Built-up gate posts using Cedar cores and Ipe faces

[Joe Hollis]

Hi,

I am planning on building a garden gate, and would appreciate your thoughts on the acceptability of using cedar as the core material for the major sections and facing the cedar cores with Ipe. Building the entire gate from Ipe is cost prohibitive, but I would like to have something harder wearing and nicer looking than using cedar alone. A solid ipe gate would also be much heavier.

Any major downsides to this approach?

Thanks a lot,

Joe H.

[Mark Bolton]

I'd do some torture tests before I invested in the time and money of building the finished gate. Laying up an 8' post would be far cheaper than building a gate that doesnt play well.

[Andrew Hughes]

The downside is alot of glued surface will be exposed to Mother Nature. And she will always win.
Cedar and Ipe might not play well with expansion and contraction.
Good luck with your build

[Bob Falk]

IF it was to degrade, the cedar would degrade first as it is less durable than Ipe. So, basically the longevity of the structure could be limited by the cedar, not the ipe.

[Brad Shipton]

How are you planning to attach the faces to the cedar core? If glue, you are heading down a path to do this job twice. If you can screw it, it will be fine. I tried bonding Cumaru to a weaker core for some decking posts years ago and the problem is exactly as Andrew says. Cumaru (IPE very similar) is much stronger and has very different exp/contraction ideas. To get this to work I finally had to go to a plywood core, and 1/16" skins bonded to the plywood using Resorcinol. IPE is not a lot of fun to work with and I think it should be left in Brazil where it is happiest. If you are in a dry climate like myself, it does some unique things when it dries.

[Jeff Duncan]

So not sure how the glue bonds will hold up with dissimilar materials..... your gate will be an experiment. Also as said the cedar will likely rot out ahead of the Ipe. Ipe needs to be maintained in order to look good, otherwise it will just turn grey and develop splits end checking etc.. So figure seasonal oiling at the very least.

good luck,
JeffD

[Dan Rude]

If you are going to cover it, why not pressure treated for the core? Look at the expansion of the material and fasten the cover material allowing movement of one or the other. I am thinking of doing this with some 4 x 4 posts that I have and covering with Redwood. I took down 2 old decks from the late 60's and 70's. I then stickered the Redwood 2 x 6's. The wood is beautiful, I realize I would never get it again, so want it to last. Dan

[Doug Hobkirk]

The Ipe is REALLY hard. Hard to drill, hard to cut, and heavy (I think it doesn't float). I built the floor of my front porch out of it and it seems to be virtually indestructible. I oiled it a couple of times the first year but haven't in at least 10 years and it looks superb. It's fully exposed, although it's on the North side, and a small roof keeps off most of the rain and some of the snow.
I happened to find the wood quite cheaply, but I do think it's worth a lot because it seems to have an infinite lifespan with zero maintenance. Or maybe that's just my hope...

I'm not sure what you're doing, but use screws (I think it does not work well with glue) and make the screw holes large enough they won't bind, because you will want to remove them when the cedar rots.

[Jamie Buxton]

Make the entire gate from cedar. You can buy clear vertical grain western red cedar for less money than ipe will cost you. And WRC is a nice outdoors wood. It deals with weather quite well. True, it is softer than ipe, but this is a gate you're building, not a deck; the softness will not be a problem.

Where I would use cladding is in the gate posts. If you look at old gates, usually a big problem is that the post on the hinge side is sagging. I'd use pressure-treated 4x4 (or more!) going a long way into concrete, and wrap it with cedar above ground. I wouldn't attempt to glue the cedar to the pressure-treat. I'd fasten it with bronze screws. Bronze weathers nicely to a color similar to the WRC. McFeelys sells bronze boat screws, and there are many other sources on the web.

[Joe Hollis]

Thanks for these replies. It looks like I am heading for trouble if I laminate the posts. My work space is small and its enough work to make the gate once without having to rebuild it in a few years. It rains a LOT where I am, so I will opt to make it all out of cedar. It's a lot cheaper too.

Make the entire gate from cedar. You can buy clear vertical grain western red cedar for less money than ipe will cost you. And WRC is a nice outdoors wood. It deals with weather quite well. True, it is softer than ipe, but this is a gate you're building, not a deck; the softness will not be a problem.

Where I would use cladding is in the gate posts. If you look at old gates, usually a big problem is that the post on the hinge side is sagging. I'd use pressure-treated 4x4 (or more!) going a long way into concrete, and wrap it with cedar above ground. I wouldn't attempt to glue the cedar to the pressure-treat. I'd fasten it with bronze screws. Bronze weathers nicely to a color similar to the WRC. McFeelys sells bronze boat screws, and there are many other sources on the web.