[OP]
Contributor
Another thread discusses using cleats to keep a table top flat. How do you attach cleats while accounting for wood movement? I am thinking you screw one end (or the middle), and then use some slotted holes on the other end? Is there a special slotted washer or other attachment that is used? I am perplexed because I looked at a few commercially made tables and photos of cleats online, and they all seem to be screwed directly into the solid tops all the way across the top.
Thanks.
Member
Typically the center screw would be in a hole while the ones toward the ends would be in slots. If you counterbore the slots you can use a normal flat washer and round or pan head screws in the slot.
Contributor
Yes, this is pretty much what I do too. There are other methods if you prefer.Originally Posted by Dave Richards
Good luck!
Fred
"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing."
“If you want to know what a man's like, take a good look at how he treats his inferiors, not his equals.”
Contributor
A regular washer with an oversize clearance hole does the trick. Or if you want, Lee Valley sells oval washers with oval holes, precisely for this purpose. http://www.leevalley.com/en/hardware...=3,41306,41309
[OP]
Contributor
Thanks guys. I didnt want to overcomplicate it, but couldn't find anything like those oval washers in my internet searching. I am actually making a chest lid, and wanted something more clean and efficient than plain washers, as the cleats will be visible. Looking at several retail tables and seeing cleats just screwed in without any visible provision for movement, threw me off.
Contributor
Or you could eliminate all hardware by using a sliding dovetail. Assuming the top is glued up strips, you glue the top except for one outer strip. Then route a stopped dovetail slot and matching dovetail on the cleat. Slide the cleat(s) in and glue on the last board. No glue or fasteners needed for the cleats. You make the cleat a little longer than the slot (trimming off the excess dovetail) so you don't see the slot. A little more work than a screwed on cleat, but neater looking and automatically allows for wood movement as long as you don't glue the cleats in and allow some slop in the length of the slot.
[OP]
Contributor
Paul, I see that is a pretty slick solution. Thanks.
Member
I know cleats are used all over the place in real life - so this is likely more of a theoretical worry than a real concern...
I get worried about the cross ways vs long ways expansion of wood with humidity causing cracks and bowing when we start attaching some long grain pieces perpendicular to other long grain pieces.
But... It's been done this way for a long time - so that probably means it's not a big problem so far as problems go.....
That said - I spend a lot of time on working my joints so they are as good as I can get them prior to glue up... I plane my joints and then candle them till I can't see any light anywhere prior to glue up... It seems to work well enough for me - no cracks at glue joints.... But I see a lot of furniture that's machine jointed with breadboard ends or crossgrain cleats - with no cracks either... So is it necessary for me to do what I do?
Last edited by John C Cox; 06-26-2018 at 10:13 AM.
Member
Cleats and breadboard ends aren't added to the underside of table tops and chest lids to prevent cracking at the joints. They are added to help keep the top flat. Excellent tight glue joints have no impact on whether or not the panel will remain flat.
As was mentioned above, cleats are typically secured at the center of the panel and screws out away from the center pass through slots or elongated holes in the cleat to allow the top to expand and contract as it will without trying to restrain it.
You should keep doing what you're doing if you get good results in your glue-ups.
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