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Thread: New (to me) Negative Scraper

  1. #16
    Join Date
    Apr 2018
    Location
    Cambridge Vermont
    Posts
    2,280
    Sounds good. I like my grizzly clone. I've seen where people get the Tormek bar with the micro adjuster to make it parallel to the grinding wheel. You have to relocate one of the holes as the two parallel bars that slide into the mounts are closer together on the Tormek. They are easy to get so I have debated getting one so I could have the stock bar on one side and the upgraded bar on the other. Right now I just use the backside as I like how the gouge comes out and that's what I sharpen the most. I bought a cheap diamond dressing point off of ebay. It's just small enough to be clamped into the standard jig that comes with the Grizzly. It works great for dressing and truing the wheel. Grizzly sells one just like it but I would of had to pay for shipping as I didn't get it when I bought the grinder. The Tormek one looks nice but too rich for my blood. Before that I was just using a hand dresser and not getting great results. Now I rarely have grooves in the wheel.

    I have my grinder on a cheap Harbor Freight pit cart. It lives on a side shelf right next to the lathe. I've thought about adding a lazy Susan base to the shelf so I could spin it around easily if I did start using both sides. Seams like a lot of turning is all about finding what works for you (and spending money). I've avoided trying negative rake scrapers (and learning how to sharpen them) because I rarely use a scraper. But as I get more experience I'm sure that will change.

  2. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Alex Zeller View Post
    I've avoided trying negative rake scrapers (and learning how to sharpen them) because I rarely use a scraper. But as I get more experience I'm sure that will change.
    Yeah, it sounds like a lot of turners stay away from them. A lot also seem to avoid skews finding them difficult, awkward, or just plain not liking them, but some take to them as a first choice for many tasks. That is me. I tended to use skews a lot right from the start and am taking to negative scrapers quickly as well. Both seem to me to make the work quicker and easier. I am still pretty new to all this, but that is my take on it so far. Different strokes and all that though...

  3. #18
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    E TN, near Knoxville
    Posts
    12,298
    Quote Originally Posted by Alex Zeller View Post
    I've avoided trying negative rake scrapers (and learning how to sharpen them) because I rarely use a scraper. But as I get more experience I'm sure that will change.
    Once you start using them you might be surprised how quick and easy they are to sharpen (once ground to the desired shape) and how well they work.

    The curved ones I showed earlier are amazing if you do face turning, bowls and platter. After turning with the gouge, careful use of the NRS will eliminate much of the sanding. After cleaning up a bit more with hand scrapers I can usually start with 320 or even 400 grit. For an extreme example, this piece started and ended with 600 grit. Granted, it is cedar which is fairly soft, but the NRS and hand scrapers made sanding with only 600 grit possible.

    penta_platter_cedar_IMG_7434.jpg

    scrapers_neg_rake.jpg

    Sometimes I wish I had the time to make videos, then I could show you how quick and painless these are to sharpen and use. Hey, maybe I could drive up to Vermont for a club demo! I've been in your area before by my Lovely Bride keeps suggesting a road trip.

    JKJ

  4. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Pete Staehling View Post
    If I didn't already own the Grizzly stuff I might have bought the tormek, but I bought the "accessory kit #1" with the grinder and it included the scissor jig.
    Just to clarify... When I typed that, I was only referring to the rest and some of the other accessories not the whole grinder. I don't think I'd ever spring for the Tormek over the Grizzly unless the prices changed drastically.

    BTW, if anyone is in the market the 10" Grizzly wet grinder (ITEM# T10010ANV) is on sale for $109.95. At $30 off that seems like a pretty good deal to me.

  5. #20
    Join Date
    Apr 2018
    Location
    Cambridge Vermont
    Posts
    2,280
    I have a curved skew but rarely use it because I turn mostly bowls and platters. I'm also back to making buttons. I think my problem was trying to learn to use too many tools at once. The local club was meeting on days I worked so I've only been able to make one meeting so far. I was getting lots of tear out and folded fibers so I took a step back and have been using the gouge for about 95% of my turning. I'm not a master but by focusing on the gouge I figured out what (several whats) I was doing wrong and now I can turn a bowl that needs almost no sanding. I still occasionally lift up my right hand and get the angle wrong on the gouge but I realize when I do it.

    So I'm getting ready to regrind one of my scrapers to make a negative rake. One of my problems was not having the grinding wheel true enough to get a good profile on flat tools. Now that I've gotten better at that I'm thinking I need to focus on getting the burr first before adding a negative rake grind to the mix. That could be flawed thinking (wouldn't be the first time). The real problem is I want to do everything all at once, lol. One of the club members showed me quickly how to remove the burr then burnish the scraper to form a much better burr but I didn't get it right and, as I said, I haven't had the chance to get back to another meeting. I think what I did was pushed too hard and made too much of a burr. Being tool steel and never doing it before I probably went overboard. I'm thinking if I can feel what the correct burr feels like with my finger then I can judge much easier. I used a round screwdriver shaft to burnish it vs buying something special so that could have played a role into the failure as well.

    From there it's just investing the time into rough grinding one of the scrapers and then finishing it off on the wet grinder. That first grind could take some time but once I have it touching it up should be almost as easy as touching up any other tool. I'll start off with the flat scraper and then once I have that down I'll move to the round scrapers.

  6. #21
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Quorn United Kingdom
    Posts
    773
    Members may find the content in the links below helpful

    http://www.rudolphlopez.com/pdfs/Negative%20Rake%20Scraper%20Jig%20and%20Info.pdf


    file:///C:/Users/Lenovo/Downloads/Rudy_Lopez_Handouts_1-18.pdf

    http://www.channelislandswoodturners.org/services/stuart-batty-august-2006/

    http://www.cindydrozda.com/handouts_Pdfs/handouts/demo%20handouts/negative%20rake%20scrapers.pdf

    https://www.santacruzwoodturners.org/learning/articles/negative-rake-scrapers/

    and

    http://www.woodworkersemporium.com/content/NRS-Instruction-Manual.pdf

    Last edited by Brian Deakin; 09-08-2018 at 7:10 PM.

  7. #22
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    E TN, near Knoxville
    Posts
    12,298
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian Deakin View Post
    file:///C:/Users/Lenovo/Downloads/Rudy_Lopez_Handouts_1-18.pdf
    Brian, on testing these links this one didn't work. (Not a URL)

    JKJ

  8. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by John K Jordan View Post
    Brian, on testing these links this one didn't work. (Not a URL)

    JKJ
    I am betting he is talking about the file linked to on this page:
    http://brasstownwoodturners.org/news...lopez-handouts

  9. #24
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Quorn United Kingdom
    Posts
    773
    This appears to work on my laptop if you copy and paste



    file:///C:/Users/Lenovo/Downloads/Rudy_Lopez_Handouts_1-18.pdf

  10. #25
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    E TN, near Knoxville
    Posts
    12,298
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian Deakin View Post
    This appears to work on my laptop if you copy and paste
    file:///C:/Users/Lenovo/Downloads/Rudy_Lopez_Handouts_1-18.pdf
    Brian,

    This that appears to point to a PDF file on your local C: drive, one you may have downloaded sometime in the past.

    JKJ

  11. #26
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Wetter Washington
    Posts
    888
    Eric Loftstrom and Jimmie Allen just released a video that includes how they sharpen NRS
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YsatMuK1Ei8
    Making sawdust mostly, sometimes I get something else, but that is more by accident then design.

  12. #27
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Wetter Washington
    Posts
    888
    Quote Originally Posted by John K Jordan View Post
    Brian, on testing these links this one didn't work. (Not a URL)

    JKJ
    Nope, that's a link to the file on his home PC
    Making sawdust mostly, sometimes I get something else, but that is more by accident then design.

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