Hofman not the dovetail machine maker but the jointer planer slot mortiser company.

[Patrick Walsh]

Jeff

I live in natick just 20 min due west of Boston.

Our shop is 40 minutes west in stow.

I would also be inclined to put all my machines in our shop at work but I also like having a project going on at home.

Also from time to time when andvif the need dues arise and it does working from home is always a option.

I would love nothing more than to live in mothers vermont or Montana or way up in the Canadian Rockies but I fear making a living and a living wage doing what I love would not be a option.

[Martin Wasner]

My days of being creative and taking risks with with very expensive machinery or purchases I can barely afford and or have worked 70hrs a week for months or years to afford are over.

Either mitigate the risk, or enjoy the jointer you don't want. If you can tilt it and get it in the elevator, that's the easiest for sure I'm guessing. Just weld up a skid at the desired angle and bolt it down. If you're willing to spend another $12000 on a jointer over something like an SCM, then what's $500 to have a skid made? Lowering it on is just a matter of slinging it on and using a chainfall to lower one side.

Or pay a rigger to do it. Make it real clear, you scratch this bitch or do anything I disapprove of, you own it. Anything. Capisci?


I just don't see the point in blowing a big wad of cash on something that isn't what you want. Sure, it's nicer than the casadei but why do it half ass'd when you can do it full ass'd?

[Patrick Walsh]

That's one perspective and one I previously have shared 100%

I guess I should really look into how to get the longer machine into my shop.

Where there's a will there's a way right.

So what that means I would buy a 24" machine with 2000mm infeed and outfeed so that what 160" long or 13 plus feet.

That's a huge machine!

Hmm why do these decisions always seem so hard to make. The machine configured that way would probably cost about $30K also.

Not sure why I'm willing to spend $25 but not $30k.

$30 just feels like ton of money. I can talk myself into $25 being like buying a used truck or crappy new car. $30 starts to feel like wow..

Either mitigate the risk, or enjoy the jointer you don't want. If you can tilt it and get it in the elevator, that's the easiest for sure I'm guessing. Just weld up a skid at the desired angle and bolt it down. If you're willing to spend another $12000 on a jointer over something like an SCM, then what's $500 to have a skid made? Lowering it on is just a matter of slinging it on and using a chainfall to lower one side.

Or pay a rigger to do it. Make it real clear, you scratch this bitch or do anything I disapprove of, you own it. Anything. Capisci?


I just don't see the point in blowing a big wad of cash on something that isn't what you want. Sure, it's nicer than the casadei but why do it half ass'd when you can do it full ass'd?

[David Kumm]

the government is paying about 1/3 of it if that helps. Question is can you make extra income from the extra expense? Dave

[Kevin Jenness]

That was my question as well. Do you get any monetary compensation for stocking your employer's shop with your machinery?

I have done that gratis in the past on a small scale to introduce new methods, but I would not again, especially with the kind of investment you are talking about.

[Larry Edgerton]

That was my question as well. Do you get any monetary compensation for stocking your employer's shop with your machinery?

I have done that gratis in the past on a small scale to introduce new methods, but I would not again, especially with the kind of investment you are talking about.

Ditto.
From past experiences I have learned that my tools stay in my shop. I bought them so "I" could make a living.

[Patrick Walsh]

I can't get into it online but let's just say maybe and yes..

For instance today I'm doing a side project making four fixed louvered shutters 43.5x38 out of clear hard maple that will get shot with clear cv.

They gotta be done first thing Monday morning. I go to start processing the material and the jointer is cutting crazy snipe. After two hours of screwing around with the jointer and my patients now far gone the material could only be salvaged my running all four sides through the wide belt. All in all it wasted at least three hours of my time.

I know many shops make due with jury rigged tools and that that half the skill of being a good cabinet maker is knowing how to make crappy machines get good results.

I am a very patient man until I'm not and I don't like much when I get frustrated so I try to availed it at all cost even if It is is expenve. My patients and thus piece of mind is well worth the money spent on quality machines.

I do hear you guys though about bringing ones tools to work.

To date I have not been willing to even contribute even my own hand tools to the shop as I know what happens. My fearveith thatbis mostly them walking off or someone dropping my straight edge or using one of my good chisels to scrape glue.

You can't really walk off with a jointer and unless your a real idiot it would be hard to hurt one.

Maybe it's stupidnof me but it seems I'm gonna find out the hard way if so? Edgerton;2794066]Ditto.
From past experiences I have learned that my tools stay in my shop. I bought them so "I" could make a living.[/QUOTE]

[Andrew Joiner]

They gotta be done first thing Monday morning. I go to start processing the material and the jointer is cutting crazy snipe. After two hours of screwing around with the jointer and my patients now far gone the material could only be salvaged my running all four sides through the wide belt. All in all it wasted at least three hours of my time.

I was going to stay out of this because I know it's hard to slow down "tool lust". Especially fine German machine lust!
First why not start with a new post -- Our jointer is cutting crazy snipe, we need help-- ?
When you say" wasted at least three hours of my time" are you paid by the hour?
Go ahead call me a crazy old retired cabinet maker, but your confusing me. I'm guessing you may have a unique handshake contract with your boss that's working out right now, but things can change fast in business.

[peter gagliardi]

So, the martin at $25.5k, is $1275 a lineal cutting inch.
The hofmann at $30k, is $1250 a lineal cutting inch. It is 4" wider, and about 2 - 2 1/2' longer. 26 square feet of freshly planed cast iron.
Anybody who sells new machines like that should know a competent rigger. A competent rigger should have no problem putting said machine where you are asking for around $1000-1500.00, unless there are difficulties we can't see, or you didn't describe. Especially if you have a window large enough on an accessible side of the building. Said rigger would probably pocket close to $500.00 an hour for their time.
That said, any person competent in machine setup should with a minimum of tools and time be able to assess and probably adjust the current machine perfectly.
First and foremost would be to determine casting defects, such as non flat, or twisted tables, then on to bent or broken internal adjustment parts.
If the machine checks out, proper adjustment should be an hour or two.
Total for above shouldn't be more than $5-800 depending on the "port to port " time of the tech.
Far less if someone in the shop takes the initiative to learn the machines quirks.
Something to remember would be that, at some point in the future, even a new machine might need this attention.
Unless your current machine suffered some damage causing it's issue.

I am following this with much interest, and not trying to talk you out of a dream machine- because I would then probably call you to check it out when down your way.

While I would love to have your dream jointer, there is no way, short of winning a lottery, that I do not play that I would dump that kind of cha-ching on that simple of a machine.
No doubt that a machine of that caliber will be called upon to do some very fine work, but it will also see some of the most drudging and abusive work.
I would and could find a machine that could handle that for probably 10's of thousands less.
I would then, invest that savings on a very efficient shaper with tenoning table.
But....... I have no idea exactly what type of processes and work you do. What made sense for my typical workload may not for your's
I currently have a 3 toed 16" American jointer that I bought for $1200.00 . Some years after, I ground the worn tables flat for $200.00. Some years later still I retrofitted it with a Terminus 4 knife head for $2400.00
It was inconvenient, it took time, it is not as wide or long as a new Euro machine. But with fresh knives, I can produce the exact same level of work with the same exact input of labor units.
I do not have the luxury of 13' of table, and I do wish I did, but the job gets done.
Just some more info for further thought.
I love cool and new tools just as much, and maybe more than some other folks, but my value analysis like peoples opinions is just different.
I really dislike having to invest "troubleshooting, adjustment and repair" time, but some level of it is necessary in our line of work.

[Kevin Jenness]

I have to agree with Peter. Unless your current jointer has completely s--- the bed you should be able to adjust it to work properly- in fact you will have to for some indefinite period unless that Hoffman jointer is sitting in a warehouse on this side of the pond.

There's no way I would be putting a $30k machine in someone else's shop on my dime unless under lease and ironclad insurance. I'm pretty sure I could struggle along with the new SCMI jointer you say your boss is willing to buy. Best of luck.

[Larry Edgerton]

.
I am following this with much interest, and not trying to talk you out of a dream machine- because I would then probably call you to check it out when down your way.

While I would love to have your dream jointer, there is no way, short of winning a lottery, that I do not play that I would dump that kind of cha-ching on that simple of a machine.
No doubt that a machine of that caliber will be called upon to do some very fine work, but it will also see some of the most drudging and abusive work.
I would and could find a machine that could handle that for probably 10's of thousands less.
I would then, invest that savings on a very efficient shaper with tenoning table.
But....... I have no idea exactly what type of processes and work you do. What made sense for my typical workload may not for your's
I currently have a 3 toed 16" American jointer that I bought for $1200.00 . Some years after, I ground the worn tables flat for $200.00. Some years later still I retrofitted it with a Terminus 4 knife head for $2400.00
It was inconvenient, it took time, it is not as wide or long as a new Euro machine. But with fresh knives, I can produce the exact same level of work with the same exact input of labor units.
I do not have the luxury of 13' of table, and I do wish I did, but the job gets done.
Just some more info for further thought.
I love cool and new tools just as much, and maybe more than some other folks, but my value analysis like peoples opinions is just different.
I really dislike having to invest "troubleshooting, adjustment and repair" time, but some level of it is necessary in our line of work.

I was thinking along the same lines. I lust after the German candy just like everyone else, but I have an SCM jointer I bought used that has been right on the money since I first set it up. Sure sometimes I would like bigger/better but this one always gets the job done and there are better places for me to spend money, things that will speed up the process or just make it easier on my old bones. For example my planer has done more than any machine to smooth out the processes.

But if my wife ever wins the lottery like I told her to, my shop will be the best of the best, just so I can play, no more customers, Yahoo!

I give her one simple job to do, but Noooo..........

[Patrick Walsh]

I hear where you guys are going with this but I assure you this is a good decision for me and there is more to it that I can’t share out in the open.

I’m sure actually I know my boss is reading this thread. Not that there is anything to not say here I that I can’t say or have not said to him and visa versa.

I don’t expect that the machine will live in his shop for the rest of his days. To date my uncle has actually managed the building he rents in and at some point there is a good chance when space comes availible I rent space myself.

Or as suggested I build my dream shop when and if I move and the machine comes home with me. Or I move on and I drag the machine into my now shop. There are a million scenarios and I assure there is something motivating this decision and driving me to make such a decision and I assure you it’s not some hand shake deal or my boss twisting my arm. Actually probably just the opposite.

Anyway this thread has been fun and I hope continues to be fun. I like having something to dream about and work towards.

For a point of reference my intent is to purchase on high quality forever machine at a time that ultimately will become my dream shop that some sad sack will have to tend to when I’m long gone. My work is my fun and my fun is my work. I don’t much worry about tomorrow even if I should. I kinda just do what makes me happy today and what I hope will make me happy tomorrow.

With that said the Martin with extended infeed table is abou as big a machine my home shop can handle so that will probably be the route I go unless Hofman will give me and the boss a deal we can’t pass up and my boss buys a planer.

I understand full well that anjointer is a joint is a jointer. I have Felder AD941 that was a nightmare on delivery and took two technicians like 6-7 visits and about 36hrs to setup. Don’t ask as I still don’t know. I know this it joints and planes a board dead nuts perfect everytime without even thinking about how your passing the workpiece over or under the tables.

So this is less about what I need and more about what I want..

[Darcy Warner]

Oh, I am pretty sure I could really mess up a new jointer.

I was suppose to use clean lumber? Oh whoops.

I am afraid I am missing what some snipe off a jointer will ruin? Parts are always batches out long.

Only time I get snipe on my jointer is when my 7 year old lowers the outfeed table when I am not looking, at that thing is 106 years old.

[Patrick Walsh]

Oh and ther is no grantee the boss purchases both a Scmi jointer and planer in this scenario.

I suppose there is a chance but I suspect i]he could only really afford one or the other and we need both. Hence I’m pushing for him to buy a machine and me to buy a machine and resolve our lumber processing issue.

With that said that is about as far as I want to go with the above commentary online. Anyone who would like to offer a oppinion or thoughts should feel free to personal message me. I dint say some much in attitudinal way but in a for the self preservation of all involved parties..

[Patrick Walsh]

The outfeed table on our currant machines lowers at will regardless of how the adjustment bolt and nut are tended to. Sure i oversize my material but depending on how much the machinenhas movere since last used the snipe might be .5-6’.

I dint know about you but I try not to oversize material much more than a few inches at most on either end.

We also pass a lot of long material on edge over the machine for ff material and depending on what that stupid bolt did since the last time we used Catherine machine you either get a fairly straight board or not even close.

We don’t have a slrs and I know that’s the machine for that job. The fact is we are not getting one as we don’t have the room.