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Thread: Speedy 400 Ceramic tube replacement/refurb

  1. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Bill George View Post
    So progress, RF metal tubes last say 10 years and cost $2,000 to regas or Ceramic core tubes that last 10 years and cost $4500 to replace?
    I'm not sure where your 10-year number comes from, but I've seen the bell curve of laser failures and no one in the industry is telling people 10-year lifespans on lasers. The bell curve showed 4-6 year years and then it rapidly dropped off with very few tubes ever lasting 10 years. If it did, it was far outside the norm. That was an internal document from a manufacturer so I know the number was accurate.

    All laser rebuilding costs have gone up a lot over the last few years. Anything over 4-5 years and you're living on borrowed time.
    Lasers : Trotec Speedy 300 75W, Trotec Speedy 300 80W, Galvo Fiber Laser 20W
    Printers : Mimaki UJF-6042 UV Flatbed Printer , HP Designjet L26500 61" Wide Format Latex Printer, Summa S140-T 48" Vinyl Plotter
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    Real name Steve but that name was taken on the forum. Used Middle name. Call me Steve or Scott, doesn't matter.

  2. #17
    Join Date
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    Quote Originally Posted by Matt McCoy View Post
    I believe the two gentlemen mention 4 and 6.5 years on their ceramic tubes.
    Whoops I missed that part.
    Retired Guy- Central Iowa.HVAC/R , Cloudray Galvo Fiber , -Windows 10

  3. #18
    So am I understanding this right, that even the electronics in/on a ceramic laser can't be repaired?
    ========================================
    ELEVEN - rotary cutter tool machines
    FOUR - CO2 lasers
    THREE- make that FOUR now - fiber lasers
    ONE - vinyl cutter
    CASmate, Corel, Gravostyle


  4. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Kev Williams View Post
    So am I understanding this right, that even the electronics in/on a ceramic laser can't be repaired?
    Of course they can be repaired. Our lasers don’t owe us anything. They make us a lot of money. The Trotec rocked out $2000 worth of work on Friday. Not sure I’m going to complain too much about having to replace a known perishable item when it’s raking the money in for us.
    Lasers : Trotec Speedy 300 75W, Trotec Speedy 300 80W, Galvo Fiber Laser 20W
    Printers : Mimaki UJF-6042 UV Flatbed Printer , HP Designjet L26500 61" Wide Format Latex Printer, Summa S140-T 48" Vinyl Plotter
    Router : ShopBot 48" x 96" CNC Router Rotary Engravers : (2) Xenetech XOT 16 x 25 Rotary Engravers

    Real name Steve but that name was taken on the forum. Used Middle name. Call me Steve or Scott, doesn't matter.

  5. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Scott Shepherd View Post
    I'm not sure where your 10-year number comes from, but I've seen the bell curve of laser failures and no one in the industry is telling people 10-year lifespans on lasers. The bell curve showed 4-6 year years and then it rapidly dropped off with very few tubes ever lasting 10 years. If it did, it was far outside the norm. That was an internal document from a manufacturer so I know the number was accurate.

    All laser rebuilding costs have gone up a lot over the last few years. Anything over 4-5 years and you're living on borrowed time.

    Stop trying to Jinx me! The synrad in my Epilog legend 32 was made in 2001 or 2002 (can't remember off the top of my head.) Came out of an Airforce base and they definitely bought it new. I don't know how many hours it was used but age-wise, it's a champ. 16 years on original gas seems crazy if anything past 4-5 years is living on borrowed time!

  6. #21
    Thanks to all for the replies. I'm getting some seriously great and timely help from my sales rep, Trotec repairmen and Trotec headquarters. Alas the laser tube went belly up today. I'll let you all know how it goes. I don't have sense of how long a ceramic tube might last. I recall the selling point was a longer life - how's everyone else's doing?

  7. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Scott Shepherd View Post
    I'm not sure where your 10-year number comes from, but I've seen the bell curve of laser failures and no one in the industry is telling people 10-year lifespans on lasers. The bell curve showed 4-6 year years and then it rapidly dropped off with very few tubes ever lasting 10 years. If it did, it was far outside the norm. That was an internal document from a manufacturer so I know the number was accurate.

    All laser rebuilding costs have gone up a lot over the last few years. Anything over 4-5 years and you're living on borrowed time.
    4-6 years regardless of use?

  8. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Jacob John View Post
    4-6 years regardless of use?
    Use has little to do with the life. If I could locate the file that had the lifespan on it, I would post it here. It was from an advanced training seminar Universal put on years ago. There was a presentation that went through a lot of information and one of those slides was the bell curve of the lifespan. They talked in depth about what to expect, etc.

    Remember, statistics are just that. In order to get the curve, you have to have failures at 6 months and failures at 12 years. Neither of those failures in this normal, but that doesn't mean they didn't happen. There's a big difference in the personal experiences of a couple of users and statistics based on 1000's of users.
    Lasers : Trotec Speedy 300 75W, Trotec Speedy 300 80W, Galvo Fiber Laser 20W
    Printers : Mimaki UJF-6042 UV Flatbed Printer , HP Designjet L26500 61" Wide Format Latex Printer, Summa S140-T 48" Vinyl Plotter
    Router : ShopBot 48" x 96" CNC Router Rotary Engravers : (2) Xenetech XOT 16 x 25 Rotary Engravers

    Real name Steve but that name was taken on the forum. Used Middle name. Call me Steve or Scott, doesn't matter.

  9. #24
    Join Date
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    I thought the new ceramic tube was an improvement?
    Retired Guy- Central Iowa.HVAC/R , Cloudray Galvo Fiber , -Windows 10

  10. #25
    Just curious: If it's ~$4,500 + installation for a 120 W tube, how much for an 80 W tube and installation? Are metal tubes still available from Trotec?

  11. #26
    Metal tubes are not available from Trotec in new equipment. You can do the install yourself.
    Mike Null

    St. Louis Laser, Inc.

    Trotec Speedy 300, 80 watt
    Gravograph IS400
    Woodworking shop CLTT and Laser Sublimation
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  12. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Bill George View Post
    I thought the new ceramic tube was an improvement?
    I'm not following your logic. 1 or 2 people say their tube failed in the normal failure rate and you believe that means all of them are inferior to previous models? That makes no sense. There is no implied additional lifespan with the Ceramic core tubes. It's just like someone switching from Coherent brand to Synrad. Trotec switched to Ceramic. Will Ceramic core tubes have failures? Yes. Will some of them be on the upside of the bell curve for failures? Yes. Does that mean they aren't better than a standard metal core tube? No.

    I know many Epilog people with tube failures far earlier than the 4-5 years. Does that mean their tubes are inferior? I wouldn't imply that. It just means that the people I know have had failures. Doesn't mean there aren't 100's or 1000's of people out there getting better life out of them, it's just one data point. One data point doesn't make a trend.

    Considering they released them 6-8 years ago and this is the first posted failure of 1 on this forum, I'd say that's pretty darn amazing.
    Lasers : Trotec Speedy 300 75W, Trotec Speedy 300 80W, Galvo Fiber Laser 20W
    Printers : Mimaki UJF-6042 UV Flatbed Printer , HP Designjet L26500 61" Wide Format Latex Printer, Summa S140-T 48" Vinyl Plotter
    Router : ShopBot 48" x 96" CNC Router Rotary Engravers : (2) Xenetech XOT 16 x 25 Rotary Engravers

    Real name Steve but that name was taken on the forum. Used Middle name. Call me Steve or Scott, doesn't matter.

  13. #28
    Join Date
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    My Speedy 300 was one of the very first Trotec machines shipped with a ceramic tube. At the time (January 2012) Trotec had not advertised that the technology was available, in fact I was told on the phone that there would be something special about my machine but Trotec could not tell me what it was at the time. After a couple months I found the information about the Trotec ceramic core tubes on their web site and checked my machine to see if the label was attached. That is when I found out about the ceramic tube in my machine. Based on my experience I doubt anyone has a ceramic tube that is older then, lets say, 7 years unless they had acquired a beta testing machine.

    I don't know for a fact what the timeline has been but these are the facts in my case.

  14. #29
    Not speaking for Bill, but It's my understanding that he's referring to the possibility that switching to a ceramic tube, which may or may not be able to be replaced by the manufacturer, as opposed to repaired by a 3rd party, only increases the yearly operating cost of the Trotec laser. Quick and dirty math would put it at ~$1,000/year, for the tube alone and in this scenario.

  15. #30
    We got ours about a month before Keith if I recall correctly. We got the last of the Synrad tube. We had to have a machine because we had a large order and the machine was bought to do that order. That would put us in December 2011. Since December of 2011, we've spent zero dollars on it. Only parts replaced were the ones that needed to be replaced when we managed to catch it on fire. Mainly, 1 belt and the air assist tubing. I'd say that 6 1/2 years and zero dollars spent on it is pretty darn impressive. If Keith had the same experience, that's 6 1/2 years minus 1 month with zero maintenance. I still firmly believe that our machine doesn't owe us anything. It's done well for us.
    Lasers : Trotec Speedy 300 75W, Trotec Speedy 300 80W, Galvo Fiber Laser 20W
    Printers : Mimaki UJF-6042 UV Flatbed Printer , HP Designjet L26500 61" Wide Format Latex Printer, Summa S140-T 48" Vinyl Plotter
    Router : ShopBot 48" x 96" CNC Router Rotary Engravers : (2) Xenetech XOT 16 x 25 Rotary Engravers

    Real name Steve but that name was taken on the forum. Used Middle name. Call me Steve or Scott, doesn't matter.

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