Through mortise and tenons

[Mark Rainey]

Yes Brian, hand mortising can be a chore. I agree with Warren - time to get a $20 Narex mortising chisel from Lee Valley. In addition to better results, one of the finest pleasures in woodworking is pounding a hefty mortise chisel with a mallet with force and fury. Try it.

[Jim Koepke]

Someone mentioned people not using mortise chisels before Sellers was born.

You must have misread what was posted:

People were likely using non-mortise chisels to cut mortises centuries before Sellers was born.

It isn't a statement claiming people didn't use mortise chisels before the birth of Mr. Sellers. Nor did it infer, as the statement above does, the history of mortise chisels began with the birth of Mr. Sellers.

Its intended message is, people have often used chisels not specifically made as mortise chisels to cut mortises if they didn't have a mortise chisel at hand.

My point is Mr. Sellers wasn't the first person to have used a bench chisel to cut a mortise and he won't be the last. Also as said in the text, before even hearing of Mr. Sellers or even knowing about mortise chisels one of my first uses of a chisel was to cut a mortise.

I don't think people were that stupid then.

Are they somehow less "stupid" now by Mr. Sellers giving his blessing to the practice?

It is not my opinion that people who cut mortises with a bench chisel are any less mentally competent than anyone else. My opinion is for me, it is easier and more satisfying to use a mortise chisel if one has a mortise chisel.

One of the many beauties of woodworking is there are always many ways to reach the same end.

jtk

[Bill Carey]

Yes Brian, hand mortising can be a chore. I agree with Warren - time to get a $20 Narex mortising chisel from Lee Valley. In addition to better results, one of the finest pleasures in woodworking is pounding a hefty mortise chisel with a mallet with force and fury. Try it.

I could not agree more. I bought the Narex set of mortise chisels and love using them. First thing I did with them was to make a thru mortise in a chunk of oak to make a mallet. Quite enjoyable.

[Jim Koepke]

Thanks for the advice! I ended up doing 4 using the Sellers method and the remaining 4 I drilled and paired. I feel like I was better able to maintain crisp lines with the drill and pair method but it was a fun experience learning the chisel method. That being said, it was very tedious to knock 8 of those out in one day!1

Good Show!

Also good to have tried two ways to find which feels better for you.

jtk

[James Pallas]

It doesn't hurt a thing to try different methods. I have drilled and pared, used a mortise chisel, used a bench chisel it all works. I prefer mortise chisel work. On a workbench I would probably drill and pare if a nice trestle table I would use a mortise chisel if I had the correct size or do like Warren suggested, two side by side mortises and cut out the middle piece. I think I could make a guess here and say that the chisels the ancient Egyptians used probably didn't look much like anything we use today. Sometimes a person does not have money to spend for a mortise chisel and use what they have, I've been there. Do the best you can with the tools you have.
Jim

[steven c newman]

While building a screendoor for the house....used through mortise and tenons..
IMAG0198.jpg
Came in from both sides. 1/4" tenons so I used a 1/4" mortise chisel..
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Built a fixture to hold thing upright, and not bounce around..
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Lock rail area.
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Then came back with wedges and pins.
pins & wedges.jpg
Then trim things flush....

[Doug Dawson]

Are they somehow less "stupid" now by Mr. Sellers giving his blessing to the practice?

People before Mr. Sellers weren't smarter than people today. They just had a lot more time on their hands. No tv, no computers, no internet, no printing press. They came up with a lot of odd stuff, half out of desperation, half out of boredom. Ask Patrick Leach, he knows all about this.

[ken hatch]

Yes Brian, hand mortising can be a chore. I agree with Warren - time to get a $20 Narex mortising chisel from Lee Valley. In addition to better results, one of the finest pleasures in woodworking is pounding a hefty mortise chisel with a mallet with force and fury. Try it.

Hummm....Like most things in life, it goes better with a gentle touch. When you drive too hard the chisel will stick and it takes time to free it. It is best to tap, tap, tap, lever, repeat until everything that does not look like a mortise hole is removed. Mortises can go very quickly with a light touch and adequate area to clear the chips. A pig sticker works better than a sash mortise chisel or a bevel edge but all will do the job.

ken

[lowell holmes]

By all means, try one. It is a fun trip. Just mark a mortise on a piece of 2X4, then take a razor sharp chisel and mallet and chop away.
In a through mortise I sometimes will drill a hole in one end of the mortise after I have started it. The hole helps with chip disposal.

[Mike Holbrook]

I will mention a few inexpensive parts I recently purchased from Lee Valley (LV) that may help. LV makes drill guides (search “bushings and inserts”, & “dog hole bushings and bits”) which can be made into a jig using any 2x4 scrap. If one does not have a drill press, or if the piece being worked is not easily moved to a drill press...one of these jigs allows one to drill accurate holes for the mortises.

[ken hatch]

If you chose the drill and pare method the easiest and least amount of monkey motion, also most accurate, is a simple brace and bit. Big mortises, deep narrow and/or angled mortises can be easier to drill and pare otherwise a pigsticker works better.

ken

[Charles Guest]

I just spent over an hour painstakingly laying out 8 mortises for the workbench I am building. After checking over things several times I am confident I got everything laid out as accurately as I am capable of. However, I’ve never done through mortise and tenon joints and the only mortise and tenon joinery I’ve done is on a much smaller scale. On a positive note, I really enjoyed using my Veritas dual marking gauge for the first time.

I’ve done lots of reading/watching YouTube, etc. and feel like I understand the concept but I’m rather nervous about it. I don’t have any mortise chisels so my options are the Paul Sellers method (not terribly appealing) or drilling out the mortises (half way from each side) with a bit smaller than the size of the mortise (3/4”) and pairing the remaining waste to the marking gauge lines.

Any thoughts/tips/sage wisdom?

Thanks!

Practice on some off cuts the exact same size as the live project parts!

[Mike Holbrook]

I have a “pigsticker” which I have used to make mortises. I think one of several Japanese mortising and heavier “other” chisels work even better. The hoops, handles and chisel shafts are specifically designed to be used with heavier Geenou (Japanese metal hammer, tradionally with a wood handle). These tools are designed to drive chisels faster and more accurately. Stanley Covington has written several articles here on SMC regarding the use and construction of these hammers and chisels. Brian Holcombe’s videos and web site are also a good source of information on the use of these tools.

Certainly a multitude of tools will do the job. It may be advisable to look at the construction of these joints as a journey which has many routes which may work better for specific work.

[Warren Mickley]

I have a “pigsticker” which I have used to make mortises. I think one of several Japanese mortising and heavier “other” chisels work even better. The hoops, handles and chisel shafts are specifically designed to be used with heavier Geenou (Japanese metal hammer, tradionally with a wood handle). These tools are designed to drive chisels faster and more accurately. Stanley Covington has written several articles here on SMC regarding the use and construction of these hammers and chisels.

I have used a 30 ounce dogwood mallet for making mortises since 1979. I have used it almost entirely with chisels without hoops. Andre Roubo shows a mallet with larger dimensions than mine: based on these dimensions it could be 42 ounces. Roubo shows no chisels with hoops at all.

How heavy is the gennou you are using? How long does it take you to make a mortise that is 5/16 X 1 1/2 X 1 1/2 inches deep?

[Mark Rainey]

Hummm....Like most things in life, it goes better with a gentle touch. When you drive too hard the chisel will stick and it takes time to free it. It is best to tap, tap, tap, lever, repeat until everything that does not look like a mortise hole is removed. Mortises can go very quickly with a light touch and adequate area to clear the chips. A pig sticker works better than a sash mortise chisel or a bevel edge but all will do the job.

ken

Ken, we can choose our own methods of work & I respect yours. Paul Sellers tap, tap tapping with a light round mallet just doesn’t do it for me. There is nothing gentle or mild about mortising. Ian Kirby describes violent blows, full arm swings! Let it rip! The chisel will travel deep and a forceful pull will lever out stubborn chips. Fast, furious and satisfying. Warren describes club like mallets - remember, this is the Neanderthal forum😉