Phone Spammers

[Mel Fulks]

Some time back I heard a political campaign manager on TV talking about robo calls. His guy was in a tight race and he wanted to use phone calls. But the only time left to buy was in the middle of the night. So he bought the time to run messages for the OPPONENT. And his guy won.

[Carlos Alvarez]

Some time back I heard a political campaign manager on TV talking about robo calls. His guy was in a tight race and he wanted to use phone calls. But the only time left to buy was in the middle of the night. So he bought the time to run messages for the OPPONENT. And his guy won.

Well the one I'm aware of had to do with a bill, not a campaign, and the late calls were the result of a bug. Nobody actually sells dialer time in the middle of the night, it's not productive. And unless a politician is contracting a shady company in another country, nobody is going to run his calls outside of legal hours. Calling from the US would get it just down quickly (and I've had a number of them shut down by contacting the carriers in my network).

If that did happen, someone should be seeing some criminal charges. It's easy to hide outside the US, but not within the US.

[Carlos Alvarez]

I understand that they set up office outside the USA so the do not call fines can not be enforced. I wonder how us relations are with Nigeria and its multiple dead princes? I believe it's national flag has black in it for all the funerals of rich folks with no wills who are dieing all the time over there.
Bill D.

Other countries don't care much about our do not call list, but they do help do raids on scammers. Call centers full of Indians and Pakistanis have been led out of them in handcuffs in joint US and local operations. There are a bunch of scams in other countries, but most seem to originate there. The Nigerian scams tend more towards e-mail scams.


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[Mel Fulks]

He was an old guy and he did not say how far back that election was. There are stories more outrageous that have been proven by prosecution.

[Curt Harms]

We use NoMoRobo also and it's great. It may not get all the spam calls, but it gets a lot. Highly recommended if you use VOIP.

With NoMoRobo, your phone rings once because the caller ID comes between the first and second ring - so NoMoRobo can't see who is calling until after the first ring. We've just become accustomed to waiting to see if the phone rings twice.

Mike

NoMoRobo is an absolute godsend during political seasons. They are offering a service for cell phones for a modest fee, I think it's $1.99/month. It does require simultaneous ring so doesn't work on POTS AFAIK.

[Mike Gresham]

With NoMoRobo, your phone rings once because the caller ID comes between the first and second ring - so NoMoRobo can't see who is calling until after the first ring. We've just become accustomed to waiting to see if the phone rings twice.

Mike

Panasonic and probably others have an option on some models to mute the first ring. Works for me.

[Al Launier]

What a great thread. I was totally unaware of NoMoRobo until now, so I googled it and received an email which then led me online where I installed it . I tested it and I received a confirming callback, so I guess I now have it.

In the past I used the "Do Not Call" feature which turned out to be ineffective. I then stopped answering calls from unknowns, but my wife was to curious thinking we might miss a legitimate call. So, I then started using the "Call Block" feature on my phone, and although it worked it got to be a nuisance to go through the motions for each Robocall.

Hopefully this NoMORobo works as described. Now we have to discipline ourselves to wait for the second ring before answering the phone.

[Mike Henderson]

Panasonic and probably others have an option on some models to mute the first ring. Works for me.

Thanks for that tip. I have a Panasonic cordless phone and just set it to not do the first ring. Wonderful!

Mike

[Bill Jobe]

Maybe it's just too obviously impossible? It really is.

I think you're right, Carlos.

[Carlos Alvarez]

I think you're right, Carlos.

The phone network is built on a premise of interoperability and allowing everything to reach its destination. There are some motions to change that for specific customers who want it, but as a general rule, the FCC will never allow significant call blocking because it hampers the basic ability to absolutely know that every phone can reach every other. We are test-driving a solution for our customers where we look up a "scam score" when the call hits our network, and the customer sets the score threshold. Let's say they pick 4. Any calls with a 4+ then go directly to a screening system. That system could be simply going to voicemail, or could ask the caller a question and make them press a button, or other options. In one case it would go to a call center in Mexico to be pre-screened and then transferred back.

Consumers however have had it, so all these screening apps are hitting the market. Phone companies themselves may be prevented from blocking, but customers never will be.

[Jim Becker]

The biggest new challenge with robo/scam calls is the random spoofing of local numbers. Systems like NoMoRobo and others simply cannot catch those, so carriers and providers are going to have to get deeper into inspection to help combat those calls. When I get these on our home number, they are typically 215-79x-xxx which is our local CO's primary block but they do come up with "Out of Area" on the CID. What that tells me is that VZ or other carriers need to be part of the solution. I get the same issue with my wireless number...random spoofed numbers with the same area code and exchange as my number. Neither NoMoRobo or ATT Call Protect on my phone can identify them with authority as scam/spam calls, although the latter sometimes makes a good guess.

[Carlos Alvarez]

The biggest new challenge with robo/scam calls is the random spoofing of local numbers. Systems like NoMoRobo and others simply cannot catch those, so carriers and providers are going to have to get deeper into inspection to help combat those calls. When I get these on our home number, they are typically 215-79x-xxx which is our local CO's primary block but they do come up with "Out of Area" on the CID. What that tells me is that VZ or other carriers need to be part of the solution. I get the same issue with my wireless number...random spoofed numbers with the same area code and exchange as my number. Neither NoMoRobo or ATT Call Protect on my phone can identify them with authority as scam/spam calls, although the latter sometimes makes a good guess.

The challenge is that ALL numbers are "spoofed" in a sense. We set CLID and/or ANI on every single call during the call processing. There's no such thing as a native real CLID for any call that doesn't originate from a regular analog line. A SIP connection could be carrying calls for hundreds or thousands of handsets, each with their own CLID. We set rules on our own network, but there's no way for us to differentiate incoming calls that should or should not contain a certain ID. A customer can very legitimately call from even outside the country with a local CLID.

Example: We serve a medical billing company with nearly 1400 legit DIDs. The calls however could come from any of their locations inside or outside the US. Their call center in Cebu can also call using their client's CLID because the client said that's ok, and they want their branding and identity shown on the call. People are also more likely to answer than a call from a random number.

So when I say "impossible" I'm not saying so lightly, because there literally is no such thing as "real" versus "spoofed" CLID on a technical level.

[Steve Peterson]

The biggest new challenge with robo/scam calls is the random spoofing of local numbers. Systems like NoMoRobo and others simply cannot catch those, so carriers and providers are going to have to get deeper into inspection to help combat those calls. When I get these on our home number, they are typically 215-79x-xxx which is our local CO's primary block but they do come up with "Out of Area" on the CID. What that tells me is that VZ or other carriers need to be part of the solution. I get the same issue with my wireless number...random spoofed numbers with the same area code and exchange as my number. Neither NoMoRobo or ATT Call Protect on my phone can identify them with authority as scam/spam calls, although the latter sometimes makes a good guess.

My cell phone has been getting at least one call per week from numbers that match the area code and first 3 digits. Only the last 4 digits are different. They are always from slightly different numbers, so I am guessing that they are spoofed. I always thought that similar looking numbers might increase the odds of someone picking up because the person may think it is from a local caller. Or it is a way to get past NoMoRobo. I don't carry my phone, so I never pick up and there is never a message.

[Jim Becker]

The challenge is that ALL numbers are "spoofed" in a sense. .

The context I was using was that the spammers/scammers are providing CLID/ANI fraudulently (and somewhat randomly within an area code/exchange numbering perspective) rather than for the legal industry/business reasons you cite where it's added in software out of necessity. I'm intensely familiar with this given having spent the last couple of decades prior to recent retirement moving businesses and government entities from traditional PBXs to native SIP environments...with them kicking and screaming sometimes.

[Harold Balzonia]

I'm in the minority, for sure, but I generally don't ever talk on the phone anymore. I have maybe 5 people I talk with regularly but other than that, its all texts and emails. I NEVER answer the phone unless it's one of the "main 5" and I might get 2-3 voicemails a month out of the 200-300 calls I get. My phone ringer is always off and only set to vibrate. The sheer number of scam calls is crazy so I just quit using the phone as a phone. My iPhone is a camera, texting, email, and internet device for me.