Jointer noob

[johnny means]

The board you show in the photo doesn't tell a whole lot. On a perfectly tuned jointer with perfect technique, many boards would look like that after a single pass. The fact that it cut on both ends says to me that your jointer appears to be set up at least close to where it should be.

[johnny means]

Btw, on bowed boards you should be removing material from the middle if running smile side up, or both ends if running frown side down.

[john schnyderite]

It appears to be taking material from the right area, but with a lot of material coming off the front and minimal off the back, it seems like the board would be a wedge by the time 1 face is flat.

[Mark Hennebury]

Lower the outfeed table.

[john schnyderite]

I think I might have found the issue.

it appears the infeed table is lower than the cutterhead unless i bring the infeed very close to the outfeed table height. When I was setting the jointer up, I originally set it up higher, but the guard was rubbing on the outfeed table and the blades seemed to protrude from the cutterhead more than they should, so dropped it back down a bit.

As of right now, the knives are less than .001 higher than my cutterhead, so I'm afraid just adjusting the outfeed won't really solve my issue. Looks like I may need to adjust my blades to be higher again too.

Lower the outfeed table.

[johnny means]

The infeed table has to be lower than the cutterhead, that's how jointers work.

[Mark Hennebury]

I think I might have found the issue.

it appears the infeed table is lower than the cutterhead unless i bring the infeed very close to the outfeed table height. When I was setting the jointer up, I originally set it up higher, but the guard was rubbing on the outfeed table and the blades seemed to protrude from the cutterhead more than they should, so dropped it back down a bit.

As of right now, the knives are less than .001 higher than my cutterhead, so I'm afraid just adjusting the outfeed won't really solve my issue. Looks like I may need to adjust my blades to be higher again too.

There are thousands of shop manuals, pictures, video tutorials of setting up a jointer.
You should probably take some time to do some studying so that you understand the machine and its basic setup, then if you are having problems ask for help, otherwise any advice wont be of any help to you.


drawing-inside-a-jointer[1].jpg

[David J Blackburn]

Late to the game maybe, but based on those pictures, nothing seems to be wrong. In the 4th picture, the board is resting flat on the jointer bed through the first 1/3 or so, then raised, then touching again only at the very back. That's the exact pattern you see it cutting at. I'd expect that after a few more passes (the raised part isn't that high off the bed), you'll get full length cuts.

[Carlos Alvarez]

I'd start with a very careful, obsessive machine adjustment. I do this on occasion, and the results are always excellent. The first time I *really* obsessively adjusted the jointer, the results were pretty amazing. Find some perfect engineer's squares, a flashlight, some feeler gauges, and use any of the online guides along with the owner's manual to achieve perfect alignment in every direction. I have all my tools tuned to within 1/256th in any direction, which "everyone" says isn't necessary yet the results speak for themselves.

[Bill Space]

Lower the outfeed table.

Several people have recommended that the OP’s outfeed table be lowered. Not a simple task on a parallelogram jointer. Four corners need to be adjusted exactly the same amount to keep the outfeed table in a plane parallel to where it started. This is a much simpler task on a jointer with dovetail ways, only one screw needs turned. The OP’s jointer is a parallelogram jointer.

EDIT: MY ERROR. The exit table can indeed be lowered simply on the parallelogram jointer. Been out of the country and away from my shop for month...have to go back and relearn my machines I guess...

A tilted infeed table can also cause tapered results.

In in my view, adjustments need to be referenced to something. Of course it may be possible to misadjust one thing to compensate for another misadjustment, and end up with results you find satisfactory.

In my case, with my parallelogram jointer, I have concluded I need to set the outfeed table at the height of the cutting knives, so it is at the same height as the knives at both edges. Then the outfeed table/knife edge combination becomes the reference to which other adjustments are made and measured. The relationship between the outfeed table and the knives is Locked in place. Other things are set with respect to the outfeed table/knives. Measurements are referenced back to them.

Since the cutting edges of the knives are in the same plane as the outfeed table, the output table alone can serve as the reference point for settings/measurements.

At at the end of the day, with a parrallogram jointer, the infeed table should be adjusted to be coplaner with the outfeed table(after the outfield table is positioned properly with respect to the knives). Once this is accomplished one can move on to technique, which may be as important to jointer results as machine set up.

Another’s experience/opinion for what it is worth...

[glenn bradley]

My first thought was that the board was longer than the beds and you were seeing the result of poor support. The pics clarified that to not be the case. Thanks for posting them.

Several people have recommended that the OP’s outfeed table be lowered. Not a simple task on a parallelogram jointer. Four corners need to be adjusted exactly the same amount to keep the outfeed table in a plane parallel to where it started. This is a much simpler task on a jointer with dovetail ways, only one screw needs turned. The OP’s jointer is a parallelogram jointer.

My p-bed machine just has a lever for the outfeed table height adjustment. I would be surprised to find one that didn't but, it sounds like they're out there. Probably just my limited exposure. Changing the height via the bed leveling cams would indeed be a pain and I would advise against it. IMHO, Derek was correct when he warned to move to table alignment adjustments only when you have exhausted all other possibilities. Forums have plenty of example of folks who made themselves a ton of work by diving right in to table alignment as the fix for their jointer issues. There are definitely times for that but generally, reported jointer issues are technique related.

The board in the pic looks normal to me for a few jointer passes on a bowed board being worked concave surface down. This is the recommended orientation for that irregularity in all the creditable jointer how-to's I've seen. Any irregular surface needs to be jointed until completely flat. There will be stock removal proportional to the deviation. On severely humped boards I will hand-plane the ends off a bit before jointing. Once you are better acquainted with the machine, starting in the middle where the board does not touch and shaving off each end a bit on the jointer is also a common technique.

[jack forsberg]

Several people have recommended that the OP’s outfeed table be lowered. Not a simple task on a parallelogram jointer. Four corners need to be adjusted exactly the same amount to keep the outfeed table in a plane parallel to where it started. This is a much simpler task on a jointer with dovetail ways, only one screw needs turned. The OP’s jointer is a parallelogram jointer.

A tilted infeed table can also cause tapered results.

In in my view, adjustments need to be referenced to something. Of course it may be possible to misadjust one thing to compensate for another misadjustment, and end up with results you find satisfactory.

In my case, with my parallelogram jointer, I have concluded I need to set the outfeed table at the height of the cutting knives, so it is at the same height as the knives at both edges. Then the outfeed table/knife edge combination becomes the reference to which other adjustments are made and measured. The relationship between the outfeed table and the knives is Locked in place. Other things are set with respect to the outfeed table/knives. Measurements are referenced back to them.

Since the cutting edges of the knives are in the same plane as the outfeed table, the output table alone can serve as the reference point for settings/measurements.

At at the end of the day, with a parrallogram jointer, the infeed table should be adjusted to be coplaner with the outfeed table(after the outfield table is positioned properly with respect to the knives). Once this is accomplished one can move on to technique, which may be as important to jointer results as machine set up.

Another’s experience/opinion for what it is worth...

Not to beat a dead horse but the outfeed table should be lower than the cutting Circle of the knives by the amount of the scallops ( knife marks ) it makes while cutting . This is simply because it isn’t the depth of the cut in the Marks that rides and reference the out feed table it is the peak of the scallops knife marks made by the cutter block. Generally .0015” lower . This should always be the first thing try a this is the most common remedy to this problem or as a technique to induce a spring joint. you’ll have to forgive me but I do not understand why you cannot adjust the height on a parallelogram jointer. It’s mechanism is parallel.

[Matthew Hills]

I ran a smaller board though which had a bow. I ran it 'frown'-wise. Here are some photos of the result after 3-4 small passes. I focused pressure only on outfeed side while running though. It seems to take more material on the side that is run through first.

is your board deforming under your pressure? (place it on a bench and push on it and see if the frown goes away) This could explain why the tail is not cutting normally.

I sometimes find it useful to do the opposite -- use modest pressure and focus the cutting in just the regions where I know the board is high (e.g., at the front or back). At this point, you may want to do more of that on the back side until the board sits pretty flat on your bench. Once the board has better support, you can switch to the pressure-on-outfeed technique that uses the outfeed reference surface.

(ps--twist is much more annoying and really requires some practice to work through... or a handy burn pile)

Matt

[Bill Space]

Jack,

I went back and edited my post to correct for the misstatement I made about the height adjustability of the exit table on a parallelogram jointer. It is indeed easily adjustable.

Your comment on the need to account for the depth of the scallops the knives make is enlightening. I do not recall seeing that mentioned previously and it makes complete sense. This is the first time I have seen a concrete reason given for lowering the exit table below the apex of the cutters (which I have seen recommended many times in many threads).

Thanks for the insight!

Bill

[john schnyderite]

Thanks so much for all the feedback. I ran that same board through a few more passes and there is now a bit of a belly in the middle it seems, as i can see plenty of light on either side of the board on the end opposite where I put pressure on the straight edge. This seems to be because more material is being taken off the leading edge of the board. nothing is being taken off the back now unless i put pressure on the infeed side when running through. There is definitely something wrong with my jointer setup.

I set the blades slightly higher than my outfeed table (less than .001 higher). I used a straight edge and feeler gauges to set the infeed table coplanar with the outfeed (though I have moved both the infeed and outfeed table up and down since setting that up, so maybe I should double check that it is still in line. At the time I'd estimate all 4 corners were within .001.

I'm losing hope that I'll ever get this thing running right =/ Is anyone located in NJ who wants to help a fellow woodworker out?