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Thread: Fretwell's Long Tail Danish Workbench

  1. #1
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    Fretwell's Long Tail Danish Workbench

    Needed a new bench. For me the choice was clear as I love the Danish tail and open design shoulder vise.

    I used these benches when I was 14 at school!
    There are some things about the design I do not like however:
    The cantilevered tail vise protrudes past the legs, that entire end of the bench just hangs which encourages wobble.
    The leg near the tail vise always gets in the way of your feet when planning. As I have size 13 feet this bugged me a lot.

    With this in mind I drew up my must have list:
    Oblong, shouldered, full size dogs that toe in.
    Long enough to build domestic doors.
    Tall enough to save my back.
    Large deep tool tray to keep the bench top profile clear.
    Heavy but moveable.
    Dog holes at the back of the bench to support panels and jigs.
    Hold downs.
    Inexpensive.

    So I went wood shopping, thinking maple but was offered black walnut.
    Not furniture grade but mostly old heart wood. The price was right: $200 Cdn.
    I bought 2 simple steel vise threads from Lee Valley. One longer for the tail vise.

    After much thought I worked out I had enough wood to make the top for a 7 ft. bench minus 1 inch. The front could be 5 inches but most of the top just over 2 inches deep.

    I wanted the bench to be longer but the only way to make it effectively longer was the tail vise extension. The more you extend encourages droop: Very bad word!

    I woke up one morning and thought make the vise longer! You can support a bigger vise more easily as it extends. The large oblong frame guided and supported was the result, seemed like a simple answer and it was. I had now moved the end of the tail vise twice as far to the left.

    So I built the top, took a while, had just enough wood. My shouldered dog holes toed in 2 degrees in the body and 3 degrees in the tail vise (just in case of droop). The tail vise design I made up, the front vise was very simple. I made a tool tray of cherry with ash/cherry/ash bottom for wear resistance.

    Back to wood shopping for the legs, white oak for the legs and ash for the stretchers. I had a large wormy lump of cherry for the feet and some good cherry for the tool tray, $300 Cdn, ouch! Almost 200 lb of wood however.

    The legs and top stretchers had to be massive to accommodate the top underside profile with a 6 inch tool tray. The trestles had to be huge to do their job (2x10") half way between the floor and surface being planed.

    The whole bench became a design exercise with it's primary function paramount. Shelving, cupboards and drawers had no say: possible add on; but no say in the design.

    Making the tail vise twice as long pushed my clamping position towards the middle of the bench. It meant I could push the right leg past the furthest tail vise opening and happily have room for my big feet to move when planning. It meant I was standing more in the middle of the bench which felt good. I made the ash stretcher front face line up with the back of the tail vise for vertical clamping support. The fifth leg support gives you that freedom.

    My long tail vise meant I could max out every inch of the vise screw as it's not used for support and get 13" of opening. That effectively made my bench a foot longer when needed. The long design had no droop at full extension and was rock solid.

    Vital statistics for those that care!
    Weight 358 lbs.
    Height 38"
    Shoulder vise 7" opening.
    Long tail 13" of opening.
    Max dog clamping length 86"
    Tool tray 6" deep, 6.5" wide.
    Bench front 5" deep with 2" clamping shoulder behind.
    Bench top 22" deep, plus 7.5" with tool tray.



    Benchwhole1.jpg

    FaceVise.jpg

    Endshot.jpg
    The bottom of the vise dogs march through the top stretcher.
    Undertail.jpg

    Sorry no dovetailed vise joints, finger joints have a far larger glue area!
    FrontShot.jpg

    Unlike many benches the Danish vises are not an add on. With the Danish bench and traditional tail vise more than perhaps any other, the vises are a huge part of the top design. Due planning needs to be undertaken.
    For me the dogs make the bench, they grip well with large area when needed and push the work down onto the bench. Being able to toe in from 2 inches up is a huge asset. Every hole has a dog, Gramercy fills the rest!
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Last edited by William Fretwell; 12-12-2018 at 4:41 PM. Reason: Fix picture file
    ​You can do a lot with very little! You can do a little more with a lot!

  2. #2
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    Oct 2010
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    Australia
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    William; congrats on the new bench build.

    Stewie;

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jun 2016
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    Houston
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    I love that bench. Makes me want to start a new project.

  4. #4
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    Thanks Stewie and Todd,
    A new bench is quite a journey but very worthwhile.
    William
    ​You can do a lot with very little! You can do a little more with a lot!

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
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    Edmond, Oklahoma
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    William,

    Very nice job, and an innovating design!

    Stew

  6. #6
    William,

    Interesting design. How long to build.

    ken

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Nov 2018
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    Coffee City, Texas
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    169
    Awesome, I've always had an issue with the lopsided look of the base structure on these benches. This looks promising!
    Dojo Kun, 1: Be humble and polite.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
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    Missouri
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    Very nice William. I like your tail vise design. Well thought out. Enjoy working on your new bench.
    Jim

  9. #9
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    Kory I know exactly what you mean, the lump hanging over the leg end gives leverage to a wobble or shimmy at the 5ft size like my school benches. Still very usable however and bigger benches less of an issue. The leg in my way at the tail end was my biggest gripe at school but I love the tail vise design on Danish benches, it is so versatile.

    It occurs to me that while the first dog in the tail vise would normally get all the work with this design the second and third dogs will get more use. With this in mind the tail dog spacing is a little different to save turns on the vise with the increased dog options.

    I’ve done a little planing and sawing on the bench as well as shoving it from every angle; it does not move. You do get a sense that the fifth leg is a serious contribution to stability, it also takes the pressure off pushing that back stretcher out as far as possible.

    Ken as for time to build, I can’t come close to your productivity knocking out Moravians. My life got in the way a few times, a fire excluded us from our home for 13 months, had to go and live on a sail boat and travel the Great Lakes. Did some wood work for the boat inside and out. Overall about 4 months of serious time in spurts with big gaps.
    ​You can do a lot with very little! You can do a little more with a lot!

  10. #10
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    William, I would be interested in seeing the construction of your tail vice. It's such an interesting concept, can we have a look?
    Jim

  11. #11
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    BAB05161-A206-4FC0-ADFA-9A4F589A3CFA.jpg

    Nails.......! Just kidding, forgive the rough underside with its 3 coats of BLO, it’s a workbench after all!

    A rectangular frame that can slide. Notable features that may escape a casual glance:
    Support comes at both ends of the tail vise, also the breadboard end tucks under the vice top surface. The inner vise face section has a dadoe that rides on the guide support. The guide support itself is supported at both ends.
    The innermost guide provides leverage to hold up the vise with the vise thread and inner guide acting as fulcrum.

    The threaded rod provides significant direct support at normal extensions, to this end I kept it as close to the tail as possible. This close proximity is also important to minimise twist of the frame when the vise is tightened. The sheer length of the rectangle provides fantastic leverage against twisting.

    The two fulcrums need to be in line as much as possible which is why the round dado to inset the rod.

    In addition to all that, the top leg stretcher can support the tail vise directly underneath if required with a Teflon pad. It can be set up so precisely it only touches when pressure is applied to the tail vise or light pressure all the time. Never have I seen this tail vise with direct support underneath when required because it just hangs off the end of the bench.

    I did give some thought to how much force is applied to the tail vise when planing. Based on my pushing this thing is solid. When you extend the tail vise it’s like an engineered metal vise moving with no give whatsoever.

    I have no reservations about it’s life span and invoking the Teflon pad if ever required in 100 years!

    I did wonder if someone would ask!
    ​You can do a lot with very little! You can do a little more with a lot!

  12. #12
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    Thanks William. No need for forgiving I would expect the bottom not to look like the top. Your design looks good, well supported. I expect you are right about it lasting a very long time.
    Jim

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