Woodslicer 1/2" blade. I will never use a different blade. I bought a 3/4 also and never use it, because the 1/2 behaves like a 3/4 or 1" as far as stability and cut abilities. I haven't used another blade since I bought these.
Member
Woodslicer 1/2" blade. I will never use a different blade. I bought a 3/4 also and never use it, because the 1/2 behaves like a 3/4 or 1" as far as stability and cut abilities. I haven't used another blade since I bought these.
Moderator
That's a good point. The tension is in psi, pounds per square inch, the cross sectional area of the blade, width x thickness. For that example for the two blades are 0.016 sq inches for a 1/2"x.032 blade; a 3/4"x.0250 would be about 0.019 sq inches for only 17% more force needed to tension. (if I punched the right number on the calculator)Originally Posted by Edwin Santos
The 3/4" blades I bought and tried on my 3/4" saw were not thin - I didn't even know that was an option at the time.
The Timberwolf blades (apparently called TPC now, formerly AS-S) do look good from the ad. Have you tried them?
JKJ
Member
I have a 1950s Delta 14" bandsaw with a vintage 1hp motor. I use 3/8" 4 tpi and 3/16" 10 tpi blades on it, which seem to cover everything I need to do. You might get away with a 1/2" 3 tpi blade, but I wouldn't recommend anything wider than that. These saws can't properly tension wider blades. It also takes more energy to bend wider blades around the wheels, leaving less HP for cutting.
--Geoff
Contributor
Hello John,
Yes, I've tried them but it was some time ago. I think I spoke with the owner of Timberwolf and he promoted it as a veneering blade. It's a good blade, I still have it, but further to the thinner band point, I've moved to the Lenox Tri-Master 1/2" 3tpi .025 body which is a phenomenal blade. I also use a variety of carbon steel blades, but always stay with .025 thickness. There's a school of thought that wider blade = more beam strength therefore better. I've been happy enough with the results of 1/2" and 3/8" blades, I'm not sure why I need more beam strength for my particular situation. I tend to think at a certain point, in order to get the additional benefit from a wider blade, you need to also have a more powerful saw like some of the users here who have big 5hp and larger bandsaws that were designed to be able to handle light industrial resawing.
I feel the same way about the tension argument that more is better. I think it is better in certain situations and not better in others. Anyway I went off topic with one man's opinions.
FYI, Iturra's catalog shows some thin body/thin kerf carbon steel blades from Starrett that might be worth a look. I'm not sure on the sizes but maybe they offer a thinner body 3/4" blade.
Edwin
Moderator
Yikes, when I checked some sellers the bland for mine would be close to or over $200! I've never bought a carbide-tipped bandsaw blade. Do you have a favorite blade supplier?
Contributor
John,
I purchased mine from Louis Iturra (Iturra Designs) in FLA. Listen, the Tri-Master is a luxury item, and I hesitate to tell anyone they absolutely have to have it. The argument in favor is the fine finish and the long life, especially if you find yourself cutting abrasive exotics. My last one gave me over 10 years. An intermediate step that would get you partway toward the features of a carbide band at a much lower price would be the bi-metal Lenox Diemaster 2 which does come in a 1/2" 4tpi .025 body. I think it would probably run you $40 or so. But listen, I'm a big fan of good old carbon steel blades, either Lenox or Starrett Flexback. The most important thing to me is the quality of welds from the distributor. I've had terrible luck with local sources so I pay the shipping and buy them from Iturra because he seems to take care with the welds.
Edwin
Moderator
Excellent! I might check with Louis - I've bought a lot from him over the years and I've been wanting to try a carbide blade. (I bought my Starrett bandsaw tension gauge from him.) I'm fortunate to have a local industrial gas and welding supply shop in Knoxville (Holston Gas) that also makes bandsaw blades and at a good price, sometimes while you wait. They use Lenox stock and I have never had a problem with the welds.
Mitchel, do you have a bandsaw blade supplier near you? If so, that might be a good way to try a few different blades to see what works best on your saw.
JKJ
Member
Just to clarify, I think both Edwin and JKJ are running saws larger than 14"??
I ask because the OP is running a 14" Delta, which I think would have trouble tensioning a carbide blade. I've tried both Diemaster and Trimaster 1/2" blades in my 14" Rikon (which I believe is a stiffer/stronger saw than the Delta), and it was little more than an expensive experiment.
Moderator
That's a good point to clarify. I have a 14" Delta with a riser block for which I would never buy a carbide blade. The saw I use the most is an 18" Rikon, nothing like the "big iron" of course, but much beefier than the delta. (If the 14" Rikon is made along the lines of the 18" it's probably a pretty good saw. From the ads it looks like most of today's saws are using a similar frame design.)
Just curious, do carbide blades inherently require a higher tension than carbon steel or bimetallic blades of the same size?
If so, I might not even want one for the 18" saw. What I don't usually see discussed is how much force is actually needed to properly tension even a 1/2" blade, according to the gauge. Even the large tensioning wheel is hard to crank for this old guy! The 18" Rikon has a lever for quick detensioning and I'm not sure I could re-tension a larger blade easily. For larger blades that need even more force I worry about the other stresses on the saw such as the bearings and the tires, although the frame seems plenty stout. From what I've read on this forum and others over the years plus looking at other's bandsaws and even from checking my own wood and metal cutting bandsaws, I suspect a lot of people are running their saws with a much lower tension than recommended. Fine if it works but something to consider if there are any problems. Most of the problems I had with my own bandsaws (tracking, bowing, bogging down a smaller motor) went away with better tensioning (and alignment).
Member
I use 1/2" blades on my 14" Jet bandsaw.
Member
"Just curious, do carbide blades inherently require a higher tension than carbon steel or bimetallic blades of the same size?"
John, from what I've learned here and from my own experience, yes. I know that I read a lot more comments from people that love carbide blades on > 17" saws than I do from people with 14" saws, so they might work for you.
I truly enjoy my 14" Rikon, no complaints whatsoever, but I don't have a reliable way to tell you what amount of tension I put on the Trimaster blade. I do know that it was considerably more than what I use on my Woodslicer (KerfMaster, same-same) 1/2" blade. There was more tension, in both the saw and me, than I was comfortable with. The tension also resulted in more difficulty in adjusting the tracking, which only put me more on edge.
Bottom line, for me, was that the carbide didn't give me a cleaner cut and it was noisier and less smooth running. I still have the (like new) 111" blade, if anyone is interested I'd sell it for a reasonable price. With shipping, I paid around $150. Like I said, an expensive experiment.
Contributor
That's a good point Nick. I think we might have drifted off topic a little and I don't own a 14" Delta so I can't speak from experience with that particular venerable saw. Mine is an Italian 16" saw called Meber. But I do feel Louis Iturra has a lot of expertise with the Delta 14" class if for no other reason than the sheer amount of information in his catalog surrounding the 14" Delta/Jet/Powermatic class of bandsaws, so he may be a good resource for the OP. Also, the sticky thread at the top of this sub-forum here on SMC is full of good information about bandsaw blades.
Regarding the tension needs of a carbide or bimetal blade versus carbon steel, we're on to a controversial subject. According to Lenox, yes, the Tri-Master requires a high tension level, I think 20,000 or 25,000 psi which I know exceeds the tensioning capability of a Delta 14" type saw. Some people go in for the high tension aftermarket springs that Iturra sells in search of more tension capability but there are those who believe such springs put more tension on the saw frame than it was designed to handle, and I'm one of them. Others buy large heavy duty brute bandsaws in search of greater tension (and HP) under the doctrine that more tension is better.
It's not for me to say anyone is wrong, but personally I'm in the camp of using lower tension than others but making very sure my bandsaw is tuned well in terms of cutting parallel to the miter slot/fence, guides adjusted properly, and I get drift free results that are acceptable for the work I do. I've experienced the same thing as Nick where if my tension gets way high, it interferes with tracking action which leads me to believe I'm doing something counter-productive. So in answer to your question, I use the carbide Tri-Master but I do not tension as high as the mfg recommends, in fact I tension it the same as any other blade except I might kick it up a little if I were doing a taller resaw operation. So based on my practices, I would not rule out using one on the Delta 14" so long as it was the .025 body but others would never consider doing the same and the type of work you do would have to necessitate the expense IMO.
There's a lot of mystique around bandsaws.
Edwin
Last edited by Edwin Santos; 03-21-2018 at 10:55 AM.
Member
We're in agreement, Edwin. Like I said, I don't have a tension gauge (and the gauge on the saw is basically nonsense). What works for me is just adjusting out the flutter, then another quarter turn or so for good measure. When I did that with the carbide blade I was way beyond what I'm used to, but no way I'm gonna cut anything with the blade fluttering.
John's point about it being physically difficult for an "old man" to crank down that tension knob rings true for me. I even went so far as making a wooden "cheater" knob to help get a grip on it, until I found that that's really not a good idea.
Moderator
Did you notice the post on using a digital caliper to accurately measure tension on a blade? (described by John TenEyck)
https://sawmillcreek.org/showthread....44#post2792344
and the original:
https://sawmillcreek.org/showthread....33#post2640833
This method is free if you have a caliper, some clamps, and a calculator. All the tension gauges do is measure the stretch of the steel.
JKJ
Member
Yup, I've seen the references to the caliper method before. After getting comfortable with using the flutter method, I just never felt the need to try it. I think that's part of the "mystery voodoo" part of the bandsaw - there was a point at which things just started to feel and sound right.
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