

    One other issue might be that with low acceleration, your machine might struggle to reach 1200ipm. On our Morbidelli, it only takes about 2-3" to reach full speed.
    You're probably right on it not actually getting to speed. Ours is the bottom lowest model Weeke makes.

    The other thing is all the twists and turns. I could do it in Woodwop and put a different tool on those paths, and use the three flute on the longer cuts, but I'd bet it'd be a net loss in time by the time I go through everything. I'm almost certain there isn't any parameter for that in Mozaik.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Gary Campbell View Post
    One would think that if the advice was good, it would be memorable. Try it, you may get a pleasant surprise
    When you learn a new machine and new software, with no formal training on the machine and a "gun to the head" because it needs to be making parts, some things slip through the cracks....

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