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Thread: Vintage Martin T75 restoration

  1. #361
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    I didn’t get much done today.

    I did get on the phone with the paint manufacturer and get my whole system dialed. As I suspected the self etch primer needs to be sealed with a actual primer within 16hrs. All the paint also needs to be applied and allowed to dry at a temperature of 60% plus minimum.

    So right now it will be self etch, wait a few hours prime with a high build product. I will the. Set to filling with body filler, sand for weeks on end then go over that all with a polyester prime. The polyester is basicly a spray on body filler of sorts. That get sanded to like 400 then and only then I get to my finish. Right now I’m considering a industrial polyurethane finish in a low luster. If I go this route it saves me the whole clear coat and buffing nightmare.

    At the end of the day I revisited the miter portion of the outrigger fence/table support. This is one of the first items I got to work on weeks ago now. Now with the dai grinder and various abrasive attachments I can pr4tty much strip everything 100% to bare metal. Some pieces it easy leash 123, others it can be a nightmare and take hours and hours. I’m sure in some cases I don’t need to remove all the paint but I kinda like the torture and suffering of my carpel tunnel and I like getting all OCD on something even more.

    One of the things I find most interesting is as I strip the paint back I find the machine/prep marks originally made on the parts in the preparation process at the factory. Much of what you see as machine marks are not actually from me but what I am finding as I remove the paint. The factory did a crude job at best evening out the cast parts. For the most part they relied heavily on fillers to get the finished product. I will be doing the same. I am cleaning up the cast where it makes sense but for the most part I’ll be doing as Martin did and buying stock in body filler.

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    My pile of parts. It getting old moving this stuff around from place to place. I gotta get this back prepped and primed so I can put it aside without the worry of new rust setting in.

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    I have anoth4r pile of parts about the size of the picture above pretty much ready for prime down on the first floor with the rest of the machine. Man o man what have I gotten myself into?

  2. #362
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    One thing to keep in mind is that this isn't a car. You can spend a lot of time filling and sanding that in the end may hardly be noticeable in the finished product. Of course to each their own, and you have to do what makes you happy, I'm not trying to dissuade you too much......just saying

    Anyway I did a quick and dirty paint job on this using epoxy primer and 1 stage color coat. I just couldn't see any advantage to spraying a separate top coat for a machine thats going to live inside a climate controlled shop for the rest of its life. If it gets banged into hard enough to chip the top coats probably not going to do all that much anyway. Not much in the way of sanding, just got all the loose stuff off and cleaned it well. Then sprayed away
    Attached Images Attached Images

  3. #363
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    I still want that machine,

    I want the Martin also though

    In my case I have delaminating junk all over this machine. It’s kinda like when someone puts oil paint over latex paint on interior trim work. In this case the fill used way down against the bare metal is doing the same as the top layers of paint. You start going at a loose spot and it just keeps going and going and going....

    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Duncan View Post
    One thing to keep in mind is that this isn't a car. You can spend a lot of time filling and sanding that in the end may hardly be noticeable in the finished product. Of course to each their own, and you have to do what makes you happy, I'm not trying to dissuade you too much......just saying

    Anyway I did a quick and dirty paint job on this using epoxy primer and 1 stage color coat. I just couldn't see any advantage to spraying a separate top coat for a machine thats going to live inside a climate controlled shop for the rest of its life. If it gets banged into hard enough to chip the top coats probably not going to do all that much anyway. Not much in the way of sanding, just got all the loose stuff off and cleaned it well. Then sprayed away

  4. #364
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    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Walsh View Post
    I still want that machine,

    I want the Martin also though

    In my case I have delaminating junk all over this machine. It’s kinda like when someone puts oil paint over latex paint on interior trim work. In this case the fill used way down against the bare metal is doing the same as the top layers of paint. You start going at a loose spot and it just keeps going and going and going....
    Your still welcome to have a look at her..... but you don't really want her! She's a great machine and I love using her, but she's not a Martin. As someone who obviously understands the difference it makes using these machines.... your going to want the Martin. It's the little things that make the difference and Martin went that little bit further, the so called extra mile, and it shows. Take your time and be patient and you'll find one

    I was lucky on my machine as the paint was literally falling off when I bought it. May have been b/c the previous shop was on the ocean? Or maybe just a bad batch of paint? But either way the paint was easy to remove

    Jeff

  5. #365
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    Speaking of paint I’m kinda getting there. At least close enough I’m starting to think color. To date I have been pretty settled on a classic vintage green machinery color. Now seeing the amount of prep work going into all this it has me thinking twice as to exactly what color I really want to paint the machine. I figure after all this work and being I can have whatever color I want I might as well do something exceptional and not just whatever.

    I himmed and hawed a bit about going a different color but in the end I feel the machine has a very retro look and bestnto not moderise it with some techno color. Again I’m pretty sold on leaving the machine as it was from the factory and bringing back to life the original brass and chrome plated fishes here and there and maybe adding a few more thatnthe factory did not.

    I’m attaching a link to a Harley Davidson I just fell in love with while searching colors. I really really love this green and they have combined it with both polished and mat brass, chrome and nickel. I love that red with it also but that imop would just look silly to incorporate into my project. The pea green though I’m just pretty in love with.

    Do others have thoughts on this exact green color and my intention to re plate and maybe play up some of the brass chrome and nickel plated pieces in a subtle way.

    http://www.l-l-choppers.com/ll-photo...mitri/?lang=en

  6. #366
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    Patrick, that is indeed a sweet bike, clearly a labor of love by someone with a vision, BUT that exposed sprocket and chain would scare the bejesus out of me.

    Color-wise: nice on the bike, NOT on the Martin

    OTOH, my taste is in my mouth, and it is YOUR machine . . .

  7. #367
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    Color is tough and very much personal preference. If sticking with green Iíd be tempted to use something that looks similar to the original but different enough.

    I wouldnít worry about it standing out, a good restoration will stand out just by virtue of its newness and attention to detail. The factories seemed to spray everything at the time so having dark hardware and polished aluminum and brass parts will set it apart even with a green paint job that looks like original color.
    Bumbling forward into the unknown.

  8. #368
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    Color can be tough when you can choose anything. My advise around that is to remember you want it to be something that you can live with for a VERY long time, something that feels right in your shop and on a machine of that caliber and something that doesn't materially degrade the light properties of that same shop. It doesn't need to be "traditional anything"...
    --

    The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...

  9. #369
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    Jun 2014
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    Western PA
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    I havent tackled any restoration to the level you are currently undertaking, but i recently got some crap for not sandblasting, polishing, and filling before priming and painting my powermatic. My machine wont be the subject of macro shots in fine woodworking, but it looks great everytime i stop to look at it for a second when i step into my shop. To each their own, but in the 4-6 hours i saved doing all that undesirable work, i was able to build a project to pay for the next machine.

    Machine green is ok, and i could see myself with a mixed make shop all painted machine green one day, but the martin blue is pretty good. I would almost want to monkey around with a photo of your machine in photoshop. You can do color swaps really easily. I think you already shot down blue, but if i ever restored a martin, that is the color i would go with. ESPECIALLY if you ever buy a new shaper. I would want them to match, but thats just me.

  10. #370
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    Nov 2007
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    Patrick,

    Rethinking my post above, I think I was wrong. If you like that green, go for it! With your attention to detail, anything you do will likely be close to perfect.

    While driving in today, I recalled seeing a Martin factory shot where they had PINK machines. That caused me to rethink the whole color thing . . . .

  11. #371
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    Thanks for the feedback guys.

    My gut instinct from day one was always to keep it factory original green. I do agree with Brian that just a good restoration job on this particular machine will be enough to make wow go wow in of itself. I’m not up for anything like pink or even Martin blue for that matter.

    I do have a brand new T54 Martin jointer in th Martin blue that will go with this machine. With that said I will be buying a Martin planer when the jointer moves in as I currently have a Felder combo in my shop. Point is my shop will pretty much be Martin blue coupled with vintage machine green as my Felder fear with go and be replaced by either new Martin or old Martin. I is a argument for going the new Martin blue. I like the green/brass/nickel plan. I was just thinking a green tweet could be nice as the factory green is just a boring color with so many great shade/tones of green to choose from. Maybe I’ll do it Festool green

  12. #372
    I like white. Like bonkers, painfully white. Toss a heavy clear coat on it and shine it up.

    Not offering a suggestion, but if I ever strip and paint a piece, that's the direction I'm going.

  13. #373
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    Got a little more done today. Nothing exciting, as if any of this is exciting to follow along with?

    At this point I have everything off the machine that’s coming off for now. It’s a pile of stuff and I fear loosing track if I don’t first get all I have apart now painted and back together. The sheer amount of nuts, bolts, washers, pins, lock rings is mind boggling. I easily have a day sitting behind a wire wheel on a buffer.

    At this point I’m just trying hard to go back over all my previous work and make sure it 100% striped back as far as need be and ready for etching primer and primer. Mostly I’m soaking pieces in a rust remover bath the taking a work wheel to them. The filler used at the factory gets stuck in the pores of the castings. It’s kinda almost like powdery loose dust and I fear if I leave any behind I could have adhesion problems. The machines surfaces I have don’t even touch till they come out of the rust soak and then I just hit them with a scotch brite pad as not to alter them. I have four pieces back in the bath now and when they come out I’m ready to start taping things off for primer. As said I also have a mountain of nuts and bolts to deal with, all have been stripped of pain and are soaking in rust remover.

    Anyway this is the cover to the chain that makes the the sliding table move for dado. So it’s pretty much a chain guard. Who knew my saw would have a chain guard.

    I almost got lazy and decided to not strip the back side. I then hit one spot with a wire wheel by mistake and that was that I had to strip it lol.

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    These are pretty cool. They are the towers the sliding table mounts to. It’s pretty slick the whole saw has serial numbers or part number all over it poured right into the casts. I just love details like this.

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    I took apart the pieces that allow the table to move back and forth for dado. I still have yet to remove those bent bolts. I need a small cutoff wheel for my Dremel or something. It’s pretty neat and very simple how they get the wheel table to move. Something so simple I would complicate the crap out of if tasked with the task of figuring out how to make something like it work.

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    I was about to call it quiets for the day and I decided to spend another hour scrubbing the old adhesive off the extrusion the tracks are mounted to for the sliding table. If you have lost track at this point “I would think so” these are ways the slidingtable bearings travel on and the culprit of the rattling noise I heard when I first purchased the saw.

    About a hour with laquer thinner and a scotch brite and I’m ready to glue the tracks back down. Well not quite as I have to make some kind of caul, do a dry run and figure out the appropriate sized wire to set where the two tracks come together to keep them evenly spaced. Not such a simple task as the adhesive used for this is pretty much permant. I really get one shot to get it right and only one shot.

    All cleaned up

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    These two ways have to be glued in just so. The spacing has to be just right or I fear the bearings will not seat to the same tollerance as at the factory. I have thoughts how I’m going to do this and in theory all shoould be very easy. But you know glue and clamps and when things have to be machinist perfect.

  14. #374
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    The two tracks just floating pretty much how they have to be glued.

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    An existing one the glue is still holding tight on.

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    And thatís about it for today.

    Im so ready to paint. I have a few things to work out just yet in mind of paint though. Namely I have to make some rolling hanger type deals I can string parts up on and roll in and out of the spray booth and not have to flip all my parts. I also have to get my spray gun setup all dialed in and tested with the product Iím shooting as to make sure it will lay down to my expectations before I just start spraying pieces. I gotta order a bunch of various size forks to stuff in all the various holes as not to,paint any threads. My guess is Iím still a few working days from applying primer. Maybe late next week Iíll have something to show for myself?

  15. #375
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    White is my favorite non color.

    I really really like white everything. When I was a kid living in NYC I had apartment I painted everything flat ceiling white. Nothing was allowed in that was not white except wooden furniture. I wouldn’t even leave clothes out of the closet if they were colored.

    Yup I’m nuts!

    I also like very very bright lites on like 24hrs a day.

    Quote Originally Posted by Martin Wasner View Post
    I like white. Like bonkers, painfully white. Toss a heavy clear coat on it and shine it up.

    Not offering a suggestion, but if I ever strip and paint a piece, that's the direction I'm going.

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