Euro slider vs cabinet saw

[Mike King]

I'm not in the market for a slider as they are out of my price range. Though they do look like a great alternative to a cabinet saw.

My biggest issue with them and the Eureka Zone EZ-1 which I strongly considered is that they are so different from what we are used to. There are literally hundreds of books and videos on every technique or jig for doing anything on a more conventional saw. Not to mention all of the after market accessories. With the EZ-1 or a slider it seems to me that I would have to lear everything all over. Having to experiment or learn something new seems like a waste of time and somewhat dangerous.

Maybe one of the slider owners could address this issue as well as how steep the learning curve really is or isn't.

It does take time to learn how to use the advantages of a slider. But that just means you are using it as you would use a cabinet saw, and that's no more dangerous than using a cabinet saw. So what do you have to lose?

I virtually never use the rip fence on my saw anymore. In fact, it is out of adjustment and I don't care as it isn't being used...

Mike

[Steve Rozmiarek]

I'm not in the market for a slider as they are out of my price range. Though they do look like a great alternative to a cabinet saw.

My biggest issue with them and the Eureka Zone EZ-1 which I strongly considered is that they are so different from what we are used to. There are literally hundreds of books and videos on every technique or jig for doing anything on a more conventional saw. Not to mention all of the after market accessories. With the EZ-1 or a slider it seems to me that I would have to lear everything all over. Having to experiment or learn something new seems like a waste of time and somewhat dangerous.

Maybe one of the slider owners could address this issue as well as how steep the learning curve really is or isn't.

I'll give it a shot Marshall. I have both, so each time that I use one or the other, the differences are illustrated. On the Felder, you use the carriage as much as possible so the waste is often right of the blade. The conventional nearly always has the waste on the left. I'd buy a slider again if it only had one benefit, the ability to straight line rip. I can process a lot of rough lumber very quickly with it, where the conventional route is tedious. People talk of the trouble ripping narrow stock on a slider, which isn't an issue, it's just usually done on the carriage.

The only benefit that I can see on the conventional saw is the simplicity of the stacked dado. A slider will dado, with a insert shaper head type cutter, which generally makes a better cut, however it's expensive and more effort to install. As a result you don't swap from dado to saw as often on a slider, you plan better.

I don't think it's really a learning curve, it's just a different tool, and you use it differently. Same as you'd use a tracksaw, panel saw, or whatever differently. Some will not want to do that, some will be fine with it.

[Robert Engel]

For a production cabinet shop, IMO its a no brainer. Time saving is enough to justify it.

For a hobbyist shop, its simply a matter of want + funds + space. (They are quite a space hog).

If you've got those 3 I say go for it.

[Jon Snider]

Jon, having gone from a cabinet saw to a short stroke slider ( I have the Hammer B3 Winner with 49" stroke), I would never go back to a cabinet saw.

Accuracy, capacity, safety exceed that of a cabinet saw................Regards, rod.

Rod, Are you able to cut a 4x8’ plywood sheet? I’m guessing if yes only crosscuts. I spent last night reading the Felder pdf catalog online. It seems the various Hammer and Felder saws all go up in price with longer slider tables, and with outriggers as an option or standard. Why do you need or want an outrigger if every fence has 49” or more clearance to the right?

Also, what else does a short slider offer over a cabinet saw and SCMS or RAS combo? It does seem that with the crosscut fence you can do very nice and repeatable work, but it seems to my very uneducated eye that the main appeal of a slider is for sheet work, ripping a new straight edge on rough lumber, and for perhaps safer ripping with hands and body out of danger zone.

Thx again to all who have posted. I’m working to try to catch up.

Jon

[Dan T Jones]

Joe,
I know this is a little off topic but what is the parallel cutting jig? I have a Hammer C41 but still use the fence to rip.
Dan

[Jon Snider]

I'll give it a shot Marshall. I have both, so each time that I use one or the other, the differences are illustrated. On the Felder, you use the carriage as much as possible so the waste is often right of the blade. The conventional nearly always has the waste on the left. I'd buy a slider again if it only had one benefit, the ability to straight line rip. I can process a lot of rough lumber very quickly with it, where the conventional route is tedious. People talk of the trouble ripping narrow stock on a slider, which isn't an issue, it's just usually done on the carriage.

The only benefit that I can see on the conventional saw is the simplicity of the stacked dado. A slider will dado, with a insert shaper head type cutter, which generally makes a better cut, however it's expensive and more effort to install. As a result you don't swap from dado to saw as often on a slider, you plan better.

I don't think it's really a learning curve, it's just a different tool, and you use it differently. Same as you'd use a tracksaw, panel saw, or whatever differently. Some will not want to do that, some will be fine with it.

Steve, our posts crossed in cyberspace while I was replying to Rod. Thanks for your helpful descriptions.

[Chris Parks]

Steve a forum contributor has done a series on sliders that is worth watching

[Jim Becker]

Maybe one of the slider owners could address this issue as well as how steep the learning curve really is or isn't.

I believe there are quite a few discussions on this here at SMC over the years in addition to this one...

Some things are "the same"; some things are slightly different, but very easy to adapt do and some things require a different approach. How long it takes for the latter really revolves around the commitment from the individual to dive in and be willing to think things through in an unfamiliar way. Some people like change; some do not. The former will have no problem. The latter will likely be unhappy.

[Marshall Harrison]

Thanks for the relies Mike and Steve.

One more question on the subject. Are sliding table extensions added to a cabinet saw a viable option? Or are they more bad than they are good.

A true slider is out of my budgets. I'm just a hobbyist with intentions to maybe sell a couple of pieces to supplement my Social Security.

[Jim Becker]

Sliding table extensions generally work well for larger panels, but otherwise are not really the same as a Euro slider where the wagon (the actual sliding mechanism) butts right up to the blade.

[John Kee]

I'll give it a shot Marshall. I have both, so each time that I use one or the other, the differences are illustrated. On the Felder, you use the carriage as much as possible so the waste is often right of the blade. The conventional nearly always has the waste on the left. I'd buy a slider again if it only had one benefit, the ability to straight line rip. I can process a lot of rough lumber very quickly with it, where the conventional route is tedious. People talk of the trouble ripping narrow stock on a slider, which isn't an issue, it's just usually done on the carriage.

The only benefit that I can see on the conventional saw is the simplicity of the stacked dado. A slider will dado, with a insert shaper head type cutter, which generally makes a better cut, however it's expensive and more effort to install. As a result you don't swap from dado to saw as often on a slider, you plan better.

I don't think it's really a learning curve, it's just a different tool, and you use it differently. Same as you'd use a tracksaw, panel saw, or whatever differently. Some will not want to do that, some will be fine with it.

As far as Dado cutting goes I've used an insert cutter but the results from my Freud stacked Dado, that I had bored and pinholed are just as good with no bat ears. Forrest also offers a Dado set that fits the Felder 30mm bore with the pin holes.

[Steve Rozmiarek]

As far as Dado cutting goes I've used an insert cutter but the results from my Freud stacked Dado, that I had bored and pinholed are just as good with no bat ears. Forrest also offers a Dado set that fits the Felder 30mm bore with the pin holes.

John, I didn't know anyone had a pinned stacked out there, good to know! Nothing wrong with the shaper style cutter, I just personally prefer stacked.

[Marshall Harrison]

Sliding table extensions generally work well for larger panels, but otherwise are not really the same as a Euro slider where the wagon (the actual sliding mechanism) butts right up to the blade.

Thanks. So it sounds like a cabinet saw along with a track saw would be a better way to go if you can't afford a true slider.

[Steve Rozmiarek]

Marshall, that's a solid work around plan.

[Jon Snider]

Steve a forum contributor has done a series on sliders that is worth watching

started looking at these last night and about 3/4 through his entire series. Very helpful. For ripping, how many use the sliding table with either clamps or Fritz and Frank type jig, or parallel fence vs just standard rip fence ripping?

If I were to go this route, the ripping features would be a big reason. I got nailed for the first time in 30yrs with a kickback last fall. Completely my fault even though I thought I was paying close attention. I’ve gained a new respect for the TS and am frankly a little spooked with all of the narrow stock I need to rip for boats such as gunwales and hatch frames.