Member
When I had my LV Combination plane, I eventually made a pair of spurs from spring steel that did not fold and crumble like the ones supplied. In my experience with this shape of blade, such as used in a marking gauge, a thumbnail grind that slices rather than digs into cross-grain is the ticket. Thumbnail grinds are also much easier to hone by hand and you can freshen them on a strop.
Member
I have both lh and rh skew rabbet planes and also the small plow plane. You guys are talking about the combination plane. Rob Lee has enough of my money already.
Oh Well, I guess there is another plane coming.
Member
I'm looking to get a plane to cut grooves, was trying to choose between these two (or making one-off wooden ones, but that sounds like too much work). Seems like the combination plane might be a better choice.
Contributor
By "choosing between these two" do you mean between the small plow and the combination plane?Originally Posted by Steven Mikes
If you imagine you will be cutting grooves only for things like boxes and drawers, the small plow plane may be all you need.
If you will be cutting grooves in the range of 3/4" or larger, then you may want to go with a combination plane. The combination plane can utilize larger blades than the small plow is able to use.
The combination plane will also take a wider range of blades to create decorative features like beads and reeds.
For many things in the area of plowing and beading, a Stanley #45 is one of my go to planes. (It is for all intents and purposes a combination plane.)
For 1/4" grooves my go to is a Stanley #50 which is set up for this job. (It is similar in size to the Veritas Small Plow Plane.)
Here is a post of mine on the Small Plow Plane:
https://sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?251419
You might also want to check Derek's site: inthewoodshop.com and click on Tool Reviews to see what he has posted about the two planes.
jtk
"A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty."
- Sir Winston Churchill (1874-1965)
Member
As I noted in my last post (above), I had another chance to use the combo plane yesterday and today.
After finishing my joinery job (on mahogany, not a tough wood, but not as soft as fir or pine), I repeated the same on a poplar scrap for the pictures.
The nickers have never been honed by the owner since he bought it as far as I know, so the pictures show their condition after their repeated uses (5 or 6 times? -- My last job I borrowed it for was done in maple and walnut about two months ago).
The nickers are blunt but not broken. One of the tips is slightly deformed but its edge is still holding. The scoring was done backwards as I explained last time.
I measured this time and the nickers protruded about 0.5mm, similar to the depth of cut.
This time, I will hone the nickers before I return the plane.
Simon
Last edited by Simon MacGowen; 09-25-2018 at 11:06 PM.
Member
1/32" is about 0.8mm; mine was about half of that. I set the nickers by feel with my finger, not by measuring.
A 1mm depth of cut is pretty heavy in my view unless it is used for hogging off waste.
Simon
Member
It would seem the OP was only following the tool manufacturers recommendation on setting the spur depth. http://www.leevalley.com/us/wood/page.aspx?p=75620
To deploy the scoring spur(s), loosen the spur retention screw and lower the spur slightly below the skate (to a maximum of 1/32").
Member
The max. is the limit and like the max. limit settings for many other things, skills and experience matter. If the nickers are forced through wood with the plane not held in an upright position, it is possible the nickers could break. Many users cut rabbets or grooves that are out of square because they do not know how to keep their multiplanes or plows upright while charging.
Can I set the nickers to the limit of 0.8mm and not break them? Absolutely, because I use the tool unlike many who rely on force (rather than a sharp edge).
Simon
Last edited by Simon MacGowen; 09-25-2018 at 10:41 PM.
[OP]
Member
You are absolutely correct...
I will hone the nickers and run some tests making sure that they are extended by no more than the depth of cut...
Contributor
This is one of the reasons it is nice to have the luxury of a dial gauge that can measure so 0.001". Not to set knickers, but to know how heavy your shavings tend to be. For me, about 0.015" is my maximum. Yes, it isn't that hard, but it wears me out five times faster than takin 0.005/6" cuts. My recollection of my thickest cut with a Stanley #45 was ~0.125. with a 1/4" blade. Whoopie!!!
Find a cut depth that works. Hone the knickers with a more rounded profile. Then give it another go.
BTW, the dado looks good.
jtk
Last edited by Jim Koepke; 09-26-2018 at 12:11 PM. Reason: changed .9125 (!) to .125
"A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty."
- Sir Winston Churchill (1874-1965)
Member
This statement (from a hand tool user) took me by surprise...until I read the next sentence.
Simon
Member
Because of Stewie's post, I checked out the online instructions for the first time (I relied on my experience with the Veritas plow and rabbet plane when setting and using the borrowed plane. You know woodworkers are "famous" for not reading manuals before they...). This is the part related to the spurs (nickers is not the term used there):
- To deploy the scoring spur(s), loosen the spur retention screw and lower the spur slightly below the skate (to
a maximum of 1/32") and then tighten the retention screw to lock the spur’s position. Adjust the amount
of protrusion of the spur to match that of the blade.
My usual technique of setting the plow or skew rabbet is opposite to the above instructions: I set the blade cut before the spur(s). To me, the depth of cut (apart from the sharpness of the cutter) is more important than any other settings in determining the cut quality, and so the cutter is the first thing to set.
In other words, my cutter is used to determine the spur protrusion, which is, I believe, a hair less than the cutter's depth in use.
Simon
Contributor
Just a thought, since the spurs on my #45 are at a fixed depth.....Since the spurs have to make a cut ahead of the iron, shouldn't both be at the same depth? If the iron is set deeper, doesn't that negate anything the spur is doing? Once the surface has been cut cleanly by both the spur and the cutter, THEN you can deepen the depth of the iron.
Might be a tad hard to drag the plane backwards a few times, using only the spurs, IF the iron is set deeper? Unless the intent is to polish the bevel while pulling the plane? YOE......
Contributor
Oops! Fortunately there was still time for my correction on my thick shaving.This statement (from a hand tool user) took me by surprise...until I read the next sentence.
Simon
jtk
"A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty."
- Sir Winston Churchill (1874-1965)
Member
Steven,
I have had almost zero experience with the #45 other than for some test runs, and couldn't remember how the spurs were set vis a vis the fence and blade. With my pal's combo, I set the spurs close to the blade (by feel) and engage the spurs on the stock at a slight angle to score the lines in two or three strokes, like scribing a line with a marking gauge. All this done with the fence held against the stock -- critical here, otherwise the blade's path won't match the scored lines, and tear out could happen. The lines are there just to prevent tear-out, not for cutting which is the job of a sharp cutter.
It is easy to score backwards with the combo as described. Is it much different or harder with the #45? Frankly, no idea there.
Simon
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