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Thread: Question for any electricians on here?

  1. #1
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    Question for any electricians on here?

    I am having a gas line put in tomorrow so we can install our new gas stove and gas log fireplace. (We currently already have gas to the house for a furnace and dryer.)

    We pulled out the old electric stove today, and noticed it had a dedicated 220v line on the wall behind it, but there is no receptacle back there for a 110 for the new stove. Hubby says no problem, we'll just run an extension cord to the nearest outlet to run it. I said no.

    Is there any way to convert or otherwise use the existing 220 outlet to run the new 110 stove? Would it be dangerous to use an extension cord just to check and make sure everything on the new gas stove works ok?

    I am not looking forward to having to find an electrician now to put in a new outlet down there and pay who knows how many more hundreds of dollars. Any ideas?

  2. #2
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    I don't see any reason you could not use the large wire, wire it to a single pole breaker and screw a 110 outlet to it behind the stove. It may not be code persay, but as long as the connections are correct and you label everything I do not see a safety issue. If there is access, i would just run some 12 gauge romex from the panel and add a new breaker, leaving the 220 line intact for any future use, say you end up with a duel fuel stove in the future. We like the electric oven and gas top.

  3. #3
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    I’d get an electrician, but a quick internet search found this:

    You can convert a receptacle from 220 volts to 110 volts in one of two ways. The first is to use a 220 to 110 adapter. The other is to rewire the receptacle or install a new receptacle next to the old one and connect it to the 220-volt wiring. If you choose either of the second options, you'll have to install a new circuit breaker. 220V breakers are rated for more current than a 110V circuit can carry.



    The Simple Solution: Use a 220 to 110 Adapter


    An adapter that plugs into a standard 220-volt receptacle and allows you to use a 110-volt plug costs about $30. In technical terms, it provides a NEMA 5-15P outlet, which is a three-pin grounded outlet rated for 15 amps. It has an internal fuse that trips when the current exceeds 15 amps, so you don't need to change the circuit breaker. It doesn't have ground fault protection, however, so you shouldn't use it in a location in which a GFCI is required, such as the laundry room. Commonly called a gas range adapter, it's an easy and effective way to convert a 220V receptacle for use as a 110V outlet when the outlet is behind a range and safely out of the way of moisture.





    250, 240 or 220 Volts? They're All the Same


    You may not be able to find a 220 to 110 adapter. Instead, you may find a 240 to 120 one or even a 250 to 125. Don't worry. Any of them will work. Electrical manufacturers and electricians use the different numbers because the standard voltage coming into residential panels from the power lines can vary.





    Rewiring a 220V Receptacle Starts at the Outlet Box


    Before you do any electrical wiring, be sure the breaker controlling the circuit is off. It's also a good idea to turn off the main panel breaker, after arranging for an alternate light source, but remember that the panel bus bars are still energized even when you do this. This job requires changing a breaker, so if you aren't comfortable working in the panel, get an electrician to do it.



    It's best to start the replacement at the receptacle. Unscrew it from the box and disconnect the wires. In most cases, 220 wire has a red and black hot conductor, a white neutral and a bare or green ground. You only need one hot wire for the new receptacle, so screw a wire cap onto the red wire and push it back in the box.





    If you have 10-gauge wires, you can connect them to a new 110-volt 15- or 20-amp receptacle. Attach the black wire to one of the brass terminal screws, the white wire to the corresponding chrome screw and the green wire to the ground screw. If the wires are too heavy to make the connections, you can always run a new 12-gauge, 2-conductor cable, but it's easier to install a new electrical box next to the existing one and run a 12-gauge wire between them. Splice the black wires, the white ones and the ground ones, screwing a wire cap onto each connection, and hook up the new receptacle in the new box.



    Install a New Circuit Breaker


    After you've installed the new receptacle, return to the main panel and pull out the double-gang breaker that was controlling the circuit. Disconnect the wires, cap the red one and push it safely back into the panel. Connect the white wire to the neutral bus and the ground wire to the ground bus. Finally, connect the black wire to the single-pole breaker rated for either 15 or 20 amps, depending on the receptacle rating. Push it into one of the slots occupied by the double-pole breaker you removed and install a cover plate over the vacant slot. You're now ready to turn on the breakers and use the receptacle.



  4. #4
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    In looking at the breaker box, it seems that our range and dryer share a breaker.

  5. #5
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    The existing line can generally be converted to support 120v in most cases...that's what I did when I renovated in 2003 because the headroom under the space to be able to pull a new cable was only something a midget could navigate. The wire was in good condition; it was just larger than would normally be used for 120v. However, this requires re-termination on both ends with a 120v outlet behind the range and a 120v breaker. If the existing wires are not black/white/ground, then they need to be clearly marked to indicate how they are being used. In some cases, the second "hot" on the 240v line might be red instead of white in the particular cable used since it's larger gage. If this is heavy wire, it may not be compatible with a normal 120v outlet terminals, so there may be additional work required to transition to appropriate gage. If you are not experienced with electrical work or are in any way concerned or confused with what needs to be done...hire the electrician to do it. The money will be well-spent.
    --

    The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Laurie Brown View Post
    In looking at the breaker box, it seems that our range and dryer share a breaker.
    If that's the case...you need a whole new circuit for the new range...and I cannot imagine who was thinking that a dryer and a range could share a circuit! Please get an electrician in!
    --

    The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...

  7. #7
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    Well, it's a mobile home built in 2001, and from what I've seen during renovations it wasn't built the greatest. We have 2x2s for roof trusses.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Laurie Brown View Post
    I am having a gas line put in tomorrow so we can install our new gas stove and gas log fireplace. (We currently already have gas to the house for a furnace and dryer.)

    We pulled out the old electric stove today, and noticed it had a dedicated 220v line on the wall behind it, but there is no receptacle back there for a 110 for the new stove. Hubby says no problem, we'll just run an extension cord to the nearest outlet to run it. I said no.

    Is there any way to convert or otherwise use the existing 220 outlet to run the new 110 stove? Would it be dangerous to use an extension cord just to check and make sure everything on the new gas stove works ok?

    I am not looking forward to having to find an electrician now to put in a new outlet down there and pay who knows how many more hundreds of dollars. Any ideas?
    If Hubby knows what he's doing, he can convert the 240v feed to 120v. To do that he would have to change out the 2 pole breaker with a single pole breaker. If your house has NM (romex) and the feed is two wire, one wire is white, the other is black. Use the white that was formerly used as a hot wire (and terminated at the breaker) and terminate it on the neutral bus in the panel. Now you have a hot and neutral at the receptacle where your stove is.

    If you want a detailed step-by-step, let me know.
    “Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness..." - Mark Twain

    Diapers and Politicians need to be changed often... Usually for the same reason.

  9. #9
    disclaimer: I do a lot of my own wiring but I'm not an official 'electrician'...

    That out of the way, one thing I've heard/read that's a no-no is sharing 220v circuits, each 220 breaker is supposed to be dedicated to ONE appliance; dryer gets its own breaker, range gets its own breaker, and if the oven/range are divorced, they each get their own breaker- my house is 52 years old and that's exactly how it's wired...

    anyway- is there room behind the new stove to add a small 4-circuit breaker box?
    --and do like this? lame graphic but you get the idea-
    POWER.jpg


  10. #10
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    If you are sharing the circuit than it can not be converted in no manner so a new circuit needs to be run. The 220 line is needed for the dryer and no you can not tap off it for 110 volts.
    John T.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by John Terefenko View Post
    If you are sharing the circuit than it can not be converted in no manner so a new circuit needs to be run. The 220 line is needed for the dryer and no you can not tap off it for 110 volts.
    But, most electric stoves and dryers provide both 240v and 120v. 240v for the heating elements and 120v for the electronics and the clocks. Even my old Amana had a 120v auxillary plug.

    That said, yes you are probably right, ... kinda. She may need to run another circuit, but depending on location, it may be easier for her to convert this to 120v and run a new circuit for the dryer.

    If she opened the two boxes, stove and dryer, pulled the wires out, and snapped a couple of photos it would help a lot.
    Comments made here are my own and, according to my children, do not reflect the opinions of any other person... anywhere, anytime.

  12. #12
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    While you should not use a 240v circuit to run 120v loads, you can convert a 240v circuit to 120v by changing out the breakers and assigning the wires appropriately. In Laurie's case, remove the 2 pole breaker that fed the old electric oven. She said this is in a trailer so chances are the manufacturer used a red and black for the two legs coming from the 2 pole circuit breaker.

    After you remove the breaker, mark the red leg with white wire at the panel and at the box where 240v receptacle was removed. Now you have a neutral wire. Back at the panel you install a single pole breaker (20A preferable) and terminate the black wire at the breaker. The formerly red wire, which now is marked as a neutral, is terminated on the neutral bus in the panel.

    At the receptacle you now have a black wire and a red wire marked with white tape. That red/white is now your neutral. Odds are the wire is too big to terminate on a receptacle so you pigtail on a black #12 to the black wire and a white #12 to the red/white wire. Install the receptacle just as you would any 120v receptacle, black to gold terminal, white to silver terminal and ground (bare or green) to the green terminal.

    Turn the breaker on and test it and now you have a 120v receptacle where the 240v receptacle used to be. And enjoy.
    “Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness..." - Mark Twain

    Diapers and Politicians need to be changed often... Usually for the same reason.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Laurie Brown View Post
    In looking at the breaker box, it seems that our range and dryer share a breaker.

    The only instance in which that meets code is if there's a selector switch to operate the dryer or the stove, but not both at the same time.

    That was a typical approach with 60 ampere service entrances.

    Now, if you have a 3 pole 4 wire receptacle at the stove, just buy one of these and plug it in.

    https://www.homedepot.ca/en/home/p.g...l..........Rod.
    Last edited by Rod Sheridan; 10-11-2018 at 8:59 AM.

  14. #14
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    Good catch, Rod. I missed that. But this is a trailer. I've seen a lot of weird things in trailers and, although vague, there seems to be exception for manufactured homes. I remember discussing this on the job because of things I found in my mom's trailer. Our code guru was there and IIRC, he said the NEC makes exceptions for manufactured homes. Though I never looked into it further.

    If in fact the range and dryer are on the same breaker, then my last post wouldn't work in this case.
    “Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness..." - Mark Twain

    Diapers and Politicians need to be changed often... Usually for the same reason.

  15. #15
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    This solution should not be used! If you will notice, the safety ground becomes a current carrying wire. In effect, there is no ground going to the outlet. That is strictly forbidden in the NEC and any local requirements I have ever seen. Ground and neutral should only be tied together at one place in the main panel. There are good reasons for this even though it may not be apparent to amateurs.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kev Williams View Post
    disclaimer: I do a lot of my own wiring but I'm not an official 'electrician'...

    That out of the way, one thing I've heard/read that's a no-no is sharing 220v circuits, each 220 breaker is supposed to be dedicated to ONE appliance; dryer gets its own breaker, range gets its own breaker, and if the oven/range are divorced, they each get their own breaker- my house is 52 years old and that's exactly how it's wired...

    anyway- is there room behind the new stove to add a small 4-circuit breaker box?
    --and do like this? lame graphic but you get the idea-
    POWER.jpg

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