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Thread: Water white finish that is quickest to apply?

  1. #1
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    Water white finish that is quickest to apply?

    I'd like to add some sort of protective layer to a sugar maple surface without it changing the white appearance. Is there anything like the wipe-on oils but is water white?

  2. #2
    Sure, most of the water based lacquers are "water white" (clear with no orange cast). If you want protection from wear, water, alcohol, etc. go with a pre-catalyzed lacquer finish. [Note: you have to spray these finishes.]

    But maple will yellow, no matter what finish you put on it. The wood yellows, not the finish. Around here, many people get maple kitchen cabinets - they look great when new. But over time, they go yellow. That's just what maple does.

    Mike
    Last edited by Mike Henderson; 03-18-2018 at 3:47 PM.
    Go into the world and do well. But more importantly, go into the world and do good.

  3. #3
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    I wonder, does it turn yellow due to external (UV, moisture, etc.) or due to internal chemical reactions? I would think it would have to be an external cause because removing the most outer yellowed layer will reveal white wood underneath, right? It seems like sealing the wood with something that has great UV protection would all but prevent the yellowing if that's the case.

  4. #4
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    Four years ago I finished my hickory kitchen cabs with Pratt and Lambert #38 satin varnish diluted 50/50 with mineral spirits (these days I use naphtha). Wiped on 5 coats with a half blue shop towel, lightly block sanded 400 grit after #4 only, cabs are as smooth as a baby's skin and show no trace of yellowing. You wouldn't know they are varnished, no plastic look like poly. They feel and look the same as after I finish sanded the wood to 220. Have held up very well. Now my go-to finish.
    NOW you tell me...

  5. #5
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    P&L #38 uses a phenolic resin in its formula which tends to be a lot less "yellow" that other resins commonly used in oil based varnishes. It's a good choice for "reasonably non-yellow" if an oil based product is required. As has already been noted, many water borne finishes do not impart the warm, amber-ish color that oil based finishes provide, so they are a good choice for maintaining that "white" maple look. They are not great for "wipe on" technique, however, because they dry extremely quickly. Brushing, using a pad or spraying provides best results because of that very fast dry time.
    --

    The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...

  6. #6
    What are you trying to finish? If it's not a surface that requires superior durability, you can use a "platina" shellac. That can be wiped.

    However, if you really want protection, you can use several water-based "poly urethanes". I have used Endure Clear Poly. The problem is some of these like the ECP are designed to be sprayed .

    <unsolicited advice alert>: Consider making an investment in a low cost HVLP set up like the Rockler or Earlex systems. They both do well at spraying several waterbed products. WB finishes are also easy to clean up. The HVLP will take your finishing to a new level in terms of speed and quality.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Nick Shattuck View Post
    I wonder, does it turn yellow due to external (UV, moisture, etc.) or due to internal chemical reactions? I would think it would have to be an external cause because removing the most outer yellowed layer will reveal white wood underneath, right? It seems like sealing the wood with something that has great UV protection would all but prevent the yellowing if that's the case.
    I'm pretty sure the yellowing is from light. But I've never heard of any finish that will keep maple from going yellow. You might slow it down, but the maple will eventually yellow. Most maple kitchen cabinets around here are yellow after about a year.

    Mike
    Go into the world and do well. But more importantly, go into the world and do good.

  8. #8
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    I've never used it, but MinWax makes a waterborne wipe on Poly. https://www.amazon.com/Minwax-409160...d+wipe+on+poly

    John

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by John TenEyck View Post
    I've never used it, but MinWax makes a waterborne wipe on Poly. https://www.amazon.com/Minwax-409160...d+wipe+on+poly

    John
    I've used it - didn't like it.

    Here in CA we can't normally get any finish except water borne so I tried that water based wipe on. That was years ago so they may have improved it.

    I think I still have that container in a drawer. May not be any good any more. The oil based would harden in storage.

    Mike
    Go into the world and do well. But more importantly, go into the world and do good.

  10. #10
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    This might be worth a try. The UV component should slowdown the yellowing especially inside. I've used a lot of target products over the years with no failures and great results. No connection to the company.

    https://www.targetcoatings.com/produ...nate-urethane/

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by John Kee View Post
    This might be worth a try. The UV component should slowdown the yellowing especially inside. I've used a lot of target products over the years with no failures and great results. No connection to the company.

    https://www.targetcoatings.com/produ...nate-urethane/
    I tried it on an exterior door. Thought it would be the perfect product. It was contaminated with all kinds of agglomerates, and bridged around the white oak pores. TC refunded my money. I was using the satin sheen and I've since read that the low sheen TC products can have problems. Don't know if that's true or not, but the EM-9300 satin was a disaster for me. Too bad, because otherwise the product looked like a winner.

    SW's Kem Aqua Plus and GF's High Performance Poly both have good UV packages. The HP Poly goes on great with a brush or spray. I've used it on cherry and have seen no color change in 5+ years. The Kem Aqua Plus is a biz to spray unless you add some Extender, but great with it.

    John

  12. #12
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    Thanks for the suggestions!

  13. #13
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    John T how long ago did you try the EM9300? I haven't used any Target or General finishes in about 2 years now. I had some real issues with General Opaque Topcoat that had a terrible dry time and would stick and peel like house paint. Got the brush off from the supplier so he got the royal salute. Got to the point on this side of the border where you have to mortgage the business to buy a couple of gallons. The only problem I had was around 2011 with a batch of Target EM2000 satin, it was fisheyeing like nothing I had seen, called Jeff and he sent new product to me in short order. Turns out they changed resin suppliers and things just didn't work the same with the initial batch. On a side note just starting to test some Fuhr WB, looks real promising.

  14. #14
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    John, I used the EM-9300 in Nov. last year, so not very long ago. That was my first and only experience with TC so far. I have a gallon of EM-6000 (satin, uh oh) to try sometime but haven't worked up the courage yet. Jeff was very quick to respond to my problem, too, but I'd rather not have problems. I've never had a problem with GF's products and I've used dozens and dozens of gallons of their products over the past 10 years or so. But your comment proves I've just been lucky I guess. FWIW, Enduro Clear Poly is my favorite all around spray product. You are right about GF's products being expensive; fortunately, I am able to buy them through a pro friend of mine at a pretty good discount.

    Let us know how you like the Fuhr WB.

    John

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